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Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XLIX

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GoAwayStaal said:
JD's a smart dude, he wouldn't want to publicly put unnecessary pressure on his team or coaches. I would be surprised if the internal expectation isn't to make the playoffs next year.

They aren't going to nuke everything and trade for vets all over the place, but its obvious changes are coming. Perhaps its as simple as signing a 4th line body and swapping a skill forward for a heavy, but they shouldn't limit themselves right now just because they have money coming of the books in a year. If anything, the cap situation will probably present more opportunities that otherwise would not be available.* Like it or not, the clock has started ticking with this group. Time isn't up and they don't need to cash in an win next season (I think that 21-22 is the year this team becomes a contender) but they do need to continue to take some steps forward. The FO knows where there issues are and they're not stupid (except when it comes to Staal), I would expect them to do everything they can within reason to intelligently address those areas.

* Not DeAngelo for 2 UFAs. But it wouldn't be a good idea to turn away guys who could be long term pieces who are part of the solution.
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I'm with you on this 100%. I'm just saying I don't want them going out and getting a guy on the wrong side of 30 to fill their needs.
 
nyr2k2 said:
For some guys it is, for some guys it isn't. And honestly my experience is that in any sport, the higher you move up and the more talented the player, those are the guys that often are more resistant to making any kind of change. They're so good doing what they do in the position that they do it, there is some amount of mental block preventing them from being as successful.

I've watched Ovechkin play on the right many times, and he's just not as effective. You put him on the right and you largely eliminate that insane one-timer from the dot of his, and worse, you eliminate his go-to move which is to skate down the left-side boards, make a quick cut in, and release that devastating wrister using the defender as a screen. So he can play the right, and still be a productive player, but he's much more deadly on the left.

The same hold true for lots of guys.
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I understand what you are saying but that is not the case with every player. I think Kreider would be fine on the right side going forward for example
 
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nyr2k2 said:
The thing with Georgiev is that it is far from a guarantee that his value increase. Given this inconsistent nature, and the small sample size associated with being a backup goalie, I can absolutely envision a scenario where his overall numbers at the end of the year are poor because of the small sample and a handful of dreadful starts. I'm not sure there is a ton of room to substantially increase his value, however I think there is more room for his value to drop. A bad season turns him into a 25-year-old career backup, approaching UFA, who has yet to show he is capable of playing consistently or being a full time starter.

I think it's important for the team to maximize his value, and I'm not sure if there's going to be a better time than now, particularly given the realities of the flat cap and all that. It would be a gamble to hold onto him and bank on his value increasing, or at least holding steady.

If it's me, I'm moving Georgiev for the best I can get, signing a 4A guy for two years to expose in the draft, and hoping that in two years someone like Wall or Huska is ready to step in (and if they aren't, acquiring a better backup for cheap).*

*Predicated on Lundqvist being willing to be a backup. If not, that changes the game completely.
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I see it as Georgiev value as a young RFA goalie who shouldn't be very expensive TO THE RANGERS is more beneficial than his current trade value including the risk of potential loss of value). You can disagree but this is the thought that Carp was trying to convey.
 
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Rangers in 7 said:
I understand what you are saying but that is not the case with every player. I think Kreider would be fine on the right side going forward for example
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I mean I guess you can try. Won't know until you try. We've moved lots of guys around over the years--Zuccarello from side to side, Hayes from wing to center, Miller at W and C, Vesey on both wings, Nash on both wings, Namestnikov at C and W. Pretty sure we moved Fast to both sides, Boyle of course played W and C, as did Dom Moore. Towards the end we did the same with Richards, although that was a bit different.

All of those guys were shuffled around where they lined up, but each one I think pretty clearly had one spot where they were much better and more comfortable than the other. It's good to be versatile but it's also important to have a minimal drop-off in play when you move around the lineup. I liken it to be and being "ambidextrous"; I can do almost everything with both hands/from both sides, but each activity I absolutely have a dominant hand/foot/side that is pretty significantly better than the other.

I played soccer at various levels for 25+ years and while my left foot is fine, if I'm playing in the field I'm far more comfortable and effective on the right. I can just do more things down the right side with the ball on my right foot. I play differently if I'm on the left as I'm often looking to cut back into the center to use my right than to send a ball into the middle from my left. It changes the approach.

Anyway, I agree that you don't know until you try. One of Krieder's best attributes is setting up in front of the net. I wouldn't expect that to be impacted by which side he played on. I would say his second-best attribute is streaking down the wing, beating a guy outside, and going hard to the net. If he's on the right and carrying the puck on his backhand, I could totally see that being an impediment.
 
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kovazub94 said:
I see it as Georgiev value as a young RFA goalie who shouldn't be very expensive TO THE RANGERS is more beneficial than his current trade value including the risk of potential loss of value). You can disagree but this is the thought that Carp was trying to convey.
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I understand, I just look at the situation in a larger context. Because there's the issue of what to do with three goalies, but also how to deal with freeing up cap space.

As I've said a few times, the value of moving from Staal to an average 5/6 D and keeping Hank as the backup while recouping some assets from Georgiev is likely greater than moving on from Hank to keep Georgiev and still sending out Staal. I think if we look at the goalie situation in a vacuum that it is a mistake, as there is more that needs to be considered; the goalie situation is linked to the greater cap situation, and that can be affected by other moves.
 
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kovazub94 said:
Carp didn’t frame the goalie point correctly. Here’s the chain of decisions as I see it:

1. The Rangers will not go into next season with three goalies

2. From the performance perspective and ALSO from the cap perspective they determined that Hank is the odd man out

3. Georgiev will be Shesterkin backup as he has controlled RFA years and who still has room to improve (to those thinking his value will never be higher)

4. Georgiev current trade value is not worth moving him so, unless another team comes up with exuberant offer, the Rangers are not moving him
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i agree!!

Unless it’s a great offer there should be no rush to move Georgiev.
 
Avery16 said:
Here's a reason: He's an RFA with arbitration rights and may not want to sign up as Igor's backup.
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that’s true, but the Rangers don’t need to force him out the door b/c they have the inexpensive option for all of next year. With the next season supposedly beginning in Dec (have no idea how), that means Georgiev has to be moved out in approx 60-90 days? We’re closing in on Sept. There shouldn’t be a hurry.
 
I have a really hard time seeing Georgiev building up much value as a back-up next season. He might get a bit better overall but I can't see a team suddenly being more excited for a guy who proved he could be a better back up than the year before.

Even if he's just a sweetener in a trade to a team that wants to roll the dice on him like Calgary, Chicago, or Edmonton, I don't think his value to the Rangers outweighs the potential in trade. Especially if this team intends to ride Igor as much as possible.
 
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TheBloodyNine said:
I'm with you on this 100%. I'm just saying I don't want them going out and getting a guy on the wrong side of 30 to fill their needs.
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I'm really doubtful they get anyone over 30 unless its a bottom 6, 1 mill a year type. Im not sure why people here want guys like Koivu and Bozak, it goes totally against what Gorton's vision of this team and I'd guarantee it doesn't happen atleast until this team is a player away from a cup.
 
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Gorton and JD's biggest job right now is to get to Zib's (and maybe to a lesser extent Lafreniere's) contract negotiation in a good financial place. They aren't offer sheeting anyone or trading for big salary. That's how you end up like Toronto. The asset accumulation phase of the rebuild is over. Bury it. They have their superstar(s), their young nucleus, and their veterans. I'm sure they'll supplement the roster with some depth signings or trades, but this is the team they're going to start the run with. With what they have on the roster and what's on the way, there's no reason this team shouldn't be a legitimate Cup contender in the next 2-3 seasons. I have full confidence management won't do anything stupid to f*** it up.
 
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We need six, good defensive, hard to play against forwards with some offense on the bottom 6 forwards.s. Chytil and Buchnevich don't fit the 3rd or 4th line profile. Howden, Lemieux, Fast who they should sign, Gauthier, Richards and Barron. I believe Barron and Richards are mature enough to have good rookie seasons. So to me Chytil and Buchnevich are trade chips for a legit second line center.
 
I think a team like Chicago would take Lundqvist at 50% and id say Hank would go there knowing they are a decent team that needs a number 1. Another team that obviously needs someone is Edmonton, how does Anderson, Hank(50%) for Puuijarvi and a 2nd or 3rd sound? Sounds decent to me.
 
Kinda like this Roope Hintz kid in Dallas. Although the Stars seem to be in pretty good cap shape. The do have a pretty old roster though.
 
Pawnee Rangers said:
Gorton and JD's biggest job right now is to get to Zib's (and maybe to a lesser extent Lafreniere's) contract negotiation in a good financial place. They aren't offer sheeting anyone or trading for big salary. That's how you end up like Toronto. The asset accumulation phase of the rebuild is over. Bury it. They have their superstar(s), their young nucleus, and their veterans. I'm sure they'll supplement the roster with some depth signings or trades, but this is the team they're going to start the run with. With what they have on the roster and what's on the way, there's no reason this team shouldn't be a legitimate Cup contender in the next 2-3 seasons. I have full confidence management won't do anything stupid to f*** it up.
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Im a little concerned about Zibs contract, looking internally Panarin makes 12, on the bottom side, he'd have to make more than Trouba. So where is his deal? 9 seems to be the minimum to me, with potential to get to 10? These are the deals that can derail a franchise.
 
NYSPORTS said:
i think Hank likes the celebrity hockey life in NY and there is nothing appealing to him deep in the Pacific Northwest. Not to mention the brutal travel schedule.
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How much does he like retiring or not dressing....cus those are the other two options. Hank is extremely competitive, im really doubtful he is done playing hockey, his only route to another contract is to be the starter on another team.
 
NYSPORTS said:
that’s true, but the Rangers don’t need to force him out the door b/c they have the inexpensive option for all of next year. With the next season supposedly beginning in Dec (have no idea how), that means Georgiev has to be moved out in approx 60-90 days? We’re closing in on Sept. There shouldn’t be a hurry.
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No hurry, and no forcing. If there's a good offer out there, we should entertain it.
 
KreiderBomb said:
Im a little concerned about Zibs contract, looking internally Panarin makes 12, on the bottom side, he'd have to make more than Trouba. So where is his deal? 9 seems to be the minimum to me, with potential to get to 10? These are the deals that can derail a franchise.
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I agree about derailing the franchise. And I have no idea what they'll do but they can't go into it being hamstrung or forced into making a bad deal. I think if they're smart the next few seasons, they'll be in as good as shape as possible. To me, Chytil is the x factor. If he can earn that 2C spot, they should be ok.
 
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