Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XLV

[Kakko Schmakko]

Arbitration would make sense with Strome there is a legit case. he played with league MVP this season put up 41 assists, he played last year without Panarin and put up only 16 assists. There were also ton of bad penalties and giveaways. Also 4 of his 18 goals were empty netters he led the team in this area. He was 23rd on the team in hits/60, 20th on the team in takeaways/60, 24th on the team in blocked shots/60, was 0 for 3 in shootouts, only 47.5% on faceoffs, etc.

If he doesn't agree to 2/3 years at a modest increase then Arbitration will surely work in Rangers favor.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

If we trade Strome and Chytil plays with Panarin and explodes offensively that could mean he will look to get a big contract even though his numbers were pretty bad in the first 2 seasons. Or will they plug in Howden there to get his stats up before trading him? Or will it be Morgan Barron or Khodorenko?

 

[Vitto79]

If your the new expansion team how many vets do you take w plans on flipping them for picks At the deadline

Strome , Fast If resigned and exposed likely pass through anyway in favour of a kid IMO

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

If your the new expansion team how many vets do you take w plans on flipping them for picks At the deadline

Strome , Fast If resigned and exposed likely pass through anyway in favour of a kid IMO

My biggest fear is that Seattle is going to frantically try to emulate the Golden Knights success, fail miserably and suck for a decade

 

[Vitto79]

If we trade Strome and Chytil plays with Panarin and explodes offensively that could mean he will look to get a big contract even though his numbers were pretty bad in the first 2 seasons. Or will they plug in Howden there to get his stats up before trading him? Or will it be Morgan Barron or Khodorenko?

I think next years roster will be almost identical it’s in 2 years where it gets interesting w Hank , Staal, Smith off the books and expansion considerations

With that said I expect Gorton to try be creative with a trade

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Why are we talking about losing DeAngelo or Buchnevich to keep Strome? We have 14.4 mill to spend without even subtracting one of the goalies. Strome and DeAngelo take 11 mill or less and we have 3.4 to sign Lemieux. I'm doubtful we carry three goalies next year so there's that salary too. Fast might price himself out of a contract here but I don't know why anyone is suggesting we have to move either Strome or DeAngelo.

 

[Vitto79]

Why are we talking about losing DeAngelo or Buchnevich to keep Strome? We have 14.4 mill to spend without even subtracting one of the goalies. Strome and DeAngelo take 11 mill or less and we have 3.4 to sign Lemieux. I'm doubtful we carry three goalies next year so there's that salary too. Fast might price himself out of a contract here but I don't know why anyone is suggesting we have to move either Strome or DeAngelo.

Yea they can sign both Strome and DeAngelo

Georgiev and Fast could go. They may buyout a guy or trade Smith too

 

[DutchShamrock]

Deangelo is much more valuable than Strome. Framing him as a “third pair defenseman” is misleading. He’s easily a top-3 defenseman on this team and one of the most offensively gifted defenseman in the league. He’s way, way more unique of an asset than Strome. The right way to build a team is not trading a dynamic young defenseman in favor of a guy who just had a career year after playing with a superstar.

and yes Chytil is a center, the teams said it, he’s said it, and he’s always played his best hockey there

I didn't intend to be misleading about ADA. I was framing the roster decisions for the rangers. Deangelo will be lining up on our 3rd pair. With cap issues looming, I don't think I sacrifice a 2nd pairing center to retain someone to play 3rd pair minutes for 2nd pair money. It's a painful decision but a reality of the cap world.

Furthermore, we have several promising candidates to take over the 3rd pair but no one has emerged for the 2nd line center, a spot with more responsibility and demands.

Deangelo is great and I think on a trajectory to improve and be valuable. Strome meshes with Panarin, which is being undervalued. But I haven't been touting him as better than Tony or anything. That's on all of you guys reading into it too much. The context of my response was to someone that feels strongly it's an either/or decision. Personally, I think there is a way to navigate this in a way to retain all of Strome, ADA and Buch. I would like to see what happens at the draft and off season. Viable replacements for Strome may emerge.

I'm looking to build the best roster, not accumulate the best pieces regardless of team needs. That means strength down the middle, a formidable top 2 lines, a top 4 to lean on. Again, it's not a knock on Tony or an overvaluation of Strome. It's a choice based on the organization right now.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

Strome is, on a great team, the perfect third line center. Unfortunately, it's tough to pay a guy what he will command in order to be a 3rd line center in the cap world we are living in right now.

 

[Trxjw]

Clearly the only solution is to move DeAngelo to center so he can create the necessary synergy with Panarin.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Clearly the only solution is to move DeAngelo to center so he can create the necessary synergy with Panarin.

Just play Khodorenko with Panarin. Anyone can put up points with him, and he is on an ELC

 

[Do you want ants]

I didn't intend to be misleading about ADA. I was framing the roster decisions for the rangers. Deangelo will be lining up on our 3rd pair. With cap issues looming, I don't think I sacrifice a 2nd pairing center to retain someone to play 3rd pair minutes for 2nd pair money. It's a painful decision but a reality of the cap world.

Furthermore, we have several promising candidates to take over the 3rd pair but no one has emerged for the 2nd line center, a spot with more responsibility and demands.

Deangelo is great and I think on a trajectory to improve and be valuable. Strome meshes with Panarin, which is being undervalued. But I haven't been touting him as better than Tony or anything. That's on all of you guys reading into it too much. The context of my response was to someone that feels strongly it's an either/or decision. Personally, I think there is a way to navigate this in a way to retain all of Strome, ADA and Buch. I would like to see what happens at the draft and off season. Viable replacements for Strome may emerge.

I'm looking to build the best roster, not accumulate the best pieces regardless of team needs. That means strength down the middle, a formidable top 2 lines, a top 4 to lean on. Again, it's not a knock on Tony or an overvaluation of Strome. It's a choice based on the organization right now.

I still keep ADA over Strome. ADA put up almost as many points as Strome while dragging Staal around.

Breadman has proven time and time again he can elevate his line mates (as he should at 11m+).

I think it will be easier to find a replacement for Strome than ADA. Realistically if we’re trading ADA we’re getting a young 2c (who replaces Strome) or top 4 LD anyways.

 

[Lindberg Cheese]

Yea they can sign both Strome and DeAngelo

Georgiev and Fast could go. They may buyout a guy or trade Smith too

- Trade Smith and Lias to OTT for Reilly and a 6th (saves 2.85 in cap and takes care of exp draft D req)
- sign Lemmy (1.2) and Phil G (800k)
- sign ADA with term at 6.2 mil
- sign Strome for 2 years at 5.2 mil (believe he rolls off as Mika becomes FA)
- trade Georgie for a young 4C who has 3C upside or a high 2nd

Gauthier (that’s right) Mika Buch
Pan Strome Kakko/Krav
Krieder (anchors young line) Chytil Kakko/Krav
Lemmy Howton/Georgie trade Phil G

Lindy Fox
Reilly Trouba
Staal ADA
Hajek or cheap vet

Leaves about 1.35 mil under flat cap

 

[NYR Viper]

Had some time on my hands but here goes the next couple of years with the cap staying at $81.5m

Panarin-Strome-Kakko
Kreider-Zibanejad-Buchnevich
Digiuseppe-Chytil-Gauthier
Lemieux-Howden-Grabner

Hajek-Trouba
Lindgren-Fox
Staal-ADA

Shesty
Hank

Cap space = ~$2m

Contract Details:
Strome signs for 4 years @ $5m per season
ADA signs for 6 years @ $5.5m per season
Lemieux signs for 1 year @ $1.15m
Digiuseppe signs for 1 year @ $850k

Trades:
Smith for Grabner
Georgiev to OTT for CLB 2nd '20 + CLB 2nd '21


2021-2022
Staal + Hank + Grabner + Shattenkirk buyout delta + Spooner buyout = $22.5m in cap space

RFA/UFA's for 2021/2022:
Lindgren
Chytil
Shesty
Gauthier
Lemieux
Buch
Howden
Hajek
Digiuseppe

Plenty of cap space available to sign all of these players

The year after that Zibanejad, Fox and Kakko are the only current RFA/UFA's.

If the concern is for that off-season I'd venture a guess that Gorton could find a way to clear out some space as needed at that time. Guys can be traded as younger, more cost effective options become the better route. With the amount of quality young wingers, one would assume the sights would be on Buch/Strome more than likely so as long as these guys don't receive NMC's they should be fine.

 

[egelband]

The Rangers will have a shit load of money coming off the books in 12 months.

The space will be there for him if they want to keep him and the cap won't stay flat forever.

Yeah. The cap is a thing. And it’s a bigger thing now. But the team will keep who they want to keep. It may mean some pain. But I don’t expect any crushing cap casualties. And every team is in the same boat.

I suppose the key is for JG to prioritize the right guys and get some value back for the guys who aren’t in the long-term plans.

 

[GAGLine]

Why are we talking about losing DeAngelo or Buchnevich to keep Strome? We have 14.4 mill to spend without even subtracting one of the goalies. Strome and DeAngelo take 11 mill or less and we have 3.4 to sign Lemieux. I'm doubtful we carry three goalies next year so there's that salary too. Fast might price himself out of a contract here but I don't know why anyone is suggesting we have to move either Strome or DeAngelo.

We don't actually have 14.4 mil to spend. We have to keep some space for call ups. Teams usually like to have between 500k and 1 mil, but let's be generous and say 400k for that, leaving us with 14 mil to spend.

Georgiev isn't under contract for next season, so if we move him, we aren't saving any cap space. If we buy out Hank, we save 3 mil, but then we have to give at least some of that to Georgiev.

If we sign Strome, DeAngelo and Lemieux, that brings us to 6 defensemen and 10 forwards. We need at least 3 more players, who will cost a minimum of 2.1 mil. If we assume Hajek makes the team and Smith becomes the 1 spare at both forward and D, we still need 2 more forwards.

I'm sure we can find a way to make it work. I don't think keeping Strome means we will lose one of Buch or ADA. More likely it means we will buy someone out, whether it's Staal, Smith or Hank. Though, it's also possible that one or both of Strome and ADA sign for less on a one year deal.

Strome 1 year @ 4 mil
ADA 1 year @ 4 mil
Fast 4 years @ 2.5 mil
Lemieux 2 years @ 1.5 mil
Hajek 833,333
D Giuseppe 700k

That's a total of 13.533333 mil, leaving us with roughly 900k.

 

[GAGLine]

What if we added to Strome and got Tage Thompson?

Kreider/Zib/Buch
Panarin/Chytil/Kakko
Lemieux/Howden/Gauthier
Kravstov/Baron/Thompson

How does Thompson have more value than Strome?

 

[egelband]

I'm not confident in DeAngelo being this team player willing to accept what Strome leaves for him like everyone seems to be. I think that's going to be a real interesting negotiation.

Being unhappy about a verrrry lowball contract offer last summer doesn’t necessarily mean he’ll play hardball if given a fair offer. I get the assumption, it’s reasonable. But I, for one, will wait and see.

 

[Avery16]

How does Thompson have more value than Strome?

Thompson is a large, young former 1st on an ELC and in a good development track. What do you think we're going to get for Strome, an inconsistent pending RFA with arbitration rights, who many suspect is coming off a season of inflated production?

 

[NYR Viper]

Thompson is a large, young former 1st on an ELC and in a good development track. What do you think we're going to get for Strome, an inconsistent pending RFA with arbitration rights, who many suspect is coming off a season of inflated production?

Why is he inconsistent? Why can't teams think he has finally been given the right opportunity to grow and develop as originally thought he could?

I know people like to bash Strome but look around the league, how many players had as many points as he had this year? Yes, he was playing with Panarin but not every player can elevate their game and augment a superstar easily. It's a skill unto itself.

 

[Avery16]

Why is he inconsistent? Why can't teams think he has finally been given the right opportunity to grow and develop as originally thought he could?

I know people like to bash Strome but look around the league, how many players had as many points as he had this year? Yes, he was playing with Panarin but not every player can elevate their game and augment a superstar easily. It's a skill unto itself.

Ryan Strome Hockey Stats and Profile at hockeydb.com

43 other players had more points than Strome this season. 61 had more P/GP than Strome this season. None of them had Panarin on their line.

 

[NYR Viper]

Ryan Strome Hockey Stats and Profile at hockeydb.com

43 other players had more points than Strome this season. 61 had more P/GP than Strome this season.

So what you're saying is that, on average, teams have 1.5 players of Strome's production this season. Maybe 2 if you take into account per games played and don't take health into account as some of those guys may be more likely to miss time than Strome.

 

[GAGLine]

Thompson is a large, young former 1st on an ELC and in a good development track. What do you think we're going to get for Strome, an inconsistent pending RFA with arbitration rights, who many suspect is coming off a season of inflated production?

Thompson has shown little at the NHL level to this point, and he missed most of this year due to shoulder surgery. Until he plays again, we don't know how that injury will affect him going forward. I see him as being similar to Gauthier. Would you have added to Strome to get Gauthier?

I'm sure other GMs have their questions about Strome, but we know what his value is to the Rangers. I'd be okay with trading Strome (assuming Chytil can handle 2C) to take a chance on Thompson, but we shouldn't be adding anything to get him. However you view Thompson, he's a serious downgrade in the short term and an uncertainty to ever produce in the long term.

 

[Avery16]

So what you're saying is that, on average, teams have 1.5 players of Strome's production this season. Maybe 2 if you take into account per games played and don't take health into account as some of those guys may be more likely to miss time than Strome.

I'd say that is a fair comparison for teams that also have Panarin on that 1.5 player's line.

 

[NYR Viper]

I'd say that is a fair comparison for teams that also have Panarin on that 1.5 player's line.

Panarin had an awesome year, but there are other good players in the league besides him