Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XXXIV

[BBKers]

So Webster is Zuccs brother? Makes him Zucc II. The passion is vilified

 

[BBKers]

Here’s a thought. Prior to the trade deadline I was told the Rangers were talking to Vegas about something (what exactly my contact didn’t know) This offseason, Vegas will probably be looking for a place to park David Clarkson’s dead contract as well as the possibility of moving a defenseman (Colin Miller?) to make room for a couple of their rising prospects. There may be a chance to do some business here.

Kind of late to getting around to the recent 31 thoughts podcast but they went in depth on the Dubas-Babcock conflict over roster building. Babcock wants more players that are tough to play against, grind mentality, competitors. Dubas maybe went too far on the skill end.

It's nothing new, but I really want Gorton to target Nylander. Kreider and Smith for Nylander and Horton. Kreider checks boxes for both the coach and gm, speed skill, compete. Smith is a Babcock guy, gritty. Would be better if he was a right shooting RHD which is a Babcock obsession.

Horton clears the summer cap because Marner isn't taking a discount, helping the franchise or settling for a penny less than Matthews.

If retaining on Smith gets it done, I'm all aboard.

Nylander, Buchnevich, and Kravtsov in the pipeline, makes Panarin unnecessary on the right. Use the cap for stop gaps and smart trades on d.

Remedy
Willy Nylander, Nathan Horton and a conditional 2020 pick (3rd => becomes 1st If he resigns) for Chris Kreider, Brendan Smith (50% retention) and Julius Bergman.

Colin Miller for Kevin Shattenkirk (50% retained) and a 3rd rounder (NYR) in 2020. If Vegas adds Clarkssons contract, skip the 3rd rounder.

Ryan Callahan and Alexander Volkov (Or Eric Cernak+) for Bo Nieves and a 2020 7th.

Jacob Trouba for Brady Skjei and Neil Pionk

Jimmy Vesey and Ryan Gropp for Zach Kassian and Ethan Bear/Ryan McLeod

Play Ball

Nylander - Zib - Kakko or another top 2019 pick
Names (traded at TDL and replaced by Kravtsov) - Chytil - Buch
Lemieux - Howden - Strome
Kassian/Callahan - Andersson - Fast

Hajek - Trouba
Staal - ADA
Rykov/Claesson/Lindgren - Miller

Hank
Georgiev/Shesty

 

[pld459666]

Kreider at 8 years x $7 M? Or Panarin at 7 years x 10,5 M + a first rounder, a very good prospect (and likely add a conditional pick upon resigning) or a blue chipper (Nylander)? The 2nd option seems quite superior (at least on paper) albeit costing $3,5 M/more per annum, but I would like to see us avoid both Panarin and EK this off-season. I would trade Kreider if the right deal comes around, if not, then more hesitant.

3.5 more in dollars

3.5 more in production

CK is a consistent 45-50 point player

Panarin is a consistent 75-80 point player

I'll take the legit star and 1st line winger plus the assets over the guy who is an inconsistent low end 1st line winger

I like CK, and in a perfect world I'd keep him AND Panarin, I think you have the makings of great wing depth if they are your guys, but if given the choice of the inferior player alone, or the superior player and assets and the cost is 3.5.

Count me in on the latter

 

[SA16]

Brendan Smith is a good player. At forward and defense.

 

[RGY]

Kreider banged up again. I would like to see what the numbers are over the long term deal. Could they get a hometown discount? He has spent his whole career here. We will see what happens.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

There is no good argument for Panarin.

Kreider should be kept if is willing to take 6x6 or 7x5.

Any more than that? Thanks for your service Chris.

 

[Off Sides]

I like the Nylander and Colin Miller ideas way more than the Panarin/expensive UFA ideas.

Nylander has a good contract going forward, not sure why the Leafs move him, they could probably trade Kadri, maybe pay someone enough to take Zaitsev and start putting itching powder on Marleau's equipment.

 

[SA16]

Keeping Kreider would be a far worse mistake than signing Panarin.

 

[RGY]

Keeping Kreider would be a far worse mistake than signing Panarin.

Thats your opinion.

Also there being no good argument to sign Panarin is also just one’s opinion.

Arguments can be made for both being part of the future.

 

[SA16]

Thats your opinion.

Also there being no good argument to sign Panarin is also just one’s opinion.

Arguments can be made for both being part of the future.

Ok forget about Panarin.

Keeping Kreider *at all* at the expense of a first round pick + prospect(s) they would get for him would be a mistake.

 

[LORDE]

Have been out of the loop skiing in Utah but shouldn’t the hope be that the NYR model of the rebuild is what everyone is talking about in a few years time?

WPG, BOS, Tampa????

Let’s make the new blueprint!

 

[True Blue]

Id actually be mildly surprised if he gets offered a huge deal. I think he signs 9x5 or 8x6. Something like that.

I do not see anyway that he gets less than 7 years, $11m

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Have been out of the loop skiing in Utah but shouldn’t the hope be that the NYR model of the rebuild is what everyone is talking about in a few years time?

WPG, BOS, Tampa????

Let’s make the new blueprint!

The only thing that would be “new” would be building around UFA’s, at least in the cap era.

We both agree that isn’t the way to go.

 

[Ola]

Not interested in helping Toronto’s cap situation by taking Horton so they can sign Marner.

Nylander has been pretty bad since coming back. Thats not good value from the Rangers side. They could do better for Kreider imo

Yeah, I agree for sure. I saw one game that left me with a real WTF feeling regarding Nylander a few weeks ago, he did nothing good and plenty bad, and was used accordingly too. OTOH I saw another game not that long ago where he was much better.

I wonder how optimal Nyls off ice regime has been. Saw one pic with him on the beach where he looked like a real monster, he isn’t that tall and got a lot of meat packed on him. He is a bit stiff at times.

But who knows, maybe now is the time you should get him? The kid is darn skilled. RHS. Still very young. Toronto put so much pressure on him during the negotiations. He missed camp etc.

 

[Waivers]

Rangers aren’t trading any picks unless it’s to move up in the draft.

 

[Machinehead]

Rangers aren’t trading any picks unless it’s to move up in the draft.

Agreed. If we were to trade picks, it would have to be for a legit elite talent. Nylander is not that.

 

[True Blue]

There is no good argument for Panarin.

Kreider should be kept if is willing to take 6x6 or 7x5.

Any more than that? Thanks for your service Chris.

Krieder may well be 6.5 for 6

 

[Off Sides]

Nylander is not on a legit elite level cap hit past this season.

He has 5 more years at a ~6.9m cap hit, only one year where there is a clause where any trading team could decide not honor it.

Many here would be happy to give basically that to Kreider for 5- 6 years with more restrictive clauses.

 

[kovazub94]

We’ve lowered the expectations so low for Smith at this point, that him not making a complete fool of himself as a forward is something we’re willing to celebrate.

4LW rate is over $4m per?

 

[BBKers]

Krieder may well be 6.5 for 6

Kreider Will ask for money/term similiar to Evander Kane. Whether We like it or not

 

[RangerBoy]

It’s time to trade Kreider.

 

[Gardner McKay]

It’s time to trade Kreider.

What for?

 

[RangerBoy]

What for?

What for?

Are the Rangers re-signing him? Brooks wrote the Rangers aren’t allowing Kreider to play for them unsigned in his walk year. He will be signed to an extension or traded. You can say it’s Brooks being Brooks. The only other time he has made that statement was with McDonagh. He wrote a column in the summer of 2017 about the Rangers not allowing McDonagh to become a free agent in 2019. They would address his situation and they did at the 2018 trading deadline. The Rangers had already tried to trade him to Edmonton in 2016. Kreider’s name was our there at the trade deadline. The market was awful last month.

Are the Rangers giving Kreider the long term contract extension his agent will demand? They have traded everyone else in the same situation. Five to six years at $6.5M to $7M if not more. Maybe 7 years. It will be something in that ballpark.

Why would Kreider be any different?

 

[Gardner McKay]

What for?

Are the Rangers re-signing him? Brooks wrote the Rangers aren’t allowing Kreider to play for them unsigned in his walk year. He will be signed to an extension or traded. You can say it’s Brooks being Brooks. The only other time he has made that statement was with McDonagh. He wrote a column in the summer of 2017 about the Rangers not allowing McDonagh to become a free agent in 2019. They would address his situation and they did at the 2018 trading deadline. The Rangers had already tried to trade him to Edmonton in 2016.

Are the Rangers giving Kreider the long term contract extension his agent will demand? They have traded everyone else in the same situation. Five to six years at $6.5M to $7M if not more. Maybe 7 years. It will be something in that ballpark.

Why would Kreider be any different?

That is a whole lot of irrelevant speak right there. I was asking what are we getting in return.

 

[Machinehead]

What for?

Are the Rangers re-signing him? Brooks wrote the Rangers aren’t allowing Kreider to play for them unsigned in his walk year. He will be signed to an extension or traded. You can say it’s Brooks being Brooks. The only other time he has made that statement was with McDonagh. He wrote a column in the summer of 2017 about the Rangers not allowing McDonagh to become a free agent in 2019. They would address his situation and they did at the 2018 trading deadline. The Rangers had already tried to trade him to Edmonton in 2016.

Are the Rangers giving Kreider the long term contract extension his agent will demand? They have traded everyone else in the same situation. Five to six years at $6.5M to $7M if not more. Maybe 7 years. It will be something in that ballpark.

Why would Kreider be any different?

You could just answer the question. It's an option. It's on the table.