Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XLVII

[Chalfdiggity3]

See I agree, and also think that the Rangers are going to try and sign a 4th line in free agency this year with one of those guys that can play up in the line-up.

I wouldn't be surprised to see if the Rangers overpay for 1 year or Filpulla. Talking to some guys out west, they think Pujujarvi would have benefitted from having a Finn to help mentor him and get him acclimated to North America, especially given the language barrier for JP.

A guy like Filpulla would be a great road mate and mentor for Kakko. Helps ease the transition. He'd also be that veteran who can slot up and down the line up and be on a short term deal.

I'd like to see us sign guys like panik, Simmonds, and Ennis to play on a 1 year prove it to me contracts that can be had for cheap. Both ennis and panik only made 1.5m and Simmonds at 3. They would be great to have and to trade at the deadline for more picks and assets for the rebuild

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Does he arrive with Kreider in his suitcase?

Sure, if you're giving up 7 instead of 31.

 

[Chainshot]

Sure, if you're giving up 7 instead of 31.

Two expiring UFA's aren't worth 7OA.

 

[Thirty One]

Kreider can't fit in a suitcase. Get real, folks.

 

[Machinehead]

Two expiring UFA's aren't worth 7OA.

We can sign Kreider. I don't feel there's a gun to our head on that.

 

[bobbop]

I'm less concerned with Age in terms of the timeline and more concerned with the acquisition cost.

A rebuilding team is in the midst of accumulating assets to build their team up. If prime assets are traded for a player like Trouba, that is maybe a setback of a year in terms of being able to get those assets, and the team isn't ready to take a step.

I'm more open to signing Karlsson than trading for Trouba. The former would only cost cap space, and would be additive to the assets that the Rangers are building.

A move for Trouba would be a robbing Peter to pay Paul back with 2 years of interest added on.

That's why it doesn't work for "my timeline".

But signing a Panarin or Karlsson. I'm perfectly okay with. It's less about age, and more asset management in my mind.

I’m concerned with the acquisition cost, but frankly I’m more concerned on what the long term view of the player is. This is Trouba’s age 25 season which means a seven year contract would be finished at age 31. Karlsson is 29 which means his contract goes through his age 36 season. Karlsson is the better player and would be more expensive. He also has huge physical concerns. I’m also wondering who fits the current roster better. Taking all of that into consideration, I think Trouba is the better play.

This much we agree on (I think) The defense has to get better and they need to look outside of the organization to do that.

 

[egelband]

Is it a no brainer? 31 isn’t much different from 32...basically it’s a 2nd rounder...wasn’t vesey taken in the 2nd? Young 3rd pair defenseman plus young 3rd line winger for a low first high second...I’d say it’s not super ridiculous.

Exactly. 31oa is barely a first rounder and if you look at what kind of player gets drafted at 31, you're pretty happy if that player becomes Jimmy Vesey. Of course the lottery ticket could become someone way better, too. But Vesey for number 31 sounds reasonable. Particularly if he has a few more years of rfa. Not sure his situation.

 

[Uglybstrd]

Exactly. 31oa is barely a first rounder and if you look at what kind of player gets drafted at 31, you're pretty happy if that player becomes Jimmy Vesey. Of course the lottery ticket could become someone way better, too. But Vesey for number 31 sounds reasonable. Particularly if he has a few more years of rfa. Not sure his situation.

He`s a UFA next summer

 

[pld459666]

Regarding Vesey,

I have no issues with a 3rd line player, producing 3rd line points making 3rd line money.

If hes beat out for a spot by one of the kids in the system, so be it. But I am absolutely not moving him to make room for a kid that hasn't earned the spot.

That's NOT how you build a team

You build a team by letting internal competition determine who and who does not get playing time.

Getting rid of him to open a spot for a younger player because they may be better, in my opinion, is short sighted and dangerous.

Set the precedent that you have to earn the job.

Not that one will be handed to you because you are young.

 

[NYR Viper]

I’m hoping Gorton thinks hard about building a veteran 4th line this year. Nieves is 1/3. Go get a couple of guys to flank him who can fill those roles. Lemieux should be in the top-9. Same goes for Howden, Andersson and Chytil. Strome, Zibanejad and Buch are givens. That leaves two more spots in the top-9. Presumably one goes to Kakko. Find some very good role players and overpay them on shorter length deals

 

[Fitzy]

Regarding Vesey,

I have no issues with a 3rd line player, producing 3rd line points making 3rd line money.

If hes beat out for a spot by one of the kids in the system, so be it. But I am absolutely not moving him to make room for a kid that hasn't earned the spot.

That's NOT how you build a team

You build a team by letting internal competition determine who and who does not get playing time.

Getting rid of him to open a spot for a younger player because they may be better, in my opinion, is short sighted and dangerous.

Set the precedent that you have to earn the job.

Not that one will be handed to you because you are young.

Sure. I wish Vesey was a little better defensively but he's pretty much a typical third liner in every imaginable way, with slightly better offensive production.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Two expiring UFA's aren't worth 7OA.

I wouldn't expect even a signed Kreider to return the 7th OA.

But it'd have a better shot and would be more realistic than thinking that Kreider+Vesey would just take the 31st pick.

As I said earlier, I think Vesey for your 3rd is fair.

 

[egelband]

I'd like to see us sign guys like panik, Simmonds, and Ennis to play on a 1 year prove it to me contracts that can be had for cheap. Both ennis and panik only made 1.5m and Simmonds at 3. They would be great to have and to trade at the deadline for more picks and assets for the rebuild

I do like Ennis. On a smartly-constructed line, guys like that can really outperform his contract, I'd think. Great candidate to get flipped at the tdl, too.

 

[Thirty One]

I'd be pretty upset drafting a 26 year old Vesey at 31st overall. Don't understand that argument.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

Regarding Vesey,

I have no issues with a 3rd line player, producing 3rd line points making 3rd line money.

If hes beat out for a spot by one of the kids in the system, so be it. But I am absolutely not moving him to make room for a kid that hasn't earned the spot.

That's NOT how you build a team

You build a team by letting internal competition determine who and who does not get playing time.

Getting rid of him to open a spot for a younger player because they may be better, in my opinion, is short sighted and dangerous.

Set the precedent that you have to earn the job.

Not that one will be handed to you because you are young.

I don't think anyone's suggesting we move him to free up his roster spot; rather, Friedman reported that the Sabres are interested in acquiring him, and if there's interest around the league, we should definitely be investigating what he might return.

 

[Zibanejbread]

Regarding Vesey,

I have no issues with a 3rd line player, producing 3rd line points making 3rd line money.

If hes beat out for a spot by one of the kids in the system, so be it. But I am absolutely not moving him to make room for a kid that hasn't earned the spot.

That's NOT how you build a team

You build a team by letting internal competition determine who and who does not get playing time.

Getting rid of him to open a spot for a younger player because they may be better, in my opinion, is short sighted and dangerous.

Set the precedent that you have to earn the job.

Not that one will be handed to you because you are young.

It's not just about "making room" for someone - it's also about acquiring an (potentially valuable) asset to help the team long-term for someone who's contract ends after this season.

 

[pld459666]

I don't think anyone's suggesting we move him to free up his roster spot; rather, Friedman reported that the Sabres are interested in acquiring him, and if there's interest around the league, we should definitely be investigating what he might return.

Unless it's a 2nd round pick, there's no sense in making a trade

 

[pld459666]

It's not just about "making room" for someone - it's also about acquiring an (potentially valuable) asset to help the team long-term for someone who's contract ends after this season.

A potentially valuable asset that may (probably not) be as good as Vesey is in 4-5 years?

Unless we get a 2nd round pick in 2019, trading him now makes no sense

 

[HonestGabe]

Regarding Vesey,

I have no issues with a 3rd line player, producing 3rd line points making 3rd line money.

If hes beat out for a spot by one of the kids in the system, so be it. But I am absolutely not moving him to make room for a kid that hasn't earned the spot.

That's NOT how you build a team

You build a team by letting internal competition determine who and who does not get playing time.

Getting rid of him to open a spot for a younger player because they may be better, in my opinion, is short sighted and dangerous.

Set the precedent that you have to earn the job.

Not that one will be handed to you because you are young.

To be fair the Rangers could move Vesey and there are still players on the roster that stand in the way of a 3rd line wing spot for a guy like Kravtsov to have to outperform. Strome, Fast, Lemieux, Chytil, Namestnikov, Lemieux, Andersson and Howden are all going to be candidates for that position in the bottom six depending on who plays the middle. Not to mention they could be eyeing some bottom six veteran free agents that bring other elements to the table to replace him.

The Rangers aren’t and never have been a team that just awards rookies roster spots. I wouldn’t be too worried about the void Jimmy Vesey would leave on a rebuilding franchise.

 

[pld459666]

To be fair the Rangers could move Vesey and there are still players on the roster that stand in the way of a 3rd line wing spot for a guy like Kravtsov to have to outperform. Strome, Fast, Lemieux, Chytil, Namestnikov, Lemieux, Andersson and Howden are all going to be candidates for that position in the bottom six depending on who plays the middle. Not to mention they could be eyeing some bottom six veteran free agents that bring other elements to the table to replace him.

The Rangers aren’t and never have been a team that just awards rookies roster spots. I wouldn’t be too worried about the void Jimmy Vesey would leave on a rebuilding franchise.

Chytil, Lemieux, Lias and Howden are not locks for this team and should not be viewed as such.

They themselves still have to perform well enough to displace veterans. they had decent rookie seasons, well not so much Lias or Howden (he was pretty bad ES player), but they still need to be A LOT better.

 

[RangerBoy]

The Rangers, of course, own Winnipeg’s first-rounder at 20th overall, as part of the bounty — Brendan Lemieux, too — obtained in the lend-lease deal for Kevin Hayes. General manager Jeff Gorton, whom we are told is pushing mighty hard for Trouba, could offer that pick, impending restricted free agent Pavel Buchnevich and, perhaps, Nils Lundkvist to the Jets

https://nypost.com/2019/06/15/rangers-rivals-set-to-battle-for-jets-jacob-trouba-at-steep-cost/

The Rangers can't help themselves. They just can't.

 

[SA16]

Chytil, Lemieux, Lias and Howden are not locks for this team and should not be viewed as such.

They themselves still have to perform well enough to displace veterans. they had decent rookie seasons, well not so much Lias or Howden (he was pretty bad ES player), but they still need to be A LOT better.

Chytil Lemieux and Howden are pretty much locks to be on the team.

 

[Zibanejbread]

Chytil, Lemieux, Lias and Howden are not locks for this team and should not be viewed as such.

They themselves still have to perform well enough to displace veterans. they had decent rookie seasons, well not so much Lias or Howden (he was pretty bad ES player), but they still need to be A LOT better.

Genuinely curious based on this comment - what would your opening night forward lines look like if you were coach?

 

[Avery16]

I'd be pretty upset drafting a 26 year old Vesey at 31st overall. Don't understand that argument.

More or less upset than drafting McIlrath 10th overall? The point is that its a crapshoot, and not all first rounders even suit up in the NHL.

 

[Fitzy]

20, Buch, and Lundy is way too high for Trouba IMO.

Buch is just starting to figure this thing out. He builds a rapport with Kakko and they could be a real solid partnership.