Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XIII
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NYR Viper
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I'd be just fine playing Beleskey AND Kassian on the 4th line. Centered by Fogarty.
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
You keep on saying this and it continues to be untrue. The Penguins signed Gonchar in 2005. The Bruins signed Chara in 2006. Pretty much all of the Cup winners since the 05 lockout brought in significant veteran pieces of their Cup winning rosters via free agency or trade while they were still bad. Rebuilding teams do this all the time.
And while I agree with the need to have a homegrown superstar, that's more about the lack of available superstars who already play for other teams than some devotion to drafting and developing alone. Because of that, they need to draft and develop a superstar forward (top-5 at their position) and at least 1 other forward or 1 other D who is top-10 at their position.. Then they need to find 2 more skaters who are top-15 in their position, whether that's through trade, free agency, or homegrown doesn't matter. They need to draft and develop tweener depth, plus augment it with a veteran or two from trade or free agency. And they need a goalie capable of stealing games, though not necessarily a goalie at the very top of the league... doesn't matter how they acquire him. Rangers management needs to do ALL of this.
There are parts of this that the Rangers already have, though some of them are trumped by the future assets they can get in return in order to try to draft and develop those top-end players. There are parts they already hopefully have in the system: Shestyorkin could take care of the goalie element, plus hopefully at least one of Chytil, Andersson, Kravtsov, Hajek, or Miller develop into a top-10 player at their position. Your likelihood of drafting all 4 skaters you need who are top players at their positions is really really small. Nobody has done it. The Penguins didn't. The Blackhawks didn't. The Kings didn't. The Bruins didn't. The Capitals didn't.
The teams that win the Cup fill in those blanks when the opportunity to do so presents itself, regardless of where they are in the rebuilding process.
Lion Hound
Pornhub Enthusiast
Hayes concerns me. I do think this is the year he is on the move. Always a market for the big rangy, two-way center. He seems to be part of the true core here, and one of the more popular lads in the room, but on the ice its been a very different story this season. I feel like this year, he just doesn't fit with any of the linemates he's given. Actually, since Miller was traded I don't think he's played to his potential. He's frustrated on the ice. If GMJG can garner a a similar return to what Hanzal got the Rangers should swing that deal.
I'm sure Zucc is getting all sorts of interest, but i can;t see the Rangers trading him.
Machinehead
Fox Mafia Consigliere
Agree with all of this.
I don't think a rebuild should ban you from free agency at all. The only thing it should ban you from is trading picks/youth for older players.
As you said, almost every successful rebuild went into free agency before the rebuild was over.
I Eat Crow
Fear The Mullet
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It is possible to rebuild and add significant pieces in free agency. Panarin is 27. He's not 37. He's still going to be a good player when the next cycle of contention comes for the Rangers.
East Coast Bias
Registered User
You guys are arguing with someone who literally hates paying anyone. Has there ever been a contract signed, outside of an ELC, that RB has supported? For any player, for any team? Ever?
I mean he declared Toronto dead because they signed Tavares this offseason. Laments Nylander for his demands.
By the time a team in his ideal rebuild is competitive, the guys drafted at the start are going to be due big contracts (if they perform) and then he'll be bashing contracts offered to them. Trade them. Rinse. Repeat.
I mean he declared Toronto dead because they signed Tavares this offseason. Laments Nylander for his demands.
By the time a team in his ideal rebuild is competitive, the guys drafted at the start are going to be due big contracts (if they perform) and then he'll be bashing contracts offered to them. Trade them. Rinse. Repeat.
Off Sides
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Wait, so the idea would be for the Rangers to sign UFAs to make them better so their odds in the draft lottery are worse?
The difference between those teams and the Rangers? Sans Boston, they had the cream of the crop from some draft or another first, sometimes two or three drafts before they went out and signed those types of UFAs.
Are we not back at trying to replicate the Boston model that may have been more of an outlier than the norm?
The difference between those teams and the Rangers? Sans Boston, they had the cream of the crop from some draft or another first, sometimes two or three drafts before they went out and signed those types of UFAs.
Are we not back at trying to replicate the Boston model that may have been more of an outlier than the norm?
Mac n Gs
Drury plz
- Jan 17, 2014
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Phenomenal post. Hell to even add to your point, that 05-06 team had Crosby almost leading the league in scoring and they still finished second worst overall. Ziggy Palfy was f***ing wrecking people for half of that season too, so it’s not like they were bereft of talent. Having it all work at the right time (Malkin coming over, Gonchar being there to be his mentor, Crosby being Crosby, Staal stepping in as the 3C) was what kickstarted their decade of success. Getting Hughes doesn’t immediately mean we have to rule out having another lotto pick next season, but it sure as hell helps us line up with a strong push to be a contender in 20-21.
If Gorton hasn’t put together a competitive on-ice product by then, is he really doing his job well? That’s a time period where Lias, Kravtsov, Chytil, Howden, etc should all be hitting their prime.
MetalJaws
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The rebuild could be over real quick if we get a top 3 pick and a FA like Panarin or Stone. It would be a pretty quick turnaround to a PO spot, maybe 20-21.
Trade: Hayes, McQuaid, Spooner, Smith and Vesey for best possible returns. Hold onto Zucc for hank, the team and fans.
This Roster would be great to watch! Some time to grow and it could be something special. Plenty of skill. D can be fixed through FA and Trades. Still have plenty of picks in 2019 and 20 to help down the road. This turns the rebuild around and makes the team exciting. Young, skilled and just sit back watch who develops into something awesome.
Panarin - Zib - Zucc
Buch - LA - Kravtsov
Kreider - Chytil - Kakko
Names - Howden - Fast
Skjei - ADA
Miller - Shatty
Lindgren/Hajek - Pionk
Staal
Hank
Shesty
Trade: Hayes, McQuaid, Spooner, Smith and Vesey for best possible returns. Hold onto Zucc for hank, the team and fans.
This Roster would be great to watch! Some time to grow and it could be something special. Plenty of skill. D can be fixed through FA and Trades. Still have plenty of picks in 2019 and 20 to help down the road. This turns the rebuild around and makes the team exciting. Young, skilled and just sit back watch who develops into something awesome.
Panarin - Zib - Zucc
Buch - LA - Kravtsov
Kreider - Chytil - Kakko
Names - Howden - Fast
Skjei - ADA
Miller - Shatty
Lindgren/Hajek - Pionk
Staal
Hank
Shesty
Amazing Kreiderman
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NYR Viper
Registered User
I think RB's main point is it's no longer about just putting the best team together, it's more about timing and p/$ int eh cap world. They have to be economical with where and when they spend. I'm sure most people don't disagree with that. The disagreement comes from when is it okay to start paying and who that player is. Some think Panarin is that guy. Some think he's not. Some thing next year is too early. Some don't. There are so many variables that could occur between now and next UFA period.
BBKers
Registered User
I think the Rangers will make a move right after the road trip. Maybe minor. But a small shakeup. I think we will see lots of m0vement until the TDL and maybe at next years draft too. GMJG has his work cut out. For sure.
NYR Viper
Registered User
I think they could use a more solidified and consistent 4th line. There's nothing wrong with having a 4th line who knows their role and can help take some of the tougher minutes in the D-zone for a year or two.
Thirty One
Safe is safe.
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Siri, show me the most dramatic interpretation possible.
LORDE
I am Lorde, YA YA YA
I think everyone would agree that IF we were to pick #1 or even #2, then Panarin would be fine to add.
The problem is what happens when that doesn't happen... that's where you'll find factions going their separate ways.
Nylander, for the pipe dream it is... is an entirely different matter since it would cost via trade and we are in no position for that.
The problem is what happens when that doesn't happen... that's where you'll find factions going their separate ways.
Nylander, for the pipe dream it is... is an entirely different matter since it would cost via trade and we are in no position for that.
NYR Viper
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Off Sides
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At least then I would understand the comparisons to those other teams a little more, albeit he is not going to help the D-core be any better.
Which leads to my next notion, it would not likely be just Panarin, the Rangers would do all sort of spending on stuff where some of it is going to work and some not, isn't that kind of how they have been doing stuff forever already?
Can they maybe take a step back for two straight off-season before they go on a spending spree even if they do get a top pick?
Maybe see what they actually have before they just assume they need to fill this or that spot with more UFAs?
effen
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In basketball, there's a stat nerd favorite podcast called Dunc'd On. They take a giant dump on I'd say 95-98% of contracts because in their mind the only good ones are for top 5 players and guys on ELCs/undrafted guys making the minimum. Combination of infuriating and amusing to listen to.
SA16
Sixstring
Panarin would be here for seven years. Staal/Smith/Shattenkirk contracts all end two years into a potential Panarin deal. Really can't see how one has anything to do with the other.
effen
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This doesn't make any sense at all. If you can add a guy 27 who's a top 15 player at his position for just money, you do it.
Endless bellyaching on this board about a lack of elite talent, but the prospect of adding one comes with demands that the situation must be perfect. I don't get it.
LORDE
I am Lorde, YA YA YA
I'm certainly (and have been) on board with this line of thinking. I think the issue is that Panarin supposedly wants to come here and you don't see players of the ilk come available often.
But again, the draft is 8 months away still. All of this is just yapping because the team blows, the kids haven't been lighting it up and we have very little else to discuss lol.
JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK
Twenty f*ckin years
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Edge
Kris King's Ghost
Considering the Rangers prospect depth is deeper at center, I am genuinely curious to see how they approach the situation.
With or without Hughes, even picking 3-5, there's a very good chance they could be looking at another center.
There's not a long list of guys who stop and make you take notice on the wings, so Panarin isn't pushing anyone our of the way necessarily.
Could the Rangers be thinking they'd like to surround their emerging center prospects with help on the wings?
There's so many variables and unknowns at this time, but I will say that I believe an interest in Panarin is probably a little deeper than simply wanting to speed up the process.
But let's hypothetically say the Rangers have their greatest draft day in 32 years and take Hughes first overall. There's a world of possibilities that open up, including whether they look to move Chytil and/or Andersson to the wings, whether they move guys to get help on defense, who is available both as a free agent and potentially via trade, etc. Panarin would certainly be an intriguing option to slide into that mix.
But beyond that particular scenario, I feel like Panarin is a guy who could potentially be on the radar as a constant in any number of possible scenarios.
LaffyTaffy
Brooklyn-Belarussian
How minor are we talking? And is this something you're hearing or just speculation?
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