Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XX

[egelband]

The good news is all the guys who would appear to be ‘on the block’ are playing well and at high value. I guess Lias is probably on the block too and at low value but I kind of think they’ll hold him until he gets his stock on the upswing. (Assuming he can do).

 

[duhmetreE]

What's the point in spending assets on him? We're not winning the cup this year or next. He'll probably command the equivalent of a late 1st.

In any case Nashville would be dumb to invest in anything but goaltending, their on-ice play is very good and their core is locked up and decently young. Rinne is past it and Saros hasn't got it.

To be a vet presence, to help stabilize things at a small cap cost. To be a great checking line center and leader has value and is a massive hole on this squad. He could help a kid like Howden.

Yeah, I wouldn't want him at that price... That's why I said 'at a reasonable price'... A 1st rounder is not reasonable price for us

 

[egelband]

Gorton had tried to recruit Jim Monty but he went with a readier team in Dallas so we went with Quinn. Maybe after his few months of self admitted alcoholism recovery program, management might take another run at it as a replacement for a Quinn that as a teaching coach, may have expended all the tools in his tool box.

First of all, I’m not in the “Dump Quinn” camp, at all. But if the Rangers were looking for a new coach and Montgomery actually has an alcohol problem (is that true?) a six week program is not really a fix. If they truly want Montgomery as their coach it has to be way down the road. Like next year or the year after, even.

 

[Avery16]

How’s that Quinn’s issue? He plays who he got on the roster.

He also decides who he has on the roster. Nieves looked fine late last season. I would demote Haley and McKegg, and promote Nieves and Beleskey, especially since Lemieux is out. I trust Beleskey/Nieves/Fogarty or Beleskey/Nieves/Lettieri a lot more than Haley/McKegg/Smith. At some point we should give Kravstov a cup of coffee, and why we haven't done the same with Rykov while Hajek is out is beyond me. Not having Andersson as an option is some part Quinn's responsibility as well.

 

[Ghost of jas]

Depends. None of those guys would likely be pushing for spots right now, so it wouldn't really solve the problem for a while.

But I've always been of the belief its easier to turn value into value than it is to turn garbage into value.

So if we've able to identify talent and value, I'd rather trade from a position of abundance (like one of our young LD that progresses), then to try and draft a forward who isn't likely to serve in the role anyway, just because he's a forward.

I fully agree. However, I'm referring to the instances IMO the forward was highest value on the board and the Rangers went for the goalie or LD instead...Halverson over Kempe, Crawley in the 4th round in 2017 and Lindbolm over numerous options.

 

[egelband]

Or you can say: The team is not very good so they need to be buyers. Gorton has to my recollection stated several times that he will do what it takes to acquire the right players. So far we have seen: Draft (Kakko), Trade (Trouba), UFA (Panarin).

I don’t think they should be “buyers” in the headlong-rush-to-the-playoffs sense. But you’re right that if “their guy” becomes available they should definitely go get him. Just saying there are a couple ways to interpret the term “buyer”.

 

[Minmonster]

Dan Quinn and Anderson for Barry Trots. Rangers should have never let Trots take another job when his contract expired

 

[kovazub94]

He also decides who he has on the roster. Nieves looked fine late last season. I would demote Haley and McKegg, and promote Nieves and Beleskey, especially since Lemieux is out. I trust Beleskey/Nieves/Fogarty or Beleskey/Nieves/Smith a lot more than Haley/McKegg/Smith. At some point we should give Kravstov a cup of coffee, and why we haven't done the same with Rykov while Hajek is out is beyond me. Not having Andersson as an option is some part Quinn's responsibility as well.

When was the last time Beleskey saw any NHL time or what exceptional he’s done in the AHL? Nieves was here a few weeks ago and was way less than impressive. Fogs is here now and looks no better than a struggling Andersson. And I don’t want to rehash yet again why Haley and Smith find themselves in the lineup or why Rykov or Kravtsov are not here yet. Just ridiculous bias against Quinn where “reasons” to express personal dislike are being invented out of thin air.

 

[Avery16]

When was the last time Beleskey saw any NHL time or what exceptional he’s done in the AHL? Nieves was here a few weeks ago and was way less than impressive. Fogs is here now and looks no better than a struggling Andersson. And I don’t want to repeat yet again why Haley and Smith find themselves in the lineup or why Rykov or Kravtsov are not here yet. Just ridiculous bias against Quinn where “reasons” to express personal dislike are being invented out of thin air.

You could frame it if you were so motivated, as bias against Quinn. You can also frame it as Quinn's bias against certain players or certain types of players. I don't think either are necessarily true. I think he's a green NHL head coach who isn't doing so hot, isn't playing the best roster he can and exercising short-sighted judgment in time allocation. Thats not bias, that's just an assessment of his time here and how he is adjusting to adversity, which is not very well. You cant be an NHL head coach and escape assessment and criticism. Bias? absurd.

Also, Beleskey looked fine each time we've called him up. Theres no reason to not try again when someone like Smith or Haley is occupying a spot.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Your take is right except the “long for the last few years of AV...” part. Maybe it’s how you phrased it.

Not in terms of the performance, but the arguments. There was a case to be made then that he was mismanaging parts of the roster, even though it was rotting at an alarming rate.

Quinn doesn't have 12 NHL forwards. Period. He might not even have 9 currently. To hit him for not rolling 4 lines is south of a cheap shot, because at least a cheap shot has some thinking involved.

 

[haohmaru]

The choice between Haley, Beleskey, Smith, Nieves, & Fogarty is like choosing between a quarter, two dimes and a nickel, a dime and 3 nickels, or twenty five pennies.

There are bigger fish to fry here.

 

[Avery16]

Not in terms of the performance, but the arguments. There was a case to be made then that he was mismanaging parts of the roster, even though it was rotting at an alarming rate.

Quinn doesn't have 12 NHL forwards. Period. He might not even have 9 currently. To hit him for not rolling 4 lines is south of a cheap shot, because at least a cheap shot has some thinking involved.

I am not advocating that we should have done this, but don't you think that if Quinn felt he didnt have the roster he needed, he would have asked Gorton for Kovalchuk on a league minimum two way? Don't you think that if Quinn had asked, Gorton would have offered? Don't you think that if Gorton had offered, Kovalchuk would've come here instead? Quinn has a huge role in what this roster is. He makes the calls to Hartford. He has the ear of the GM. This is Quinn's roster too.

 

[haohmaru]

I am not advocating that we should have done this, but don't you think that if Quinn felt he didnt have the roster he needed, he would have asked Gorton for Kovalchuk on a league minimum two way? Don't you think that if Quinn had asked, Gorton would have offered? Don't you think that if Gorton had offered, Kovalchuk would've come here instead? Quinn has a huge role in what this roster is. He makes the calls to Hartford. He has the ear of the GM. This is Quinn's roster too.

Kovalchuk wanted to go to a contender. It doesn't matter if Quinn "wanted" him

(Edit) To add to this - the Canadians want to make the playoffs and have a ton of injuries and holes to fill. The Rangers (Kreider, Fast, possibly Strome) are likely sellers again. I realize they have similar records but I think they have different goals for the season.

 

[JimmyG89]

Would it be a good idea to see if one of ADA, Fox or Keane could play on the left side? Could give it a shot towards the end of the team when the games wont mean much.

Would allow for Skjei to be traded and Staal bought out.

ADA - Trouba
Lindgren - Fox
Hajek/Rykov - Keane

Don't disagree with moving a RHD to the left, but I'm not sure Keane is someone we should be penciling in for next season. He's been great in the AHL, but there is a lot to work on. He should spend most of next season in the AHL.

Yes, he's an all star as a rookie, but we currently have the option to let him stay down and continue to work, and in his present state, another year in the AHL is probably warranted. I'd revisit him in the NHL around this time next year.

 

[eco's bones]

So if they do deal Skjei doesn’t that leave LD super thin? Kinda think they have to get another LD back

I’m fine w 2 of Lindgren , Hajek , Rykov , Ruenanen next yr but 3?

Not worried about finding a vet LD replacement for Skjei if we're out of the playoff picture at the deadline. We have a lot of guys coming and I think Lindgren is looking really good. Hajek was doing okay and Rykov is very intriguing to me. I wouldn't undersell on Brady though. He's a good player. He should get a late 1st + a young roster player--more or less what Hayes brought back.

 

[Avery16]

Kovalchuk wanted to go to a contender. It doesn't matter if Quinn "wanted" him

uhh… Montreal is *behind* us in the standings. We all have wants.

 

[kovazub94]

The choice between Haley, Beleskey, Smith, Nieves, & Fogarty is like choosing between a quarter, two dimes and a nickel, a dime and 3 nickels, or twenty five pennies.

There are bigger fish to fry here.

And yet it’s Quinn’s at fault, amiright

 

[haohmaru]

uhh… Montreal is *behind* us in the standings. We all have wants.

Uhh.. read the edited post.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

I am not advocating that we should have done this, but don't you think that if Quinn felt he didnt have the roster he needed, he would have asked Gorton for Kovalchuk on a league minimum two way? Don't you think that if Quinn had asked, Gorton would have offered? Don't you think that if Gorton had offered, Kovalchuk would've come here instead? Quinn has a huge role in what this roster is. He makes the calls to Hartford. He has the ear of the GM. This is Quinn's roster too.

Just the thing this team needs. The corpse of a player who just quit on his previous team.

 

[ETTER DE]

I don’t think they should be “buyers” in the headlong-rush-to-the-playoffs sense. But you’re right that if “their guy” becomes available they should definitely go get him. Just saying there are a couple ways to interpret the term “buyer”.

Yes it was my mistake for not making it clear what I meant. I dont want them to use assets just for this playoff.

 

[eco's bones]

On the buyer--seller thing. The one thing we're not ready to do is buy. I don't think the Rangers are a playoff team this year but they do still have a chance but if they can't or it doesn't look they can do it with their current roster they should be a seller at least of Kreider. I could see keeping Kreider if they could go on a winning streak and put themselves in real contention. At the moment they're teasing but it's not really happening nearly enough.

 

[Avery16]

Uhh.. read the edited post.

Yes I'm sure that is what Kovalchuk was thinking when he decided that Montreal is a "contender".

 

[haohmaru]

Just the thing this team needs. The corpse of a player who just quit on his previous team.

And whose spot would he take? He's not a fourth line player. Who is sitting? Kakko? Chytil? Howden?

What sense does it make? It didn't make sense over the summer and it makes even less sense today.

 

[Avery16]

Just the thing this team needs. The corpse of a player who just quit on his previous team.

Did you not read the first ten words of the post you're replying to?

 

[haohmaru]

Yes I'm sure that is what Kovalchuk was thinking when he decided that Montreal is a "contender".

They have 6 forwards on IR and have essentially the same record as we do. I'm certain Kovalchuk thinks his role/contributions would be more significant on that team then on this one.

If you can't see why he fits better there then here then I don't know what else to say.