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Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XXIV

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Rangers743 said:
Kreider's value may never be as high as it is rn. If the right offer is on the table they gotta take it
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Exactly. Plus you clear cap space. Of Names is out too, that's $8.5 in the clear provided salary isn't coming back.

You get more assets for the rebuild.
 
MyLoveIsBlue said:
Laine had a good November when he had a whopping 18 goals. Including 5 in one game.

The rest of the years he has totaled 7 goals. He does little for the Jets when he does not score.

October: 3 goals, 2 assists – 12 games
November: 18 goals, 1 assist – 12 games
December: 3 goals, 4 assists – 15 games
January (so far): 1 goal, 2 assists – 11 games
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Right. The big RFA talk during the nylander saga was how much guys like Laine would command. $10m+. Laine tabled it until the summer and it will cost him that $80m contract. He may bet on himself again with a bridge deal.

Can a cup contender afford to pay a wing $7m+ to prove himself for a huge payday, in the midst of paying everyone else including Connor? Meanwhile he isn't doing enough to keep a spot in the top 9.

So it comes down to this decision. Is it more important to get full value on Laine, because you won't get his scoring ability back in any deal, or to do what's best for your cup chances now while you are in the window. Like Amonte for Matteau.
 
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The Rangers have A LOT of players they need decisions on very soon. That includes Kreider. Scoring is up big time this year league wide. Don’t just look st the increase in stats by guys like Hayes and Kreider.

I’m hoping Gorton can get out in front of this deadline with at least one of the guys who will be UFA next year. Don’t just kick the cab until next deadline
 
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Here's what I think Kreider gets in a trade:

Younger Top 9 NHL player now.
Prospect.
1st./Prospect

EG:
SJ
Labanc
Grembel/Chemelevski/2021 1st.
 
We need some more quality than quantity. Not a fan of Mcd trade, Howden and Hajek aren't progressing well and appear to be depth players.
 
NYR Viper said:
Eh, there are other ways to insulate the kids. Artemi Panarin and Chris Kreider are the SAME AGE. People are fearful of giving a legitimately elite winger in Panarin a 7 year deal. Let's assume Kreider will be looking for 7 years (as he should be).

Panarin reaches UFA at 27 years old. So his next contract will take him to 34.
Let's assume that next contract is 7 years x $9.5m

Kreider reaches UFA at 28 years old. So his next contract will take him to 35.
Let's assume that next contract is 7 years x $7m per season

Would anyone consider trading Kreider and then signing Panarin? The insulation factor is still there for the 'kids'. Panarin's long term deal expires a year earlier than Kreider's. They both play the same position.

To COL:
Chris Kreider

To NYR:
COL 1st '19 + COL 1st '20 + Shane Bowers + Tyson Jost

So the net gain is:

Col 1st '19 + COl 1st '20 + Shane Bowers + Tyson Jost + Artemi Panarin @ $9.5m (contract runs out at age 34) for Chris Kreider @ $7m (contract runs out at 35)
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Kreider is not worth 4 1sts. Not even close.
 
QJL said:
Kreider is not worth 4 1sts. Not even close.
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If he were a rental this year what would a team pay? What about 2 years of being a rental plus the opportunity to re-sign him before he reaches UFA?

If he were a rental this year I’d be expecting something like:
1st + two good prospects. That’s COL 1st + Jost + Bowers. Jost has struggled
 
Rangers743 said:
Kreider's value may never be as high as it is rn. If the right offer is on the table they gotta take it
Click to expand...

That’s the key thing here with Kreider. I don’t see anyone saying “trade Kreider” for whatever.

If the value isn’t there then **** the **** off.

One would think that GM’s would be salivating at the thought of adding a guy like him though — especially if Gorton retains on his contract which he easily can.
 
NYR Viper said:
If he were a rental this year what would a team pay? What about 2 years of being a rental plus the opportunity to re-sign him before he reaches UFA?

If he were a rental this year I’d be expecting something like:
1st + two good prospects. That’s COL 1st + Jost + Bowers. Jost has struggled
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Jost has been just fine for a draft + 2 center in the NHL. He might go a little lower in a redraft. Still projecting as a solid two way middle 6 C.

Can you give me any all-time example of a winger who has never hit 30 goals or 60 points returning two 1sts and two 1st rounders under 21 who have proven near worthy of their selection?

Let’s look at the McDonagh trade where he had the same duration remaining with almost an identical contract to Kreider left.

Colorado is expected to pick around 20. The Tampa 1st was 28th.

If Tampa wins the cup this year (which I preeixt they will) we will get the 31st pick this year, likely a lower pick than Colorado’s next year.

Jost > Howden

Bowers > Hajek

Everything about the McDonagh deal was of lower value than the comparable in your example. McDonagh’s value was also higher than a Kreider’s.

In no way, shape, or form are we going to get that kind of return for Kreider.

I’d be ecstatic with two 1sts and a B level prospect like Meloche.

My ideal return would be 2019 1st + Timmins + Bowers. I think that’s possible and would be a home run.

What do I predict? Hayes for COL 2019 1st + Timmins.
 
Rangers743 said:
Close to the Mcdonagh deal. I know people still have gripes about it to this day but on paper that's a great deal for a rebuilding team
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Close as in more? Or less?

So, a 1st and 2 pretty good prospects (which are not their top prospects) a throw-in level roster player and a condition for another 1st?
 
Kreider needs to stay, if we are to entice UFA players to come here we have to have someone for them to play with.
 
QJL said:
Jost has been just fine for a draft + 2 center in the NHL. He might go a little lower in a redraft. Still projecting as a solid two way middle 6 C.

Can you give me any all-time example of a winger who has never hit 30 goals or 60 points returning two 1sts and two 1st rounders under 21 who have proven near worthy of their selection?

Let’s look at the McDonagh trade where he had the same duration remaining with almost an identical contract to Kreider left.

Colorado is expected to pick around 20. The Tampa 1st was 28th.

If Tampa wins the cup this year (which I preeixt they will) we will get the 31st pick this year, likely a lower pick than Colorado’s next year.

Jost > Howden

Bowers > Hajek

Everything about the McDonagh deal was of lower value than the comparable in your example. McDonagh’s value was also higher than a Kreider’s.

In no way, shape, or form are we going to get that kind of return for Kreider.

I’d be ecstatic with two 1sts and a B level prospect like Meloche.

My ideal return would be 2019 1st + Timmins + Bowers. I think that’s possible and would be a home run.

What do I predict? Hayes for COL 2019 1st + Timmins.
Click to expand...

Not that I think that the aforementioned Kreider to COL deal is fair value at all, but I don't think we got what we should have for McD. Felt like JG pulled the trigger on a lesser deal because the clock ran out.
 
From Kevin Dupont of the Boston Globe -
All attention on B’s and Panarin. More intriguing: can they pry homeboy Kreider — one year from UFA — away from NYR?
 
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Kupo said:
That’s the key thing here with Kreider. I don’t see anyone saying “trade Kreider” for whatever.

If the value isn’t there then **** the **** off.

One would think that GM’s would be salivating at the thought of adding a guy like him though — especially if Gorton retains on his contract which he easily can.
Click to expand...

You don’t? I see quite a few people who don’t seem concerned with the return.
 
KreiderBomb said:
Kreider needs to stay, if we are to entice UFA players to come here we have to have someone for them to play with.
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Meh, Edmonton had to pay Lucic $42m for the privilege of playing with McDavid and no one has followed suit since.

We overpay everyone to play here, whether contender or pretender, every year to play in "amazing" NYC.

Guys will go where they get their money. For every Tavares or Shattenkirk who follow their heart, there are 80 guys following the buck. Shattenkirk meanwhile took 2 less years to play here and JT took $1m or so less to play with Marner.

I don't think Kreider moves the needle one way or another for a free agent. And I'm a Kreider fan.
 
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Mikos87 said:
Here's what I think Kreider gets in a trade:

Younger Top 9 NHL player now.
Prospect.
1st./Prospect

EG:
SJ
Labanc
Grembel/Chemelevski/2021 1st.
Click to expand...
Did you mean Gambrell? All those 3 pieces at the end have completely different values
 
DutchShamrock said:
Meh, Edmonton had to pay Lucic $42m for the privilege of playing with McDavid and no one has followed suit since.

We overpay everyone to play here, whether contender or pretender, every year to play in "amazing" NYC.

Guys will go where they get their money. For every Tavares or Shattenkirk who follow their heart, there are 80 guys following the buck. Shattenkirk meanwhile took 2 less years to play here and JT took $1m or so less to play with Marner.

I don't think Kreider moves the needle one way or another for a free agent. And I'm a Kreider fan.
Click to expand...
Yeah, exactly why the Knicks lure all the best Free Agents despite them being terrible... oh wait
 
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