Speculation: Roster Building Thread : Part XV (Light em up!)

[noncents]

EF mentioned the Brooks column. EF said Brooks is connected. Not that connected. Someone gave him that information who knows. More is coming. EF said teams love Trocheck. They would climb buildings for him. Trocheck has control with the NMC and he isn't sure the Rangers want to do it.



Trade all of these guys. Fox. Trocheck. The guys with value. Trade the rentals. Seismic changes are needed. Trocheck has a limited NTC next summer. 12 teams and it drops each season.

don't f***ing trade trocheck.

 

[McRanger92]

don't f***ing trade trocheck.

We've gotten Vinny's best years in all liklihood. If he's OK with leaving and we get a good return. We need to brace ourselves for 12-18 months of lower expectations and younger players getting more minutes. He's a a better leader than the other vets, but thats not doing us much good right now.

 

[Machinehead]

Knicks had a reset after reset after reset since 2000’s the last time they mattered until this most recent iteration. Let’s not rewrite the history.

There’s no way I’d advocate for a full rebuild with the pieces the Rangers have in place and pieces they have available to be moved. The letter rebuild plan went as good as it could be reasonably expected. Yeah they miscalculated some parts of this plan but there’s no way I’d point to NBA as a blueprint - doing it in the NHL is MUCH more difficult and fraught - that’s why there are many more examples of NHL teams sucking for decades and still no light at the end of the tunnel in sight.

Shesterkin, Fox, Lafreniere, Schneider, Cuylle and the rest of depth kids up and coming. Trocheck (for captain), Panarin, Chytil as vets to keep. Kreider, Lindgren, Miller etc to use in trades. In this context asking for a scorching the earth and hoping for the successful rebuild in 2020’s is a pipe dream or what I honestly think a wish for manifestation of internal misery taking shape externally.

The Knicks had reset after reset because Dolan kept hiring clowns. That's a legitimate criticism.

My only point about the Knicks is that Rose had a plan and Dolan left him alone.

I think this board is often far too quick to take anything that's not status quo and say "Dolan would never allow that!" It's not that deep.

Dolan cares about 1) Profit 2) Profit 3) Profit 4) Profit 5) Profit and 6) I think he'd like for his front office to have some semblance of a vision and he'll let him do it if the vision is good.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Larry references the Knicks in this very article, who did nothing but soak up draft picks for two years while Dolan didn't say boo to a goose. Larry can say JD and Gorton preached patience all he wants, and maybe they did, but they didn't f***ing do that. They traded for Trouba like 10 seconds after they sent out the letter because "he became available."

Gorton's regime was extremely reactionary and Larry attempting to paint him as the opposite is just telling fans who don't like Dolan what they want to hear.

Dolan let the Knicks do exactly what people want the Rangers to do. That's a pretty open and shut case.

I'm not a Knicks expert, but wasn't that after like 25 years of doing the exact opposite? Like it had to fail 15 times and get to the point where stars were rejecting NY before he finally let them try letting nature take its course.

Larry references the Knicks in this very article, who did nothing but soak up draft picks for two years while Dolan didn't say boo to a goose. Larry can say JD and Gorton preached patience all he wants, and maybe they did, but they didn't f***ing do that. They traded for Trouba like 10 seconds after they sent out the letter because "he became available."

Gorton's regime was extremely reactionary and Larry attempting to paint him as the opposite is just telling fans who don't like Dolan what they want to hear.

Dolan let the Knicks do exactly what people want the Rangers to do. That's a pretty open and shut case.

All I'm saying is I think its naive to think Dolan put ZERO pressure on them to not bottom out, when everything actually coming from the org even during "the letter" was that "this would not be a long meandering rebuild"

 

[McRanger92]

Ryan O'Reilly
Sam Reinhart
Jack Eichel
Dylan Cozens

Free the next Buffalo and profit.

 

[NYR Viper]

I'd consider trading Trochek but likely not until the off-season

 

[kovazub94]

The Knicks had reset after reset because Dolan kept hiring clowns. That's a legitimate criticism.

My only point about the Knicks is that Rose had a plan and Dolan left him alone.

I think this board is often far too quick to take anything that's not status quo and say "Dolan would never allow that!" It's not that deep.

Dolan cares about 1) Profit 2) Profit 3) Profit 4) Profit 5) Profit and 6) I think he'd like for his front office to have some semblance of a vision and he'll let him do it if the vision is good.

I think overall Dolan is a great owner. My point was that NBA is not a good comparison and scorching earth is not a good approach.

 

[McRanger92]

I'd consider trading Trochek but likely not until the off-season

He's got an NMC anyway. trocheck may want the control now, instead of waiting until he needs to make a list on JULY 1

 

[Machinehead]

I'm not a Knicks expert, but wasn't that after like 25 years of doing the exact opposite? Like it had to fail 15 times and get to the point where stars were rejecting NY before he finally let them try letting nature take its course.

The Knicks were a mess for a long time but I don't think the issue was ever impatience.

From 2001 to 2023, the Knicks won a playoff series once. Despite that, most of the executives, aside from interim guys, got real looks.

The bigger problem was hiring retreads who the Knicks finally got their hands on a whole generation after that guy built a winner somewhere else.

Leon Rose was finally some fresh blood and that seemed to turn things around.

All I'm saying is I think its naive to think Dolan put ZERO pressure on them to not bottom out, when everything actually coming from the org even during "the letter" was that "this would not be a long meandering rebuild"

There's no evidence that "this won't be a long meandering rebuild" wasn't Gorton's plan, and his actions support that.

No owner is going to be happy with the prospect of bottoming out for a long time, and most meandering rebuilds not only don't work, but lead to long-term rot.

The issue is that we're using Dolan as an excuse to absolve Gorton and even the current regime because "something something impatience!" Our GM's have failed independent of the owner.

Gorton is just a moron. Montreal is currently going absolutely nowhere. Gorton's problem isn't ideology -- Gorton's problem is he can't f***ing draft.

 

[Machinehead]

I think overall Dolan is a great owner. My point was that NBA is not a good comparison and scorching earth is not a good approach.

Nobody said it was and nobody is arguing that the Knicks did that. They didn't sell Julius Randle until they were well into contention.

I'm taking issue with the notion that Dolan pulled the plug by firing Gorton and forcing the team into contention.

Gorton pulled the plug, Dolan fired him for being a moron, and PDO luck forced the team into contention.

 

[Captain Monglobster]

Trading Trocheck would be a big mistake unless its a huge overpayment. Even if he isnt at his peak anymore he is exactly the type of vet you would want to bring in to set the tone for a young locker room.

If they clean house of all the other dead weight, there will still need to be vets on this team that personify the way the team wants to play. To me thats Vinny to a T.

 

[GAGLine]

don't f***ing trade trocheck.

Anyone should be considered, even Fox, though I personally wouldn't trade him. The offer would have to be huge for me to trade Fox.

Guys on the other side of 30? Trade them all. It's not like we can get worse than what we're seeing right now.

 

[noncents]

Something with Woodcrofts face just freaks me out. Looks like a doll that came to life

dunno if you made this up or where you got it but it's incredible

 

[kovazub94]

Nobody said it was and nobody is arguing that the Knicks did that. They didn't sell Julius Randle until they were well into contention.

I'm taking issue with the notion that Dolan pulled the plug by firing Gorton and forcing the team into contention.

Gorton pulled the plug, Dolan fired him for being a moron, and PDO luck forced the team into contention.

I think Dolan fired Gorton for insubordination (Davidson being a part of it is the proof IMO as he hasn’t had a long enough tenure to be fired for his hockey decisions). Drury has largely continued on the previously established path. This is the first time Drury finally started meaningfully reshaping the roster.

 

[Vitto79]

Trading Trocheck would be a big mistake unless its a huge overpayment. Even if he isnt at his peak anymore he is exactly the type of vet you would want to bring in to set the tone for a young locker room.

If they clean house of all the other dead weight, there will still need to be vets on this team that personify the way the team wants to play. To me thats Vinny to a T.

Leafs board saying they would trade Cowan for example

 

[noncents]

We've gotten Vinny's best years in all liklihood. If he's OK with leaving and we get a good return. We need to brace ourselves for 12-18 months of lower expectations and younger players getting more minutes. He's a a better leader than the other vets, but thats not doing us much good right now.

the type of leadership he provides in a top 9 role (really top 6) is what keeps culture from bottoming out long term. see sabres ottawa etc etc etc

 

[duhmetreE]

Trade Kreider. Trade Lindgren. Trade all pending UFAs. Try to trade Mika, if nothing materializes move him to wing.

Get a top 5 pick and retool in the offseason.

A legit top4 LHD that can skate with size and another top 9 center. Gourde type

These are the 2 adds that are a must imo

I’d dangle Gabe for the right piece.

 

[Bruner4329]

We can sell all the veterans you want but there are still problems. The guys people want to keep are under producers as well. Listen I know FC has been hurt a lot the past couple of years but he is a consistent under producer who disappears for long periods of time during a season. No way he is a number 2 or even 3 center. Also as someone mentioned we can get all the draft picks you want but until we get the picks right it won't help. Cuylie is a nice player and Berard is a decent 3rd or 4th liner potentially but I am not impressed by any of the other youngsters. Othman has been hurt but I have seen him up in Hartford the last couple of years and he is by far not going to be a big impact player some think. Eddstrom is a big guy who lacks skill sets and Rempe to me is just to unreliable and unpredictable to count on.

 

[McRanger92]

We can sell all the veterans you want but there are still problems. The guys people want to keep are under producers as well. Listen I know FC has been hurt a lot the past couple of years but he is a consistent under producer who disappears for long periods of time during a season. No way he is a number 2 or even 3 center. Also as someone mentioned we can get all the draft picks you want but until we get the picks right it won't help. Cuylie is a nice player and Berard is a decent 3rd or 4th liner potentially but I am not impressed by any of the other youngsters. Othman has been hurt but I have seen him up in Hartford the last couple of years and he is by far not going to be a big impact player some think. Eddstrom is a big guy who lacks skill sets and Rempe to me is just to unreliable and unpredictable to count on.

Filip Chytil shouldnt be lumped in with guys in their 1st or 2nd year like Cuylle and Berard. Chytil made his debut under Alain Vigneault! He absolutely should be traded as soon as someone gives the Rangers a reasonable offer. Are we really going to move forward with Chytil penciled in as a top 6 C when he has never been that and is a hit away from his career being over?

the type of leadership he provides in a top 9 role (really top 6) is what keeps culture from bottoming out long term. see sabres ottawa etc etc etc

Isnt that what everyone wants though?

In all seriousness, Id rather have a 1st and a couple of NHL ready young players than having to deal with Trocheck as he ages. This team has plenty of experience among their young core.

 

[Guyute]

Oh look, another chart proving that if you aren't in the top 5% of the league (elite and always good) or bottom 15% of the league (always bad), your chart is wildly volatile (and therefore not very useful).

 

[eco's bones]

Every team has a 4th line with guys that put up 4th line numbers. Guys on ELC's and cheap contracts are good to have there. It's one reason why Edstrom, Rempe aren't guys I'd be in a hurry to get rid of. It's the main reason why the Rangers moved on from Goodrow who is an excellent bottom line player but you don't want to be paying over $3 and half mil for 4th liners and it's better if some of them are on the younger side.

 

[MrAlmost]

Hagens has pretty much cemeted first overall. Unless we win the lottery or trade for the 1st overall, we won't get him.

 

[GlasgowNewYorkRanger]

We need to hire people in player development who either a) have a record of getting good results out of high draft picks or b) have studied/apprenticed under such people.

You don't like restaurant critic supreme Tanner Glass?

Yeeesh, tough crowd

 

[Guyute]

Hagens has pretty much cemeted first overall. Unless we win the lottery or trade for the 1st overall, we won't get him.

Any of Schaefer, Martone, or Misa would be awesome to add into the mix going forward.

 

[Greschner4]

I think he needs/needed a president above him in the worst way. He’s a fine operative but he needs help with the big picture stuff.

Hank would be perfect for that job.