Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XLVII

[bobbop]

Yea it is . Kinda looks like Vegas has to move him and Miller

How can they sign Gusev and Karlsson ?

And Schuldt

 

[SA16]

No way I'm giving up that much for Ehlers. He's coming off a 37 points in 62 games season, has yet to produce in the playoffs (0 points in 6 games this year), and Winnipeg is in a cap crunch. We should be taking advantage of them, not the other way around.

Of course his point totals were low this year he played 15:46 a game and was almost exclusively on the PP2 on a team that gives almost all the PP ice time to the top unit. He only got like 1:25/game on the PP. He also had a bit of a down year but 1.88 pts/game is still excellent.

I've posted this before regarding Nash but since 2006 there have been a total of 3 players in the entire league scoring 60 points in a season that got under 16 mins of ice time (Kucherov being the highest with 65 points).

If you further filter to players who got 10 PP pts or less (to get rid of most of the PP1 guys) the highest scoring season is 53 points. (Sheary who did it in only 61 games stapled to Sid and then Marchand).

He definitely had a down year but he also was played in a role that makes it extremely difficult to put up big numbers.

 

[Vitto79]

Would Yzerman take Shattenkirk for say Abdelkader ?

He makes too much for 4 years but w Lemieux it would be an aggrevating combo

Doubt Helm waives

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

Would Yzerman take Shattenkirk for say Abdelkader ?

He makes too much for 4 years but w Lemieux it would be an aggrevating combo

Doubt Helm waives

I do not like

 

[Vitto79]

I do not like

YEA the 4 yrs part

I just think Shatty goes and it’s hard to find a fit ...maybe a rd for rd like gudas/niskanen was

 

[Trxjw]

I think Skjei and #20 is too much for Ehlers alone, but if the Rangers could get a prospect they really like then maybe it works. It comes down to how the Rangers value the prospect vs who they think they can get at #20. Especially they ship Kreider out for a pick in the teens and they take Kakko and another forward. Do they like a guy like Samberg or Stanley better than defensemen who they can get at 20?

The Rangers will lose a lot of speed up front if they trade Kreider. Ehlers replaces that speed and gives you even more production for less money and is considerably younger. He's a strong target if the deal is around Skjei, IMO.

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

YEA the 4 yrs part

I just think Shatty goes and it’s hard to find a fit ...maybe a rd for rd like gudas/niskanen was

I just don’t really see the rush to move him in the first place

 

[GAGLine]

Would Yzerman take Shattenkirk for say Abdelkader ?

He makes too much for 4 years but w Lemieux it would be an aggrevating combo

Doubt Helm waives

Doesn't matter what Yzerman would do, because Gorton would never do it. I'm really having a hard time understanding what you are thinking here.

 

[Alluckks]

We'd have to make even more forward moves (i.e. trading them away) if we acquired Ehlers

 

[Ola]

Would Yzerman take Shattenkirk for say Abdelkader ?

He makes too much for 4 years but w Lemieux it would be an aggrevating combo

Doubt Helm waives

Niskanen for Gudas, I think it’s that type of deal Gorton can make for Shatty. But I don’t think he wants to do it, it’s his reputation and being forced to dump Shatty is another mark in the L column for Gorts. Remember that Gorton also gave mega bucks to Smith to play on the wrong side, he obviously believe that it still can be done. Don’t be surprised to like see TDA on the left side next season, yes it will be a disaster, but I don’t think he has learned yet.

Shatty will be here, it’s just more comfortable for him. There is this silly notion that Shatty’s value could — increase — in the future, he will get a pass for exploring that.

 

[Mikos87]

the market value is a 1st for $3 mil in cap space based on what?

See post above yours, replied as you were asking to someone else.

I'm pretty sure the cap was $44 million when the Malakhov trade went down.

True but that element hasn't gone up with inflation. You see more contract for contract trades when cap dumps take take place.

There was a lot more to that deal than just Clarkson and the draft picks. In fact it was a terrible deal but also remember the $3MM now was closer to $10MM two seasons ago.

True and insurance did pick up a portion of it. The Horton deal was uninsured so Toronto has been paying straight cash for that one. I dont know all of the details, but insurance picks up a good portion of the Clarkson deal. I think he's owed $3M this year in actual dollars, and there was some more of the 10 you mentioned that insurance picked up.

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

Niskanen for Gudas, I think it’s that type of deal Gorton can make for Shatty. But I don’t think he wants to do it, it’s his reputation and being forced to dump Shatty is another mark in the L column for Gorts. Remember that Gorton also gave mega bucks to Smith to play on the wrong side, he obviously believe that it still can be done. Don’t be surprised to like see TDA on the left side next season, yes it will be a disaster, but I don’t think he has learned yet.

Shatty will be here, it’s just more comfortable for him. There is this silly notion that Shatty’s value could — increase — in the future, he will get a pass for exploring that.

I find it hard to believe that's a factor at all

 

[Vitto79]

Doesn't matter what Yzerman would do, because Gorton would never do it. I'm really having a hard time understanding what you are thinking here.

Open up a RD spot . Can’t see fox, Tda w Shattenkirk on rd they are all PP Dmen

Need to move Him and only way is by taking a meh contract in return

 

[egelband]

Gudas is a clown. He is getting slower by the year. Really not too worried about him.

And if anything we have Lemieux to savagely send out

ADA can sort him out. And Smith can play D while ADA is in the box.

 

[Ola]

Two more years of bad hockey and the Rangers should be ready to get rolling again. Another high lottery pick next June. Multiple first round picks.

You need to read more carefully.

The Rangers need a top center and #1 D.

Skjei isn’t that #1 D but the Rangers could get that top center/another 1st line forward at #10.

I am not sure how this adds up, getting higher picks means that we must get worse compared to last season. For two more years. Why would we then all of a sudden get so much better and be ready to roll again??

Look at Colorado, they got Landeskog and Mackinnon in 11’ and 13’. Had a prime former FOA in EJ and then made one of the bigger steals lately getting Raantanen at 10th OA. Barrie.

Will Colorado make the POs next season? It’s 6 years after they drafted MacKinnon this year.

 

[GAGLine]

Open up a RD spot . Can’t see fox, Tda w Shattenkirk on rd they are all PP Dmen

Need to move Him and only way is by taking a meh contract in return

But Abdelkader's contract is even worse. We'd be better off just buying Shatty out. There are plenty of better options if we're just looking to trade one bad contract for another. David Backes, for one.

 

[Ola]

I find it hard to believe that's a factor at all

Don’t you think Shatty would have been traded by now if we had drafted him 11 years ago instead of signing him as an UFA? Looking at our depth chart and so forth, it’s hard to see any argument for why he shouldn’t have been the first to go.

 

[Ghost of jas]

I think Skjei and #20 is too much for Ehlers alone, but if the Rangers could get a prospect they really like then maybe it works. It comes down to how the Rangers value the prospect vs who they think they can get at #20. Especially they ship Kreider out for a pick in the teens and they take Kakko and another forward. Do they like a guy like Samberg or Stanley better than defensemen who they can get at 20?

The Rangers will lose a lot of speed up front if they trade Kreider. Ehlers replaces that speed and gives you even more production for less money and is considerably younger. He's a strong target if the deal is around Skjei, IMO.

I don’t get the sense that the Rangers are looking to move 20OA, unless they’re moving up.

 

[Mikos87]

If I'm bailing Vegas out, I'm asking for Haula/Eakin and Holden?

Why ?

Rentals. You get picks for acquiring them and bailing Vegas out, and you get more picks by trading them as rentals.

In the interim they provide insulation on the roster.

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

Don’t you think Shatty would have been traded by now if we had drafted him 11 years ago instead of signing him as an UFA? Looking at our depth chart and so forth, it’s hard to see any argument for why he shouldn’t have been the first to go.

Maybe if he was in the last year of his contract like everyone else who's been traded off this team (sans Ryan Spooner, which goes against the Gorton being concerned with his reputation thing). He's also the only RHD on the team with more than 132 games played (ADA).

 

[Trxjw]

I don’t get the sense that the Rangers are looking to move 20OA, unless they’re moving up.

To be honest, I don't see it either but figured I'd give it some thought just to see how it might work out. If they walked away with Kakko and a center they really liked, they might prefer to go D with the 20th pick. Then it comes down to who they could get in the deal vs who is possibly still on the board.

 

[egelband]

Recent performance matters - We've seen that go both ways in a contract year.

Brock Nelson has basically been a 40 point player, had a career season in his contract year and is now making 6 a year.

Kreider's agent is going to point to all the 20+ goal seasons. His closest comparable (both in production and style) is Evander Kane.

Yeah. I think we're seeing the ballpark crystalize. Maybe the Rangers say, "we can trade you or you can take a win-win 5.5mx5-with-ntc and we call it a day".

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

Yeah. I think we're seeing the ballpark crystalize. Maybe the Rangers say, "we can trade you or you can take a win-win 5.5mx5-with-ntc and we call it a day".

I'd love to not give Kreider any sort of protection clause if they're going to extend him (which I also think they shouldn't do)

 

[Ola]

Maybe if he was in the last year of his contract like everyone else who's been traded off this team (sans Ryan Spooner, which goes against the Gorton being concerned with his reputation thing). He's also the only RHD on the team with more than 132 games played (ADA).

So you think it makes sense to keep him around? I don’t, not even remotely.

 

[egelband]

I'd love to not give Kreider any sort of protection clause if they're going to extend him (which I also think they shouldn't do)

I agree. But when a guy signs for less because he wants to stay/doesn't want to be traded he should get some protection.