Speculation: Roster Building Thread : Part XV (Light em up!)

[effen]

The org doesn't both have no patience for kids AND hold on to them for too long instead of trading them early and getting value.

Weird narrative.

 

[NYRFAN218]

At least the NMC converts to a 15 team no trade list for the last 3 years of JT Miller's contract.

The NMC for basically the entirety of the Zibanejad contract is a killer. You make the Zibanejad for Miller trade for that alone.

Add in the fact you can actually buyout the contract with savings if need be later on too. I have no interest in Miller beyond this proposed swap but if it actually reached a point where it's Mika (and more if it's reasonable) for Miller then it's a no brainer. Do I see it happening though? Not really. Any other trade though where a team that needs to be stripped to its core (or of its core) adds in another forward over 30 on a long term deal with a number of past locker room issues is just stupid. No way around it.

 

[Clark Kellogg]

If we are going to trade Zac Jones then my trade proposal would be to the St. Louis for Matt Kessel and the lower of Blues 2027 4th round picks.

 

[LokiDog]

Biz: “Drury would do bad things to acquire Miller.”

HF:

 

[DanielBrassard]

The only way miller makes sense is if you can trade Zibanejad for him. But this team is so f***ing predictable, of course Chris Drury would love to acquire J.T. Miller. I'm just about sick of him, guy has not a creative bone in his body. I'd rather overpay for Pettersson than go back to the j.t. miller well again. He's 32 in a couple months, what the f*** does he do for a team that should be looking to get younger? Is swapping Zibanejad for Miller really going to catapult this team to Stanley cup contention? Btw, when Miller hasn't been on the ice with Quinn Hughes his numbers look as bad as Mika. So whatever, the rangers will never learn.

 

[McRanger92]

Drury is a walking show shit show and the drama has followed him right from Hartford to NYR

Weeding out the snakes one might say. It takes one to know one. Kravstov and Andersson never amounted to anything and were obviously entitled players. Drury held on to Kakko so long his value completely cratered because he wanted it to work. Kakko never said a bad word about Drury. Kakko himself was selfish. Even when things were going good he wanted more ice time for himself and would tell anyone about it. That's not a good teammate when you're trying to win a Cup. This isnt a rebuild and hasnt been one for a long time. This is very likely a lost season because of the player reaction to these trades, but theyll be right back on the horse next year, hopefully with a top 5 pic in the mix and some new veteran leaders. Ones who prioritize winning games over who their linemates are and how much ice time they are getting.

The only way miller makes sense is if you can trade Zibanejad for him. But this team is so f***ing predictable, of course Chris Drury would love to acquire J.T. Miller. I'm just about sick of him, guy has not a creative bone in his body. I'd rather overpay for Pettersson than go back to the j.t. miller well again. He's 32 in a couple months, what the f*** does he do for a team that should be looking to get younger? Is swapping Zibanejad for Miller really going to catapult this team to Stanley cup contention? Btw, when Miller hasn't been on the ice with Quinn Hughes his numbers look as bad as Mika. So whatever, the rangers will never learn.

I dont think Biz has any insight into the Rangers or Drury. I do think JT Miller would be interested in coming back to NY. And Chiclets has a lot of sources among players more than management.

 

[toNYRico]

I really don't understand the stance of " I don't want JT Miller because he's a locker room cancer." He's a dog, a gamer, a drag you into the fight, F you-type personality that our locker room desperately needs more of. I consider the makeup of our current locker room core, primarily Mika and Kreider, as cancerous. These are two entitled, coddled, fold-when-adversity-hits, losers who are chiefly responsible for this disaster of a season so far. Feed me JT Miller.

 

[zlev]

30 year old Mark Messier would do nothing for this team, much less JT f***ing Miller

 

[LokiDog]

The only way miller makes sense is if you can trade Zibanejad for him. But this team is so f***ing predictable, of course Chris Drury would love to acquire J.T. Miller. I'm just about sick of him, guy has not a creative bone in his body. I'd rather overpay for Pettersson than go back to the j.t. miller well again. He's 32 in a couple months, what the f*** does he do for a team that should be looking to get younger? Is swapping Zibanejad for Miller really going to catapult this team to Stanley cup contention? Btw, when Miller hasn't been on the ice with Quinn Hughes his numbers look as bad as Mika. So whatever, the rangers will never learn.

Yep, Miller for Z is a wash for us in terms of results. Miller is definitely more of a hard nosed player and would be far more tolerable to watch, no doubt. He also is more valuable than Z so we would be adding for sure. Miller is better but doesn’t make us better. Because we have 2 NHL D in Fox and Schneider. Shesterkin is on IR. This season is shot. What we need for next season isn’t a 32 year old center.

Yes, he is preferable to Zib, so if the focus is essentially just a swap, fine. But even though he’ll play harder and not be as whimpy and maybe even teach some of the guys to grow some balls, a single 32 year old center isn’t going to right the ship - if anything it’s another move that keeps us from bottoming out properly. The only way this team ever changes is if they draft a franchise center. Period. That won’t happen with Miller, Fox and Shesterkin on the team, but they also still won’t even be close to Cup contention. Paying any kind of significant return for Miller, other than just swapping Zib, is the exact same type of short sightedness that keeps us in the hamster wheel.

 

[Forsbergaura21]

Cuylle - is he able to play RW?

If so I don’t understand why he is always stuck on 3rd line. I would love to see him replace Smith on 2nd line,…

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

I may be in the minority here, but as much as I would love to see Perreault in a Rangers uniform - If there is a player (not Miller) who could be had that is a cornerstone type of guy and a center (and younger) to build around I wouldn't have a problem moving him in the deal.

Watching him at BC and the WJC - he is the same type of non-contact, just OK skater who is very similar to the type of veterans we are having issues with in NY.

And his value is very high. It would be a risk for sure, but given the Rangers track record in developing young forwards - lets just dangle him out there for a proven elite player who fits the mold.

Not to mention im kinda sick of watching and waiting for young forwards to blossom in the franchise. Its excruciating. Fit a winner in here with the same age path of the current youth core.

 

[Levitate]

The org doesn't both have no patience for kids AND hold on to them for too long instead of trading them early and getting value.

Weird narrative.

It's more that they seem to want to hang on to players they don't actually value just because they...I dunno, don't want them to leave yet? Hajek is a great example, why the heck did they hold on to him for so long when they clearly didn't actually want to play him. Sometimes it's OK to waive and dump guys you don't like when they have almost no trade value.
Jones feels like the same path of they don't really value him, but they don't want to do anything with him.

 

[DanielBrassard]

Yep, Miller for Z is a wash for us in terms of results. Miller is definitely more of a hard nosed player and would be far more tolerable to watch, no doubt. He also is more valuable than Z so we would be adding for sure. Miller is better but doesn’t make us better. Because we have 2 NHL D in Fox and Schneider. Shesterkin is on IR. This season is shot. What we need for next season isn’t a 32 year old center.

Yes, he is preferable to Zib, so if the focus is essentially just a swap, fine. But even though he’ll play harder and not be as whimpy and maybe even teach some of the guys to grow some balls, a single 32 year old center isn’t going to right the ship - if anything it’s another move that keeps us from bottoming out properly. The only way this team ever changes is if they draft a franchise center. Period. That won’t happen with Miller, Fox and Shesterkin on the team, but they also still won’t even be close to Cup contention. Paying any kind of significant return for Miller, other than just swapping Zib, is the exact same type of short sightedness that keeps us in the hamster wheel.

Exactly, it's the same shortsighted, lack of creativity, lack of long term plan move that has been a staple of the Drury regime and the Rangers organization forever. You identified that this group of players isn't good enough to win, so the response is to add a 32-year old who isn't even that good to begin with, hes not a franchise player by any means I don't care what kind of point totals he puts up. I don't even understand what the plan is. Trade Kreider, Zibanejad, Trouba, Kakko, etc. but then add J.T. Miller? Bench Jones to play Lindgren and Vaakanainen? This team is pathetic. At least if we heard they wanted Pettersson or something who's actually an elite young forward it would make sense for where this team is headed. But nope, we heard about miller.

 

[zlev]

I may be in the minority here, but as much as I would love to see Perreault in a Rangers uniform - If there is a player (not Miller) who could be had that is a cornerstone type of guy and a center (and younger) to build around I wouldn't have a problem moving him in the deal.

Watching him at BC and the WJC - he is the same type of non-contact, just OK skater who is very similar to the type of veterans we are having issues with in NY.

And his value is very high. It would be a risk for sure, but given the Rangers track record in developing young forwards - lets just dangle him out there for a proven elite player who fits the mold.

Not to mention im kinda sick of watching and waiting for young forwards to blossom in the franchise. Its excruciating. Fit a winner in here with the same age path of the current youth core.

yeah i really think Perreault is massively overrated here. it makes sense because he's our only prospect worth a shit (i'm very low on Othmann) but almost every team has a guy like him in their system.

 

[kovazub94]

The only way Miller makes sense is under a few scenarios:
1) the cost is very minimal
2) Zibanejad is going the other way in exchange
3) Drury can trade Zibanejad and use those same assets, or equal value in assets, to acquire Miller

Exactly. Both Vancouver and NYR don't have any desire to make their rosters weaker (let's say vs where these teams ended 2023-2024 season).

In both cases there's virtually zero chance other team won't try to take advantage of the situation - i.e. suggesting lesser value which for this point would also include futures.

Vancouver and Rangers finding a common ground would be more beneficial for both team as compared to separately dealing with 3rd parties. Let's also note that said 3rd parties could be playing Nuks off the Rangers to further reduce return value.

 

[80shockeywasbuns]

That's not a good teammate when you're trying to win a Cup.

I mean Jones/Kakko did the complete opposite of what you’re saying. They did everything asked of them for years and took their lumps quietly while the team was in contention. They’re now speaking up because NYR is a lottery team and continues to scratch them for bad players because vibes

 

[FoxysExpensiveNYDigs]

JT wouldn't be cheap. We're kidding ourselves if we think it would be Zibby with a small add.

If JT will only waive for the Rangers i think it would be less of an add as you'd think. Don't really see why JT would want to come back though.

 

[GAGLine]

If we are going to trade Zac Jones then my trade proposal would be to the St. Louis for Matt Kessel and the lower of Blues 2027 4th round picks.

I don't see the value in that for the Rangers. Kessel played 36 games in the AHL last year and was just sent down to the AHL on Dec 14th, playing 7 games so far. He was drafted a year after Jones, but he was a double over-ager, so he's actually slightly older.

The only real benefit is that Kessel is waiver exempt, but Drury will want someone taking Jones' place in the press box.

He played 2 games against Harford in the last week. Did you see something in those games that makes you think he might have an NHL future? If not, I'd rather get a better pick. We should be able to get at least a 3rd, if not more.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Weeding out the snakes one might say. It takes one to know one. Kravstov and Andersson never amounted to anything and were obviously entitled players. Drury held on to Kakko so long his value completely cratered because he wanted it to work. Kakko never said a bad word about Drury. Kakko himself was selfish. Even when things were going good he wanted more ice time for himself and would tell anyone about it. That's not a good teammate when you're trying to win a Cup. This isnt a rebuild and hasnt been one for a long time. This is very likely a lost season because of the player reaction to these trades, but theyll be right back on the horse next year, hopefully with a top 5 pic in the mix and some new veteran leaders. Ones who prioritize winning games over who their linemates are and how much ice time they are getting.



I dont think Biz has any insight into the Rangers or Drury. I do think JT Miller would be interested in coming back to NY. And Chiclets has a lot of sources among players more than management.

No team has screwed up more highly regarded picks than this one, dismissing Kravtsov and Andersson as entitled or whatever is lazy because not one of our picks has ended up where they should be outside of Cuylle. Lafreniere and Kakko were considered cornerstone pieces, this organization didn't do anything to make that happen. Luckily Lafreniere caught lightning in a bottle last year or he would have been gone now too. I mean you could even look as far as Mathew Robertson who was a WHL top dman being used in all situations, he's essentially just another bust to join this team, is it because of him or the org? The guy looks unrecognizable. I wonder what would have become of Andersson if he went directly to Tampa, or Kravtsov to Florida, what happened to them here didn't help, they may have busted out somewhere else but given our track record it was more likely here, and whatever is causing this needs to be addressed now, the only fella left from all that is Drury.

 

[FoxysExpensiveNYDigs]

I mean Jones/Kakko did the complete opposite of what you’re saying. They did everything asked of them for years and took their lumps quietly while the team was in contention. They’re now speaking up because NYR is a lottery team and continues to scratch them for bad players because vibes

Gotta justify those trades! Lol

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

yeah i really think Perreault is massively overrated here. it makes sense because he's our only prospect worth a shit (i'm very low on Othmann) but almost every team has a guy like him in their system.

To me it isnt so much about him being our only top prospect that we are over-valuing. I agree with that to a degree however.

The kid is talented and the hockey sense is off the charts.

But its about just that - its the type of player we've seen so much of. Heady players. Given the history here I'd focus on bringing in and drafting LESS emotionally intelligent players and instead bring in some bruisers who just go out and compete.

Im generalizing here, but I see Cuylle and Berard and Trocheck as lunch pail type of players who when the shit hits the fan you know they will run through the end boards for you. McDonagh was like that. Girardi. We need more of that and less dangle. Fox will be here so theyll be enough of that. Laf is like half and half. Not everyone has to be an idiot - just need to find the right balance. Im not a huge Brady guy, but that type of brash/offensive leader is what is needed in this city.

I feel like theyll finally "wise up" and give Gabe the keys with PP1 time off the bat and it will backfire because we cant do anything right with young forwards. He should start in Hartford and when he gets mauled at the pro level his value will drop. So get ahead of it.

And im not too high on Othmann either, but at least he fits the mold better.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

If JT will only waive for the Rangers i think it would be less of an add as you'd think. Don't really see why JT would want to come back though.

Miller will be traded as a top player in the league. Imo we'd probably get a better deal made for Pettersson because of production and contract.

 

[UnSandvich]

I think people are seriously underestimating Perreaults competitiveness. He’s not overly fast or physical, but he’s absolutely not the type to avoid the middle of the ice for fear of contact, and he plays a good reliable game away from the puck

 

[FoxysExpensiveNYDigs]

yeah i really think Perreault is massively overrated here. it makes sense because he's our only prospect worth a shit (i'm very low on Othmann) but almost every team has a guy like him in their system.

Lol name 10 teams that have a prospect of Perrault's caliber.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

yeah i really think Perreault is massively overrated here. it makes sense because he's our only prospect worth a shit (i'm very low on Othmann) but almost every team has a guy like him in their system.

If you were saying this Othmann I would agree, but Perreault is one of the best prospects in hockey. Top 15.

Every team absolutely does not have a guy like him in the system