Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XIII (Nanaki edition)

[will1066]

View attachment 922873

Kinda resembles Tanev

 

[Ruggs225]

Zibanejad's stats are buoyed by the one year he scored at a pace close to 70 (@Leonardo87 that's right, buoyed!). He's not the goal-scorer Kreider is.

Not really. Zib has 7 season with at least 10 PP goals. Kreider has 3.

Zib has 2 seasons of 15 and one of 20.

Kreider has one 18 year and one 26 year.

If anything Kreider has been buoyed by those two abnormal years. Like when he magically popped 50 and had 26 Pp goals. That was not normal.

 

[will1066]

Not really. Zib has 7 season with at least 10 PP goals. Kreider has 3.

Zib has 2 seasons of 15 and one of 20.

Kreider has one 18 year and one 26 year.

If anything Kreider has been buoyed by those two abnormal years. Like when he magically popped 50 and had 26 Pp goals. That was not normal.

I see what you did there

 

[Machinehead]

I know you like the advanced stats and such. Do you know how to get Zibanejad's WAR% year over year in those player cards or something similar?

I am curious about his rise and fall over the years

He's been all over the place pretty much since he got here. The analytics people always said that he has talent, but he's not a guy you hitch the flagship to because he has bad seasons. I think with the new contract, and as the expectations grew, people just noticed it more.

 

[Paulie Walnutz]

Lavi taking the A away from Mika and giving it to Rempe after he kills Wilson tomorrow night

 

[Machinehead]

Not really. Zib has 7 season with at least 10 PP goals. Kreider has 3.

Zib has 2 seasons of 15 and one of 20.

Kreider has one 18 year and one 26 year.

If anything Kreider has been buoyed by those two abnormal years. Like when he magically popped 50 and had 26 Pp goals. That was not normal.

It wasn't that abnormal.

Over his last five seasons, Kreider is averaging 39 goals per 82 games. If he didn't get hurt 3 out of 4 years in the middle of his prime, he's probably a 500 goal scorer.

 

[Ruggs225]

It wasn't that abnormal.

Over his last five seasons, Kreider is averaging 39 goals per 82 games. If he didn't get hurt 3 out of 4 years in the middle of his prime, he's probably a 500 goal scorer.

26 Pp goals isnt abnormal? To me it is.

23% of his PP goals for his career came in one single season. That is abnormal.

And to counter the injury… maybe if he played more games he wouldnt have aged as well and slowed down faster. It works both ways here. Truth is we dont know exactly what his stats would have been.

Plus on top of that he had been notoriously streaky. Whats to say that those injured games werent going to be a cold streak.

Fact is we dont know what couldve been.


Just like we dont know what Laf and Kakko can be until we give them an actual chance

 

[Machinehead]

26 Pp goals isnt abnormal? To me it is.

23% of his PP goals for his career came in one single season. That is abnormal.

Yeah, 26 was out of the ordinary, and the next year he scored 8 which is not where he's been trending at all so that probably evened out.

I don't know, man, Kreider is really good at scoring goals. I feel like I'm trying to convince you that Zdeno Chara is tall.

 

[TGWL]

I know you like the advanced stats and such. Do you know how to get Zibanejad's WAR% year over year in those player cards or something similar?

I am curious about his rise and fall over the years

The rise and fall of Zibanejad sounds like a wrestling DVD.

 

[Ruggs225]

Yeah, 26 was out of the ordinary, and the next year he scored 8 which is not where he's been trending at all so that probably evened out.

I don't know, man, Kreider is really good at scoring goals. I feel like I'm trying to convince you that Zdeno Chara is tall.

I know kreider is good. I just dont think he is irreplaceable.

And also i just eant to see what we have in laff and especially Kakko. I mean we have to make a huge decision on Kakko this offseason and i would hate to make an ill informed one.

I still have faith in Kakko. Just like i did last year in laff.

 

[Machinehead]

I know kreider is good. I just dont think he is irreplaceable.

And also i just eant to see what we have in laff and especially Kakko. I mean we have to make a huge decision on Kakko this offseason and i would hate to make an ill informed one.

I still have faith in Kakko. Just like i did last year in laff.

At this point, neither one of them plays the same position Kreider does.

Kakko has has a RW spot open in front of him for like four years.

 

[TominNC]

Teams don't purposely mess with success just so YOU can see. But I'm sure this will be a theme all season every time the PP takes an 0fer. Players can prove their worth 5v5. Everyone knows they can pad their stats a little of given PP. Frankly, breaking up the PP for Kakko is kind of kooky.

 

[effen]

Whatever the decision the Rangers make on Kakko, it will hardly be ill-informed. Exactly how more seasons of play and years in the organization are necessary?

 

[Ruggs225]

At this point, neither one of them plays the same position Kreider does.

Kakko has has a RW spot open in front of him for like four years.

Yeah on the kreider and zib line that nobody seems to play well with. He have what 30 guys since buch and nobody does well.

I just think if we are going to change up the PP that moving laf for zib might not work well and a bigger restructure might need to be done. Or at least should be tried to see if what could happen and what we have in our younger players.

In that case i would move laf and kakko up with trocheck, panarin and fox and move kreider and zibs to pp2.

If that doesnt work, and everything goes to hell on the PP you can always go back to the original setup.

As for even strength… kakko really doesnt have a spot to move up bc nobody plays well with the wonder twins. Though kakko is looking good with chytil and cuylle. So give them more time and call them line 2 and just play zib line less at ES.

Especially in a close game when the chytil line looks to be our best defensive line.

Basically, win enough to get in playoffs, while seeing what the youth can become and make an informed decision for the offseason when contracts are going to need to be shuffled.

 

[noncents]

I know kreider is good. I just dont think he is irreplaceable.

And also i just eant to see what we have in laff and especially Kakko. I mean we have to make a huge decision on Kakko this offseason and i would hate to make an ill informed one.

I still have faith in Kakko. Just like i did last year in laff.

leveraging machinehead's kreiderphilia to drag him into the muck to reveal his kakkophobia... it's genius.

 

[Bruner4329]

26 Pp goals isnt abnormal? To me it is.

23% of his PP goals for his career came in one single season. That is abnormal.

And to counter the injury… maybe if he played more games he wouldnt have aged as well and slowed down faster. It works both ways here. Truth is we dont know exactly what his stats would have been.

Plus on top of that he had been notoriously streaky. Whats to say that those injured games werent going to be a cold streak.

Fact is we dont know what couldve been.


Just like we dont know what Laf and Kakko can be until we give them an actual chance

What it proves is he can score both on the PP as well as even strength or short handed. Career wise about 34% of his goals came on the PP. There are a few HOFs that were close to that level including Espo. Can't play the game could have or would have. Just base it on his career and the fact that he will go down as one of the greatest all time Rangers.. something a lot of you take for granted.

 

[bhamill]

let's talk about buch. it's been a while.

Ahahahahaha

 

[TominNC]

Yeah on the kreider and zib line that nobody seems to play well with. He have what 30 guys since buch and nobody does well.

I just think if we are going to change up the PP that moving laf for zib might not work well and a bigger restructure might need to be done. Or at least should be tried to see if what could happen and what we have in our younger players.

In that case i would move laf and kakko up with trocheck, panarin and fox and move kreider and zibs to pp2.

If that doesnt work, and everything goes to hell on the PP you can always go back to the original setup.

As for even strength… kakko really doesnt have a spot to move up bc nobody plays well with the wonder twins. Though kakko is looking good with chytil and cuylle. So give them more time and call them line 2 and just play zib line less at ES.

Especially in a close game when the chytil line looks to be our best defensive line.

Basically, win enough to get in playoffs, while seeing what the youth can become and make an informed decision for the offseason when contracts are going to need to be shuffled.

Smith is playing fine. Relax 6-1-1.

 

[GAGLine]

Whatever the decision the Rangers make on Kakko, it will hardly be ill-informed. Exactly how more seasons of play and years in the organization are necessary?

At this point, I don't think it's about evaluation. He could be one of those guys who takes off later in his career, a la Kreider, but what he is right now has value. It's just a matter of if we can afford him.

I'd like to keep him, but at the same time, we have prospects ready to fill that spot. We'll see how it goes. I hope he puts up 50+ this year just to vindicate him a bit in the eyes of the fans and earn him a NICE contract, even if it's not with us.

 

[bhamill]

I know kreider is good. I just dont think he is irreplaceable.

And also i just eant to see what we have in laff and especially Kakko. I mean we have to make a huge decision on Kakko this offseason and i would hate to make an ill informed one.

I still have faith in Kakko. Just like i did last year in laff.

Kreider may not be IRreplaceable, but neither is he EASLY replaceable. So why? I mean no one is untouchable, Gretzky was traded. It of course would depend on the deal. It would have to be one f***in hell of a deal to get Kreider out of here looking at his play, his leadership and professionalism AT HIS CAP HIT. He’s frankly a bargain. If that kind of deal could be made, that is CLEARLY better for this team, I guess we have to make it. But I don’t see this management looking to deal him, and, IMO, they shouldn’t be.

 

[bernmeister]

Again, Kreider is not gonna be here forever.

The trick is finding the sweet spot between future value and what you are willing to live with missing. That time is coming.

Teams do trade very good young players, you just have to find the misevaluated ones.

your above premise is a good guideline, rule of thumb
but Kreider = exception to the rule, esp since he consistently shows up in outrageously excellent shape
As long as he works w/us $ wise, we should keep him going forward
Day he can't cut the mustard anymore, I expect him to do a Lou Gehrig and take himself out
As opposed to others, generally, if they are on a bad contract, they hold on and on and on.

I mean mika zibenajad has more Pp goals than kreider yet everyone wants to run him off too.

So does luminaries such as Ryan smith and claude lemiuex.

Like i said. Others have done it. He is replaceable.

They really need to see what laff and Kakko can do with a real shot. This offseason is going to be monumentally important. This regular season is a walkthrough for playoffs. Try nee things now. If they dont work, go back to what did work and then u also know where h stand in offseason.

I still believe Kakko can be a really good player. I will be absolutely pissed if we have to let him go go we keep an aging Kreider. Which is a real possibility.

Kreider will not cost us KK

Lavi taking the A away from Mika and giving it to Rempe after he kills Wilson tomorrow night

Murder is contrary to the laws of God and man, and we all remember was Solomon was told.
So murder no.
We can pray/hope that someone who is evil is "undone" and leave it in God's hands as to how that is realized.

That said, where there is a need to promote justice and provide deterrent so players like Panarin are never again used like a ragdoll, I would have no problem if, once provoked by Wilson, he beat that mo bastard to a pulp

 

[AirGut]

let's talk about buch. it's been a while.

let's talk about Kravtsov. It's been a while.

 

[80shockeywasbuns]

You clearly missed the "decline and take the loss of down" era of Rangers hockey.

LMAO

 

[LaffyTaffy13]

Mancini stepping up is so big for us. Replacing troubas cap hit with an elc is huge.

What do we project kandre and cuylle to re-sign for?

Im think we let lindgren go and trouba traded. Sign marcus pettersson and move kreider if it means landing rantenen.

Laff-Mika-Rantanen
Panarin-Trocheck-Perreault
Cuylle-Chytil-Kakko
Berard-Carrick-Edstrom
Rempe

Kandre-Fox
Pettersson-Schneider
Jones-Mancini

(i’d be willing to move othmann at the deadline for the right piece)

 

[eco's bones]

Since the beginning of 21-22 Kreider has scored 132 goals in 250 regular season games and 24 in 43 playoff games. He's prorating over 40 goals a year for that entire time including in the playoffs. For a $6.5 mil cap hit....his contract is one of the biggest bargains in the league. Included in all that are not just power play goals but also a lot of game winners and quite a number of shorthanded goals. He's a multidimensional goal scorer and an all situations player. He's become a better player since he turned 30 and I'm failing to see any real sign of decline yet. Mika's play at least 5v5 OTOH has dropped a bit the past couple years which since he's tied to Kreider as his center should effect Kreider's production but Chris's production hasn't really declined. Chris's is a better contract for us and has shorter term left. He's giving us great value and IMO Mika has been undervaluing his.

Of the current Rangers forwards the only one who I could some day see providing the kind of net front presence on the power play that Chris does is maybe Cuylle. He's big enough and strong enough to hang in that area. You got to be willing and able enough to take a beating from defenders and once in a while get hit with the puck. Even if there was an opening I wouldn't Lafreniere getting bashed and shot like that. Lafreniere should be more of a wall guy like Mika or the bumper guy like Trocheck but we need Trocheck for face-offs.

Another point I'd make is I don't think anyone on our second power play unit has ever really stood out enough where I'd say they deserve to be on the first unit. It's always seemed somewhat disjointed to me whatever personnel we have on it. They're all prone to flubbing or forcing plays and too much cowboy I'll do it alone shit. They never really show much synchronization.