Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XIV (To trade or not to trade is the question)

[JohnC]

Last night was less of a disgrace and more just a sad show of a team that was fundamentally broken from the top down. They're all in their own heads, can't string two consecutive plays together, and just in general are fighting everything. They've somehow morphed into a horrible Frankenstein of the 2016-17 team and the 2022-23 Flames, which is ironic considering people are actually suggesting bringing in that dipshit Darryl Sutter.

The organization needs to take a big step back and look at how they've gotten here because the entire process is just fundamentally broken. I'm tired of mentioning it, but Drury just hasn't brought in enough of the right guys to help in that respect, even though there have been some improvements overall. The glaring issue to me is that this team really has no clue what they want to be. They can keep preaching an identity and all that nonsense, but it's nothing but lip service.

Why hasn't anyone pressed Laviolette on the switch to a fully man-on-man system this year? Andrew Brunette had to answer for it in Nashville, why is he safe here in that respect? Who looks at this defense and thinks that they have the horses to actually pulll that system off? Who looks at the way these forwards cherry pick and provide zero close-ice support and think it could work? I mean, just look at the breakdown last night that led to CONNOR MURPHY having that much time and space to skate in on Igor and try to pick a corner. The forwards got lost on their assignment up high, and the D just sat back trying to cover their two guys down low because they were outnumbered once Murphy broke in. Why are they trying to re-invent the wheel when the flaws of this team are pretty obvious?

This is why I thought Laviolette was going to be such a terrible hire for this specific group of players. I gave him credit for some changes last year and was glad to admit being wrong on some things, but the overall issues are still there: he's a one-year coach that literally just got fired for losing his locker room and having the core tune out his message. Why did we think it was going to be different here? They had the right idea looking at guys like Carberry and Knoblauch, but we went with the standard retread and are yet again at the nexus point of canning another coach.

At this point, I'm done waiting around for the roster to get it together. This core has had their kicks at the can, and they need to start retooling. There is a good young NHL nucleus there in Chytil, Cuylle, Fox, Kakko, Lafreniere, Miller, and Schneider. I'm not going to be shocked when they move Miller and he blossoms elsewhere. Housley has just been a ridiculous failure at helping these dmen grow.

As to the next coach, I honestly don't even know what route to go there. I'd guess Muse or Peca as interim and then re-assess in the offseason. Trade the other guys like Kreider and Lindgren now. I don't want to do it, but I'd see what 1.5 years of Panarin gets you on the trade market. They have the talent on W to grow into a role and replace him in the aggregate eventually. Stop trading Fox you donuts. Maybe draft a center every now and then too

I’ve been trying to figure out what in the hell happened to the initial system Lavi implemented at the beginning of last season. The team looked defensively competent for the first time in years and it vanished into thin air after 15 games.

 

[Machinehead]

I’ve been trying to figure out what in the hell happened to the initial system Lavi implemented at the beginning of last season. The team looked defensively competent for the first time in years and it vanished into thin air after 15 games.

He realized, like everyone before him did, that this group of players stops scoring if they have to play a system. They were pretty tight last night aside from Zibanejad and Miller making horrendous errors, and they generated nothing.

That's lack of talent. You need good passing and puck-carrying ability to generate offense without cheating. This team going from their own zone to the opponent's zone, without flying and causing a rush, is like watching somebody climb Everest.

 

[toNYRico]

I’ve been trying to figure out what in the hell happened to the initial system Lavi implemented at the beginning of last season. The team looked defensively competent for the first time in years and it vanished into thin air after 15 games.

That 1-3-1 against Buffalo opening night last season looked lethal. What the hell happened is right. We need to ban man-on-man in the D zone.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

We're not going to get Tkachuk at all now that their owner has spoken out against the Rangers about it so might as well move on to someone else.

Also, as much as people prop up Tkachuk as a "lead you into battle" type, we've never actually seen the dude in the playoffs. That's a risk with anyone.

We know for a fact that Lafreniere can whip out his nuts in the playoffs. He was great against Florida.

he doesn’t need to lead. He’s a really good player, he’s young, and still has offensive upside to reach.

That’s why I would want him, not for leadership

 

[McRanger92]

Remember that win vs. Buffalo during '21-22 where Gallant looked pissed / was screaming at Mika right after the game ended? I'd sign up for that again right now. Enough coddling.

I member. With like 30 seconds to go Mika was whining to the refs for a call while the Rangers were fighting to get a late goal. Not much has changed. I think that was the game with the last second Lindgren goal to win, but could be wrong.

 

[Machinehead]

he doesn’t need to lead. He’s a really good player, he’s young, and still has offensive upside to reach.

That’s why I would want him, not for leadership

That would put you, I think, in the minority.

People are still hanging onto the idea that somebody just needs to lead this team.

They don't need to add salt, they need to throw out the meal and the oven they cooked it in.

 

[Ruggs225]

I’m

That's another thing, some of the returns being floated out are like "nah tho."

I would absolutely keep a 23 year old Lafreniere over Tkachuk.

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Lafreniere is a really good player. His defense is improving and he drives 5v5 offense like crazy. He plays with an edge. He's 23 and has a really good contract. He's a non-starter for me unless it was something stupid like McDavid that would never happen.

is his defense actually improving? Honest question. To me he seems worse than ever defensively. Offensively he is great, but even there i want to see the puck on his stick more. He tends ro defer to panarin alot, and then tried to get open for a shot, which is good. But i think he can be a real facilitator out there in addition to scoring.

He is my favorite current ranger though along with chytil and cuylle.

 

[Machinehead]

I’m

is his defense actually improving? Honest question. To me he seems worse than ever defensively. Offensively he is great, but even there i want to see the puck on his stick more. He tends ro defer to panarin alot, and then tried to get open for a shot, which is good. But i think he can be a real facilitator out there in addition to scoring.

He is my favorite current ranger though along with chytil and cuylle.

The team around him is playing worse than ever defensively. He still makes dumb mistakes but teams are generating less with him on the ice than last year, by a lot.

 

[McRanger92]

he doesn’t need to lead. He’s a really good player, he’s young, and still has offensive upside to reach.

That’s why I would want him, not for leadership

Yeah I mean there's only really one person projecting the "savior" complex on Brady Tkachuk and it's not really the people who want him as far as I can see. I want him because we need more players who can play the heavy game he does, to go along with who we already have here like Laf and Cuylle. He'd certainly give us more than a 35 year old Chris Kreider in all situations.

But we might as well kiss it goodbye now because I think Andlauer would rather be skinned alive than trade him here and face that indignation.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

The biggest problem with Brady Tkachuk is most people here think he’s as good as Matt.

 

[Hire Sather]

Odd thing to say considering we have a legit gem prospect from there.

That's fine but it seems they never go outside that box

 

[Cusedog]

I’ve been trying to figure out what in the hell happened to the initial system Lavi implemented at the beginning of last season. The team looked defensively competent for the first time in years and it vanished into thin air after 15 games.

The forwards played 200 ft hockey for much of last year. in my opinion, it has not been the case this year. and is why the Rangers defenseman are continually backing up so far in the defensive zone. Too many are hanging along the boards awaiting break out passes.. It appears some never showed up in shape to play this brand of hockey IMHO.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

The biggest problem with Brady Tkachuk is most people here think he’s as good as Matt.

he could become as good. Mayb never score 115 points but 90+ points plus his physicality? yes please. He's much bigger and more Physical than Matt, maybe a little less skilled

 

[McRanger92]

The biggest problem with Brady Tkachuk is most people here think he’s as good as Matt.

I think the biggest problem is that people are getting bogged down by what they think he is and isnt, instead of just acknowledging the fact that he's a great player and would enormously help the group of emotionless sad sacks we root for.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

That would put you, I think, in the minority.

People are still hanging onto the idea that somebody just needs to lead this team.

They don't need to add salt, they need to throw out the meal and the oven they cooked it in.

well i do see what they mean, without anointing him as a captain or whatever, but his style of play is the antidote we need. He's an asshole and plays like one.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

he could become as good. Mayb never score 115 points but 90+ points plus his physicality? yes please. He's much bigger and more Physical than Matt, maybe a little less skilled

He won’t be as good because he doesn’t have the same head for the game and is less skilled.

Hes a menace in the paint and an A+ troll.

Good or very good player? Yeah.

Matthew is elite. The list of players I’d take over him in this league is 2 players long.

 

[Mac n Gs]

I'm mostly kidding.

But here are my things with Tkachuk.

-I'm tired of the way he's fellated. Like, just enough already.

-To that same point, people treat him like a panacea. If you put him on this team and change nothing else, they're still a bad team.

-He has a lot of bad habits and I think a lot of the people clamoring for it would be the same people pissed off by the third game. I just don't have the energy to read it.

-He's ugly.

If we got him, I would be mostly happy about it.

I don't want him for all of the intangibles nonsense, even though there are elements of it that I actually do like about him as a person. I want him because he's a phenomenal 5v5 scorer and makes his absolute living generating chances between the dots. That's anathema to this Rangers team, and I don't mean the tropes of spamming shots and crashing the net. I mean it from a perspective of controlling play between the circles and moving bodies and pucks through the inner slot.

I’ve been trying to figure out what in the hell happened to the initial system Lavi implemented at the beginning of last season. The team looked defensively competent for the first time in years and it vanished into thin air after 15 games.

It's swinging to the extreme to try to open up offense 5v5 without looking at how other teams can play more zone yet still somehow move the puck systemically and attack with speed. They just simply cannot figure out how to get these guys to buy into 5-man units.

 

[McRanger92]

He won’t be as good because he doesn’t have the same head for the game and is less skilled.

Hes a menace in the paint and an A+ troll.

Good or very good player? Yeah.

Matthew is elite. The list of players I’d take over him in this league is 2 players long.

Lafreniere is closer to Matthew than Brady is.

 

[toNYRico]

What do we think of Lawson Crouse as a trade target?

 

[Machinehead]

I think the biggest problem is that people are getting bogged down by what they think he is and isnt, instead of just acknowledging the fact that he's a great player and would enormously help the group of emotionless sad sacks we root for.

So is Rantanen, who is a UFA and could conceivably be had for no assets, and people don't champion Rantanen to the point of exhaustion.

 

[will1066]

Lafreniere is closer to Matthew than Brady is.

Don't make me laf.

Seriously, he's butter-soft right now and has so much to go in filling the gap to his potential. He's not even Brady right now.

 

[Machinehead]

What do we think of Lawson Crouse as a trade target?

Things n stuff player who isn't actually good at anything.

 

[NYR Viper]

So is Rantanen, who is a UFA and could conceivably be had for no assets, and people don't champion Rantanen to the point of exhaustion.

What's your opinion on Ehlers? Genuinely curious

 

[Machinehead]

What's your opinion on Ehlers? Genuinely curious

Good 5v5 player with wheels but his shocking resume in the playoffs is a point of concern.

 

[will1066]

What's your opinion on Ehlers? Genuinely curious

Pass. His profile fits the current team.