Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XXI

[NYR Viper]

I don't know much about Alex Nylander, yet that seems like a haul.

Is or could be basically 3 first rounders for Kreider one of which was taken at #8

Is that realistic?

I guess I think McD would have returned something like that more so than Kreider?

I'm not sure that's that much. Nylander hasn't been able to crack the Sabres. He's been good in the AHL, not great. The Buffalo 1st would probably be around 18-24 and the STL pick could be a 2020 pick. I would venture a guess that someone like Moulson would be coming back for cap relief a bit for the remainder of this season.

 

[Off Sides]

I see Panarin as a step toward another likely failed retool attempt.

Shattenkirk, Smith, Staal unless bought out are here and no better replacements seem to be on the cusp of the NHL.

They really don't know what is going to become of their goaltending.

I think it's better to fully unwind the last retool before trying to get into a new one.

 

[NYR Viper]

I see Panarin as a step toward another likely failed retool attempt.

Shattenkirk, Smith, Staal unless bought out are here and no better replacements seem to be on the cusp of the NHL.

They really don't know what is going to become of their goaltending.

I think it's better to fully unwind the last retool before trying to get into a new one.

So much depends on the end of this season. I truly believe Smith is tradeable. The Rangers will need to get creative and take cap back but it can be mitigated and the impact an be shortened.

If Shattenkirk finishes the year trending up, I could see a team taking on his two years as well. That would change the landscape considerably.

 

[Fireonk]

No interest in a package like that from Buffalo. If we are trading Kreider the main piece has to be better than that. He is someone you have to get quality instead of quantity for.

 

[Off Sides]

I'm not sure that's that much. Nylander hasn't been able to crack the Sabres. He's been good in the AHL, not great. The Buffalo 1st would probably be around 18-24 and the STL pick could be a 2020 pick. I would venture a guess that someone like Moulson would be coming back for cap relief a bit for the remainder of this season.

I hear you there. In which case is probably about what I'd expect back for Kreider.

Which is kind of sad, but I'd venture to guess that is more than what he would return next trade deadline.

Yet I'm not sure that is the "make me move him" stuff people would be happy with.

 

[Lion Hound]

Why would you put together a package to trade for a player who, when not playing with Connor McDavid, has performed worse than Kevin Hayes?

Very good point

 

[offdacrossbar]

moving CK for a package of an ahl player and a few picks is absolutely irresponsible management and insanity.

CK moving needs to bring back a major league nhl talent plus picks. period.

 

[thethirdhockeyman91]

I see Panarin as a step toward another likely failed retool attempt.

Shattenkirk, Smith, Staal unless bought out are here and no better replacements seem to be on the cusp of the NHL.

They really don't know what is going to become of their goaltending.

I think it's better to fully unwind the last retool before trying to get into a new one.

It's still a business, the Rangers need a franchise player to sell tickets to keep the fans happy. Plus, Panarin is still young enough that if the Rangers are able to fully rebuild in 3-5 years, Panarin will still be in his prime.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

It's still a business, the Rangers need a franchise player to sell tickets to keep the fans happy. Plus, Panarin is still young enough that if the Rangers are able to fully rebuild in 3-5 years, Panarin will still be in his prime.

They won’t have trouble selling tickets.

 

[thethirdhockeyman91]

They won’t have trouble selling tickets.

I am not sure about that, the Rangers have a good fanbase, but we are not montreal or toronto. If we absolutely stink for the next couple of years, I can see our attendance taking a hit.

 

[EpicDing]

I am not sure about that, the Rangers have a good fanbase, but we are not montreal or toronto. If we absolutely stink for the next couple of years, I can see our attendance taking a hit.

I mean personally I'll probably go to more games if we suck, tickets will be cheaper. I'll just pick an opponrnt I want to see. Rangers will never have attendance issues

 

[NYR Viper]

I am not sure about that, the Rangers have a good fanbase, but we are not montreal or toronto. If we absolutely stink for the next couple of years, I can see our attendance taking a hit.

I think if the team stinks they will still sell out, the place will just be empty in the lower bowl. Companies with season tickets will keep them but people won't go as often

 

[Off Sides]

So much depends on the end of this season. I truly believe Smith is tradeable. The Rangers will need to get creative and take cap back but it can be mitigated and the impact an be shortened.

If Shattenkirk finishes the year trending up, I could see a team taking on his two years as well. That would change the landscape considerably.

They both have clauses too.

Shattenkirk a 10 team and Smith a 16 (15 he picks to go to) team no trade. (if capfriendly is correct)

I'm not sure I see them as movable without vast improvement, even with retention and I'm not sure I see vast improvement.

 

[offdacrossbar]

It's still a business, the Rangers need a franchise player to sell tickets to keep the fans happy. Plus, Panarin is still young enough that if the Rangers are able to fully rebuild in 3-5 years, Panarin will still be in his prime.

panarin is 27

hell be 30 when we are ready to "contend".

just to be sure we understand.

13 is 27
93 is 26
20 is 27

how is panarin any different than those 3 again ?

signing panarin means hell be 30+ outside that window of end of rebuild/competing.

confused

 

[One Winged Angel]

Because he said that he wants to play in NY, means that he is signing his allegiance here?

I have head that from many athletes across many sports. Two things to consider:

1) He may be using NY to drive his value on the market up
2) The Rangers cannot afford him at $11m. And I cannot see him taking less dollars to play for a rebuilding team.

The only thing I’d say in regards to Panarin is that it doesn’t seem like it’s about the money or winning to him. It seems like it’s about playing where he’s most comfortable, where he could be around his people. I think the Rangers could offer that to him and that’s why it’s an appealing spot, considering NYC and Brighton Beach would feel closer to home and he’ll have Russian teammates in Buch, Kravtsov, Shesty and Rykov.

Can I say this for sure? Absolutely not, but it’s the vibe that I’m getting.

 

[Thirty One]

The only thing I’d say in regards to Panarin is that it doesn’t seem like it’s about the money or winning to him. It seems like it’s about playing where he’s most comfortable, where he could be around his people. I think the Rangers could offer that to him and that’s why it’s an appealing spot, considering NYC and Brighton Beach would feel closer to home and he’ll have Russian teammates in Buch, Kravtsov, Shesty and Rykov.

Can I say this for sure? Absolutely not, but it’s the vibe that I’m getting.

That's the sense many have gotten, he's looking for a city more than a team.

 

[Off Sides]

How do they contend in 3 years with this defense?

In 3 years the one most of hope becomes anything like a top pair, Miller, may be in his rookie or 2nd NHL season or not even in the NHL.

Are they going to wait until all Shattenkirk, Smith, Staal just leave and find 3 really good UFAs to take those spots cause we know how well UFA defenders work out?

Without fixing the D I just don't get the 3 year contention plan? And that does not even go into what Shestyorkin may or may not do.

This is more like a 6 year rebuild in which they started with the last three drafts, and the 2016 (Howden, Hajek etc ) and 2017 (Lias, Chytil) is looking a little more sketchy than it did last year and I would not be totally surprised to see the 2018 draft become a little more sketchy as this plays out too.

By the time that works itself out and those prospects have either failed or entered their primes Panarin will be 32-33 year old.

In which case the only play, to try to retool the team around Panarin. Again which means doing the same stuff they tried to do around Lundqvist with Nash, Gaborik, Richards and all that which led them to this point in the first place. In which case why are they not just extending Hayes, Kreider, Zucc and hoping for a resurgence out of Shattenkirk, Smith, etc?

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I am not sure about that, the Rangers have a good fanbase, but we are not montreal or toronto. If we absolutely stink for the next couple of years, I can see our attendance taking a hit.

Won't happen.

Didn't happen during the dark ages, won't happen now.

 

[True Blue]

He's not "signing his allegiance here." Rather, "there are rumblings that he has said he is interested."

Yup. He could be using it as a bargaining chip.
The Rangers can afford in the neighborhood of $10m.

It remains a possibility. It's no guarantee, but it's not outlandish.

How will they afford to sign Krieder, if they pay Panarin $10-$111? Where did Smith, Staal & Shattenkirk go? What about Henke's contract of for that matter Skej's?

IMO, it is pretty far fetched. Especially why a player like him would go to a team that is in full on rebuild mode?

 

[True Blue]

You gotta think a lot of teams would love to add Kreids. The question is can we get one of them to overpay?

See, and I think of it as paying fair value

 

[Edge]

How do they contend in 3 years with this defense?

In 3 years the one most of hope becomes anything like a top pair, Miller, may be in his rookie or 2nd NHL season or not even in the NHL.

Are they going to wait until all Shattenkirk, Smith, Staal just leave and find 3 really good UFAs to take those spots cause we know how well UFA defenders work out?

Without fixing the D I just don't get the 3 year contention plan? And that does not even go into what Shestyorkin may or may not do.

This is more like a 6 year rebuild in which they started with the last three drafts, and the 2016 (Howden, Hajek etc ) and 2017 (Lias, Chytil) is looking a little more sketchy than it did last year and I would not be totally surprised to see the 2018 draft become a little more sketchy as this plays out too.

By the time that works itself out and those prospects have either failed or entered their primes Panarin will be 32-33 year old.

In which case the only play, to try to retool the team around Panarin. Again which means doing the same stuff they tried to so around Lundqvist with Nash, Gaborik, Richards and all that which led them to this point in the first place. In which case why are they not just extending Hayes, Kreider, Zucc and hoping for a resurgence out of Shattenkirk, Smith, etc?

One of things we should probably distinguish is the difference between a team that could make the playoffs and is on the upswing, vs. a team that is a contender.

I feel like there's some blurred lines there --- with some people confusing the two concepts.

I think most people expecting this team to be a contender in three years are probably asking for a lot, but they should be a team on the upswing and a potential playoff team. A lot of that depends on multiple factors, not the least of which is what happens at the 2019 draft.

But a true contender, as in the window is wide open, is probably a bit further out than that.

 

[True Blue]

Yet I'm not sure that is the "make me move him" stuff people would be happy with.

It would not. And if that represents the best, then he has much more value to the Rangers in leading the team through and on the other side of the rebuild than in a trade If the other team does not cringe at what they are giving up for a player that could put them over the top, then they do not get to have him.

 

[LORDE]

I am not sure about that, the Rangers have a good fanbase, but we are not montreal or toronto. If we absolutely stink for the next couple of years, I can see our attendance taking a hit.

“The Dark Ages” as they are known around here say differently.

MSG may not be loud anymore but it’s sold (notice I didn’t say filled)

 

[TheBloodyNine]

I am not sure about that, the Rangers have a good fanbase, but we are not montreal or toronto. If we absolutely stink for the next couple of years, I can see our attendance taking a hit.

You’re right, we’re not Montreal or Toronto. We’re the most valuable franchise in the league. Any notion that the Rangers would have a problem selling tickets is ludicrous. That’s not a problem they ever have had or ever will have.

 

[True Blue]

How do they contend in 3 years with this defense?

I do not think that they will continue to try to get blood from a stone with the 3 Ss. You are also assuming that the likes of ADA, Pionk, Skej do not take steps forward and players like Lingren & Hajek do not make it.

Draft a Byram this year, and that changes the entire scope of the future defense. Yes, even in 3 years when him and Miller can patrol the left side for an entire game.