Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XXX

[Ola]

Trade Shesty

 

[McRanger92]

I’m not married to Chytil but it has to be much more than Gourde coming back for me to move him now. I might for Giroux though

 

[Vitto79]

I agree I don’t think Chytil is going to be here longterm.

Sadly he’s to me the obvious choice to move for an established player

 

[egelband]

Sadly he’s to me the obvious choice to move for an established player

I do think that Chytil has a good future in the league. But like Georgiev, it probably won’t be with the Rangers. Hoping we can get good value for both.

 

[haohmaru]

Trade Shesty

He's playing great but it really makes you appreciate how durable Lundqvist was over his career.

 

[RGY]

I’m not married to Chytil but it has to be much more than Gourde coming back for me to move him now. I might for Giroux though

Giroux is terrible.

 

[Ola]

He's playing great but it really makes you appreciate how durable Lundqvist was over his career.

Yeah, and I was only joking.

But the theory that you got a the best chance to win a cup with a cheap goalie is kind of fun. If Drury deals like Shesty for Newhook it does give us more potential, if someone like Geo could stand on his head for a while.

 

[rangers1314]

Sounds like they decided to cancel the practice for today and give the players another day off. Logical

 

[Crease]

They’ll probably have a morning skate before the game tomorrow, but likely no Igor before the next full practice.

 

[pld459666]

They should have given Strome 5x5 when they signed him before the last deal.

 

[Savant]

No rush to bring Igor back for me. Georgiev is in the zone right now and the games are spread out. Georgiev has a .944 save percentage since the Igor injury. Let Igor take his time.

 

[AlaBlueShirt]

Sounds like they decided to cancel the practice for today and give the players another day off. Logical

Imo this has something to do with what Gallant said in his postgame interview ”some of the guys not feeling so well”

 

[cheech70]

They should have given Strome 5x5 when they signed him before the last deal.

 

[duhmetreE]

As for the bolded, ideally, I would agree with you. This is a case, like the one with Kakko and Buchnevich, where the cap is making decisions for us. This year's team is too green to be a real threat in the postseason, and no matter what, we will lose some important pieces from this year's team this summer. I see the next couple years as the "learn how to play hockey in the playoffs" stage of the rebuild. The true window opens when Kreider and Trouba's clauses change. The cap should start going up in a more serious way by then. We will be able to move both of them with (ideally) in house options for replacement (Othmann and Schneider, and possibly swapping out Goodrow for Cuylle by then as well). And the team would then have a veteran core of Zib and Bread, a young core of Fox/Miller/Kakko/Laf (and maye guys like Chytil/Barron/Kravtsov). Young kids like Schneider, Cuylle, Othmann, maybe Berard, etc--AND money to spend. This year's team might fight their way through a round or two if we get vintage Panarin and Zib and Shesty stands on his head, but the real window--as legitimate threats to win the Cup--begins in 2024-25. If we don't make any panic moves and screw everything up before then.

Completely disagree.

There's a changing of the guard coming in a few years. The window is open now with the Vets leading the way. I don't comprehend how our 'window opens' when we get rid of our current top players for unexperienced and unproven youth. That sounds like a major risk

And I'm well aware that you have had issues with Chytil since pretty much forever. It shows in the somewhat dishonest way you spin certain things like this being his "5th season in the NHL." Those 9 games as an 18 year old? Really? You're counting that? Two Covid seasons, that were further shortened in his case because of injury? He's played the equivalent of two and a half NHL seasons, and he's about the age that most guys drafted where he was are just breaking into the league. This isn't a case of five "full" seasons, and he has shown improvement in several areas.

Aside from the slow start to this season (and look at the shooting % compared to his career numbers--this is a clear outlier. He's snakebit right now), he has improved on his production, faceoff percentage, and defense for each of the last three seasons. This is despite being in the NHL before he was ready (IMO), getting erratic use by an incompetent coach, and skating with a rotating cast of players. In the scant windows where he's played with established top six talent, he's played his best hockey. I'm saying that there is still a reasonable chance that, with more minutes and consistent linemates for pretty much the first time in his career, he can still develop into a very solid 2nd line center.

How did Kakko improve under the same circumstances?

Chytil is nearly the same player from when he first came into the league. It is not me that's being dishonest. Blind faith is not how you win. He's shown nothing to be a stable top6 option. Can that change? sure. He has not improved nearly enough, especially in the defensive side of things

I'm also saying that, beyond the fact that we simply can't afford him (assuming he even wants to come here or that Seattle would trade him at 50%), Gourde is a career .6 ppg guy turning 30 this month. We know what he is--a middling 2nd line center or an elite 3rd line center, who doesn't really seem to elevate his game in the playoffs to boot (his production drops by a third). Even not accounting for the cap concerns and the unrealistic notion that we could acquire him with salary retained for that cost, I'd rather roll the dice on Chytil's potential rather than go all in on a guy like Gourde.

Once again. I do not know where you're getting your math from. Chytil is making 2.3M. Gourde would be @ 2.55M for 4 seasons...

Let's say Chytil takes off as 2C next season... How much is he getting paid now? How do we afford it in 2023.. you said it yourself, there's no money. Your concerned for everyone but Chytil getting paid.... it's weird. NOW, if he flops on his face, we're wasting a year with no answers.

The whole premise is Gourde at 50%. A good defensive middle6 center. Whether it's Gourde, Horvat or Larkin. Gourde makes the most sense and fits our need longish term. Horvat and Larkin will have to be paid sooner rather than later

 

[duhmetreE]

Gourde is the exact type of player we need. IMO he'd also be a great fit with Panarin down the road.

Not saying he's available w/ retention, but I'd be the first in line if he was.

 

[Bruner4329]

The most integral pieces are definitely Panarin, Fox, Shesterkin and Zibanejad.

Kreider is pretty hot right now but once he cools down, he'll join a very clear secondary tier with Trouba, Strome, et al. I guess Trouba is also scorching right now but if he's even somewhere in between what he's been this year and what he was last year, he's definitely of secondary importance.

Do you put Zibs in that category as well? If not you should, There is not a more streakier player in our lineup. He can go 10 games doing zilch and then go on a 5 game spree where he notches 8-10 goals. This is his MO. For a number 1 center we need better. All you guys keep pointing on how the Kreider and Trouba contracts are albatrosses well I hate to tell you so is Zibs, especially if he continues being as streaky as this. Honestly that is why I believe we need an upgrade from Strome. Too much of the season Zibs is not playing as a number 1.

 

[Fitzy]

Zibanejad is a lot like Marian Gaborik was for us. Streaky. On fire some games, invisible for stretches in others.

He's still a first line player, he's just not an every game shower-upper. They exist.

 

[Overcast]

I don't understand how people are still trying to move Kreider and Trouba when they're playing well above their paygrades. Like what is everyone's plan after moving those two? Teams do need some veterans. It can't all just be hopes, dreams, rookies with high draft positions, and potential on every line. Is the expectation that we're instantly bringing in guys that have been definitively better at all times throughout their careers and will never be streaky?

 

[duhmetreE]

I don't understand how people are still trying to move Kreider and Trouba when they're playing well above their paygrades. Like what is everyone's plan after moving those two? Teams do need some veterans. It can't all just be hopes, dreams, rookies with high draft positions, and potential on every line. Is the expectation that we're instantly bringing in guys that have been definitively better at all times throughout their careers and will never be streaky?

I don't know if it's the younger posters here that keep pushing that narrative... but in any line of work... I don't care what the line of work is.. you are best served with experienced vets leading the way.

You're not setting yourself up for success otherwise. In 3 years, we can have a 'changing of the guard'.... with the hopes that the kids gain the experience in that time

 

[NYRFANMANI]

I don't understand how people are still trying to move Kreider and Trouba when they're playing well above their paygrades. Like what is everyone's plan after moving those two? Teams do need some veterans. It can't all just be hopes, dreams, rookies with high draft positions, and potential on every line. Is the expectation that we're instantly bringing in guys that have been definitively better at all times throughout their careers and will never be streaky?

I wouldn't understand it now, but when they didn't play up to the value of their contracts, people complain. Why they still do, maybe bias, certainly stubbornness.

Also Trouba is not playing well above his paygrade. It took three years for him to start playing up to it.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Gourde is the exact type of player we need. IMO he'd also be a great fit with Panarin down the road.

Not saying he's available w/ retention, but I'd be the first in line if he was.

I don't think hes available even with out retention.

But hes elite defensively, good offensively AND is a pain in the ass?

Yes please x3.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

I don't understand how people are still trying to move Kreider and Trouba when they're playing well above their paygrades. Like what is everyone's plan after moving those two? Teams do need some veterans. It can't all just be hopes, dreams, rookies with high draft positions, and potential on every line. Is the expectation that we're instantly bringing in guys that have been definitively better at all times throughout their careers and will never be streaky?

I don't get it either. They are both physical beasts having great seasons and are both leaders on and off the ice. Kreider is 30 and Trouba is 27 and they are earning their contracts. Maybe after the 22-23 season Trouba may have to be moved because Schneider is ready but that time is not now. I have also seen a few posts lamenting Panarin's contract. Some people just want to trade every vet, have no long term expensive contracts, have a team of 22yo's, and expect to be cup contenders. It doesn't work that way.

 

[Overcast]

I wouldn't understand it now, but when they didn't play up to the value of their contracts, people complain. Why they still do, maybe bias, certainly stubbornness.

Also Trouba is not playing well above his paygrade. It took three years for him to start playing up to it.

Trouba has settled in nicely under Gallant, as has most of the rest of the team, what do I care at this point that his first 2 years weren't worldbeater seasons? Kreider is possessed, should I be upset that he didn't score 30 goals in 2016-17? Trouba and most of the team has said without explicitly saying that Quinn stifled a lot of what the players wanted to do through his micromanagement and it made them think/play uncomfortably/unnaturally. Sure, "No excuses, they're professionals" but work environment can impact production. They are still human. Would this team look any different today had he played then the way he is now, or would there just have been less general complaining about his contract?


Trouba's imposing his will on the other team almost nightly in the here and now. On any given night he's one of the most influential defensemen not named Adam Fox. Too much looking in the rearview with a few guys on this team. Trouba, Kreider, Strome. They are doing it and people are writing it all off as a blip. Maybe ultimately it ends up being a blip, but I'm getting to a point where I'm too tired to get myself so invested in thinking about the grass being greener once we move out players X and Y and bring in player Z. I want to enjoy the hockey this team is playing this season.

 

[Avery16]

 

[bobbop]

The salary cap information coming out of the Governors meeting is important for future planning. It looks like $82.5MM is set for next year, $83.5MM the following year and then a return to normalcy (along with a big cap jump) in 2024-25.

For that Rangers that likely means a two-year bridge for Kaako and the likelihood of a one-year bridges for Lafreniere and Miller next year. With much bigger money available starting in 2024-25, contracts like Trouba and Kreider will become much less of a discussion point. This anticipated boost on cap dollars couldn't come at a better time for the Rangers.