Speculation: Roster Building Thread : Part XV (Light em up!)

[SA16]

The NHL in general has a coaching problem. Teams have been chweing through coaches lately. Carburry from Washington i think is around the 10th longest tenured coach for a team and he was hired in in 2023.

It’s getting a little ridiculous how fast teams are replacing coaches and how quickly players are tuning out coaches.

Edit: only 4 coaches have been with their team prior to 2022.

So basically in the past 2.5 season 28 teams have fired and hired at least 1 coach.

That’s just because firing the coach is an easy change to make for a team that disappoints and makes it seem like management is doing something

 

[mandiblesofdoom]

Genuine question: when was the last time a high draft pick worked out for us and delivered to expectations or exceeded them? We don't help ourselves sometimes, and I know Sather traded like nine of them seemingly in a row during those years, but damn, we have had some bad luck and are due a break or two when it comes to getting a star player.

We need to hire people in player development who either a) have a record of getting good results out of high draft picks or b) have studied/apprenticed under such people.

 

[Ruggs225]

That’s just because firing the coach is an easy change to make for a team that disappoints and makes it seem like management is doing something

Oh absolutely.

But i do believe that players are tuning out coaches faster as well.

 

[LOFIN]

Great article by Brooks today.

On paper (thumbnail, click to enlarge)

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

People will make things up about Dolan because it's lazy analysis.

Saying Dolan lacked patience when Gorton already premature ejaculated the rebuild two years prior is weaving tall tales.

If you wanna bag on Dolan for something, it's f***ing $200+ to see this team play. That's his department.

I think it's far more absurd to assume Dolan was completely willing to do whatever the hockey people wanted even if what they wanted was a long, patient, ground up rebuild. You think Dolan wasn't putting pressure on NYR management to not fully bottom out, even since the original "letter"? I think thats pretty naive.

1/26/2018 just before "the letter"

The objective is to add young NHL or NHL-ready players every bit as much as garnering additional selections in upcoming entry drafts. Teams in the market for rentals generally own picks in the overall 24-to-31 range. You can get a good player toward the bottom of the first round, but generally not a franchise guy even if Boston’s David Pastrnak (25th in 2014) might prove a notable exception to the rule. The Rangers are neither plotting nor anticipating a deep dive to the league’s nether regions from which it can take years to escape.

Exclusive | Rangers going to blow it all up

There is no ambivalence within management. The Blueshirts, we’re told on good authority, view the Feb. 26 trade deadline as a unique opportunity to refresh the roster and replenish the organization…

nypost.com

The Rangers plan, because of course it was, was always to try to "contend while rebuilding". You don't think Dolan is influencing that? HF interpreting the letter as "Wow! The Rangers are actuall going to rebuild!" was us hearing what we wanted to hear.

Further evidence of this was obviously JD & Gorton's firings. From an article titled "Jim Dolan’s Rangers vision clashed with John Davidson-Jeff Gorton blueprint" (pretty direct...)

This wasn’t as much about past performance as future intentions. This wasn’t at all about missing the playoffs this year but rather the possibility of missing them again next year and maybe the year after that while following a long and winding rebuild road.

Information is at a premium when it concerns the thought process of Garden and Rangers CEO Jim Dolan, who until this moment had resisted anything like this intervention on the hockey side of the business.

In that sense, this is shocking.

But sources indicate that Dolan’s vision of the future, and more specifically the immediate future, clashed with the blueprint embraced by now-former team president John Davidson and now-former general manager Jeff Gorton, both dismissed Wednesday. Three years after The Letter and only two years after luring Davidson from Columbus to oversee the program, philosophies diverged.

Davidson, who had overseen bottom-up rebuilds in St. Louis and Columbus that failed to reach fruition under his tenure, had continued to preach patience under a slow-walk philosophy. Gorton presumably was not only JD’s acolyte, but a true believer.

After four years out of the playoffs, Dolan had begun to question the administration of the program whose long view does not exactly jibe with the roster whose marquee players Artemi Panarin, Mika Zibanejad and Chris Kreider will be between 28 and 30 when next season commences and are likely to be diminished by the time the promise coalesces.

Jim Dolan’s Rangers vision clashed with John Davidson-Jeff Gorton blueprint

The Letter is in the past. The past is in the rearview mirror with Davidson and Gorton. This is all about the future. Development has left Penn Station.

nypost.com

Now certainly, the specifics of "accelerating the rebuild" like keeping Kreider, signing Panarin and dealing for Trouba were on JD and Gorton. I just think it's wild to suggest that Dolan had no influence on the overall approach to team building, when every piece of evidence we had (as well as common sense that the owner of the team would set guardrails and objectives for the org) would indicate he did.

 

[cheech70]

 

[80shockeywasbuns]

The performance of himself and the team since July 1 doesnt warrant a firing necessarily, but it does warrant a demotion imo. Would love to hire a real POHO above him with a vision for what he wants the Rangers to be. drury is best suited as a hatchet man. Team's need those too.

Drurys best suited for Chick Fil A drive thru

 

[McRanger92]

Drurys best suited for Chick Fil A drive thru

Nah drury is too much of a big meanie to work there

 

[mandiblesofdoom]

I'll bag on Avery, but I'll hear it all day from Brian Boyle.

That guy did nothing but play the game right and more than overstayed his welcome in the NHL based on pure talent.

Imo Boyle is the best thing on the MSG broadcast. Vally is fine too, but Boyle sees the game as a skater, which is helpful.

 

[Machinehead]

I think it's far more absurd to assume Dolan was completely willing to do whatever the hockey people wanted even if what they wanted was a long, patient, ground up rebuild. You think Dolan wasn't putting pressure on NYR management to not fully bottom out, even since the original "letter"? I think thats pretty naive.

1/26/2018 just before "the letter"

Exclusive | Rangers going to blow it all up

There is no ambivalence within management. The Blueshirts, we’re told on good authority, view the Feb. 26 trade deadline as a unique opportunity to refresh the roster and replenish the organization…

nypost.com

The Rangers plan, because of course it was, was always to try to "contend while rebuilding". You don't think Dolan is influencing that? HF interpreting the letter as "Wow! The Rangers are actuall going to rebuild!" was us hearing what we wanted to hear.

Further evidence of this was obviously JD & Gorton's firings. From an article titled "Jim Dolan’s Rangers vision clashed with John Davidson-Jeff Gorton blueprint" (pretty direct...)

Jim Dolan’s Rangers vision clashed with John Davidson-Jeff Gorton blueprint

The Letter is in the past. The past is in the rearview mirror with Davidson and Gorton. This is all about the future. Development has left Penn Station.

nypost.com

Now certainly, the specifics of "accelerating the rebuild" like keeping Kreider, signing Panarin and dealing for Trouba were on JD and Gorton. I just think it's wild to suggest that Dolan had no influence on the overall approach to team building, when every piece of evidence we had (as well as common sense that the owner of the team would set guardrails and objectives for the org) would indicate he did.

Larry references the Knicks in this very article, who did nothing but soak up draft picks for two years while Dolan didn't say boo to a goose. Larry can say JD and Gorton preached patience all he wants, and maybe they did, but they didn't f***ing do that. They traded for Trouba like 10 seconds after they sent out the letter because "he became available."

Gorton's regime was extremely reactionary and Larry attempting to paint him as the opposite is just telling fans who don't like Dolan what they want to hear.

Dolan let the Knicks do exactly what people want the Rangers to do. That's a pretty open and shut case.

 

[Guyute]

EF mentioned the Brooks column. EF said Brooks is connected. Not that connected. Someone gave him that information who knows. More is coming. EF said teams love Trocheck. They would climb buildings for him. Trocheck has control with the NMC and he isn't sure the Rangers want to do it.



Trade all of these guys. Fox. Trocheck. The guys with value. Trade the rentals. Seismic changes are needed. Trocheck has a limited NTC next summer. 12 teams and it drops each season.

Biggest thing out of that IMO was EF speculating that NYR might try to do something with Zibanejad

 

[IDvsEGO]

Biggest thing out of that IMO was EF speculating that NYR might try to do something with Zibanejad

That seems like both the biggest “no shit” and also entirely wishcasting.
Mika controls his fate.

 

[McRanger92]

Larry references the Knicks in this very article, who did nothing but soak up draft picks for two years while Dolan didn't say boo to a goose. Larry can say JR and Gorton preached patience all he wants, and maybe they did, but they didn't f***ing do that. They traded for Trouba like 10 seconds after they sent out the letter because "he became available."

Gorton's regime was extremely reactionary and Larry attempting to paint him as the opposite is just telling fans who don't like Dolan what they want to hear.

Dolan let the Knicks do exactly what people want the Rangers to do. That's a pretty open and shut case.

Rangers need their OG Anunoby trade. Ive been harping on this for a few weeks. People have told me it's not a good comparison because the NBA/NHL are different, but who cares? Knicks traded 2 square pegs for a DPOY candidate once he got an expanded role. rangers have guys like K'Andre, Chytil, Lindgren who dont fit with where the team needs to go. Package them an acquire a guy with top pair D or top 6 c potential. Who cares if they "lose" the trade in the moment.

Biggest thing out of that IMO was EF speculating that NYR might try to do something with Zibanejad

Blackmail might be the best bet. And when is Dreary asking Kreider for his no trade list?

 

[Machinehead]

Rangers need their OG Anunoby trade. Ive been harping on this for a few weeks. People have told me it's not a good comparison because the NBA/NHL are different, but who cares? Knicks traded 2 square pegs for a DPOY candidate once he got an expanded role. rangers have guys like K'Andre, Chytil, Lindgren who dont fit with where the team needs to go. Package them an acquire a guy with top pair D or top 6 c potential. Who cares if they "lose" the trade in the moment.

I was thinking about Anunoby re: the Rangers the other day.

The Rangers absolutely need a low-key impact guy that just magically makes play go in the right direction.

Verhaeghe for Florida comes to mind as a hockey comp.

 

[McRanger92]

I was thinking about Anunoby re: the Rangers the other day.

The Rangers absolutely need a low-key impact guy that just magically makes play go in the right direction.

Verhaeghe for Florida comes to mind as a hockey comp.

The Rangers can take on salary to make a trade like that work as well. The GM better be working the phones and putting his pro scouting hat on because this is where the team can make progress. Buffalo and detroit seem to be the other teams "open for business" like us and I do think there are some candidates out there.

 

[Machinehead]

Also, there are very few posters on here whose argument is "the Rangers should have been bad for 22 years until they drafted Jack Hughes and Sabrina Ionescu."

I think the animus for the most part is trying the navy's flag to Zibanejad and sailing into Troy with the 2022 Rangers, when most people knew that wasn't it!

If moving on from Zibanejad meant being mediocre for another year, then fine. Nobody wanted to be Buffalo.

 

[Machinehead]

The Rangers can take on salary to make a trade like that work as well. The GM better be working the phones and putting his pro scouting hat on because this is where the team can make progress. Buffalo and detroit seem to be the other teams "open for business" like us and I do think there are some candidates out there.

Buffalo and Detroit have some interesting pieces to try and rehab like we did with Brassard, Stralman, Zibanejad once upon a time.

I also look at teams like Minnesota and LA. They have to be buying. Both teams had really good builds and have more young talent than they have spots for.

 

[McRanger92]

Buffalo and Detroit have some interesting pieces to try and rehab like we did with Brassard, Stralman, Zibanejad once upon a time.

I also look at teams like Minnesota and LA. They have to be buying. Both teams had really good builds and have more young talent than they have spots for.

Trocheck would be a perfect fit in Minnesota, as much as I wouldnt want to trade him because he at least cares. He seems to fit their identity and culture, and personally, I want that for him (as long as we get a good return)

Panarin and Kreider are perfect for LAK. they can defend well but have a bottom 5 PP. They arent getting past Edmonton on 5v5 play and defense alone.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Looks great.

 

[Irishguy42]

Tankathon | 2025 NHL Draft Order & Lottery Simulator

2025 NHL Draft order tracker updated after every game. NHL lottery simulator to determine the top overall pick. View traded picks and playoff matchups.

www.tankathon.com

 

[UAGoalieGuy]

No practice this morning?

 

[UnSandvich]

I think (read: hope) Dolan could be convinced that the team needs to take a step back for now. But I think the key for Drury or whoever is the GM, is to make sure there's a *plan*. And to make sure Dolan knows that there is a plan. Gorton had a "plan" (sell some guys off and let the team rebuild around the youngsters), then tossed it in the shredder when it became inconvenient.

Drury needs to know who's going, who's staying, who's being targeted, and how we're going to go about making that all happen. I don't think Dolan will be satisfied with "Just sell everyone off and then be bad for a while", i think he'd need more than that.

 

[MrAlmost]

Kreider to Dallas makes sense.

Panarin to LA makes sense. He won't waive though.

We should not trade Trocheck. I want him to win too, but we need him to be the leader of the room. We need him to help build the type of personality we want the team to play with.

I don't know what will happen with Z but he will likely waive. If not during the year then in the summer.

Lindgren, Borgen, Smith, Vesey to whoever needs the depth.

I do not think he will, but Igor may want out too and may think that being signed gives him more possible destinations.

I really doubt Trocheck, Fox, Panarin and Igor go anywhere. Add Cuylle, Laf, Schneider and some rookies/prospects like Berard, Othmann, Ed, Rempe, etc. To that list. Thats where they will start back up.

 

[kovazub94]

Larry references the Knicks in this very article, who did nothing but soak up draft picks for two years while Dolan didn't say boo to a goose. Larry can say JD and Gorton preached patience all he wants, and maybe they did, but they didn't f***ing do that. They traded for Trouba like 10 seconds after they sent out the letter because "he became available."

Gorton's regime was extremely reactionary and Larry attempting to paint him as the opposite is just telling fans who don't like Dolan what they want to hear.

Dolan let the Knicks do exactly what people want the Rangers to do. That's a pretty open and shut case.

Knicks had a reset after reset after reset since 2000’s the last time they mattered until this most recent iteration. Let’s not rewrite the history.

There’s no way I’d advocate for a full rebuild with the pieces the Rangers have in place and pieces they have available to be moved. The letter rebuild plan went as good as it could be reasonably expected. Yeah they miscalculated some parts of this plan but there’s no way I’d point to NBA as a blueprint - doing it in the NHL is MUCH more difficult and fraught - that’s why there are many more examples of NHL teams sucking for decades and still no light at the end of the tunnel in sight.

Shesterkin, Fox, Lafreniere, Schneider, Cuylle and the rest of depth kids up and coming. Trocheck (for captain), Panarin, Chytil as vets to keep. Kreider, Lindgren, Miller etc to use in trades. In this context asking for a scorching the earth and hoping for the successful rebuild in 2020’s is a pipe dream or what I honestly think a wish for manifestation of internal misery taking shape externally.

 

[Machinehead]

I think (read: hope) Dolan could be convinced that the team needs to take a step back for now. But I think the key for Drury or whoever is the GM, is to make sure there's a *plan*. And to make sure Dolan knows that there is a plan. Gorton had a "plan" (sell some guys off and let the team rebuild around the youngsters), then tossed it in the shredder when it became inconvenient.

Drury needs to know who's going, who's staying, who's being targeted, and how we're going to go about making that all happen. I don't think Dolan will be satisfied with "Just sell everyone off and then be bad for a while", i think he'd need more than that.

Gorton ran into trouble because he couldn't help himself when it came to doing shit just because he could.

I really hope Drury has more of a plan than that, although getting Kane because it was the meme thing to do was all on Drury.