Speculation: Roster Building Thread Part XI: We can read between the lines

[Avery16]

zero reason to trade either McD or Zucc unless the offer is a significant overpayment.

 

[Avery16]

Its so extremely backwards to be — loyal — to Shatty over someone like Zucc... This team have one Cup in 75 years, that type of thinking is a very good reason for it. Shatty is paid 6.9m per, it’s basically what he is worth. We are loyal to someone taking money instead of having left it all on the ice for us year in and year out...

Compare the depth we have at wing to our depth for Shattys role with DeAngelo and Pionk. DeAngelo need to get PP time to develop, he is a young kid who is cheap. Exactly what we are looking for. He also have little read value being on so many teams. We waste him, and probably Pionk too, if we keep Shatty.

Shatty isn’t getting better, it’s downhill from here. Close to 30, not that fast feets. We are selling of trying to get younger. Shatty has zero history on this team. Why shouldn’t Shatty be the — first — player we start to auction around the league after the draft? His value is at the lowest now, sure wait and see how he looks next year on a team without McD, Nash an Zucc...

This isn’t an either or, and loyalty shouldn’t be the reason to retain either player.
That being said, ADA had a great couple of games and showed he should stick with the club. That is a far cry from giving him top pairing minutes and trading your only alternative. The drop off between Shatt and ADA is stark, and the drop off between ADA and Pionk is prettt great also. ADAs play isn’t an indicator that anyone should be moved other than Holden.

 

[Kovalev27]

I wonder what the appetite would be to move Mcdonagh for a monster haul go all in to replace him with Karlsson next summer.

It makes Brady Skjei a number 2 dman. Makes shattenkirk a number 3 makes Smith or staal a 4/5

Skjei Karlsson
Staal Shattenkirk
Smith DeAngelo

One of staal/Smith might even be gone by then if they can make a deal

 

[Avery16]

I wonder what the appetite would be to move Mcdonagh for a monster haul go all in to replace him with Karlsson next summer.

It makes Brady Skjei a number 2 dman. Makes shattenkirk a number 3 makes Smith or staal a 4/5

Skjei Karlsson
Staal Shattenkirk
Smith DeAngelo

One of staal/Smith might even be gone by then if they can make a deal

We need to do everything we can within reason to move Smith and Staal this offseason

 

[Trxjw]

I'd absolutely ask for Sergachev from Tampa, but I'd be shocked if they agreed. I'd be very statisfied with a prospect-based package from them: McDonagh at 50% for Howden, Foote, 1st 2018, and a conditional 2nd in 2019 which becomes a first should they win a cup this year or next.

 

[Savant]

Not nearly enough for me. To trade McD within the conference, I'd want a king's ransom.

“Starting point”

 

[Savant]

I'd absolutely ask for Sergachev from Tampa, but I'd be shocked if they agreed. I'd be very statisfied with a prospect-based package from them: McDonagh at 50% for Howden, Foote, 1st 2018, and a conditional 2nd in 2019 which becomes a first should they win a cup this year or next.

That’s a bigger price tag than Sergachev

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

That’s a bigger price tag than Sergachev

It might be, but none of those assets will impact the lightning as much as Sergachev will the next 2 years. They're in a position to win now.

Personally, I'd want even more from them.

 

[Trxjw]

That’s a bigger price tag than Sergachev

I disagree. It's a big ask for sure, and they could very well balk at it, but they don't lose a single roster piece or guy they're counting on for next season. So volume wise it's heavy, but it gives the Lightning two stacked runs at the cup without taking a hit right now. The conditional pick is similar to what the Rangers gave up in the Yandle deal and if they win the cup then losing the pick is well worth it. Otherwise it's just a very late 2nd.

 

[Savant]

It might be, but none of those assets will impact the lightning as much as Sergachev will the next 2 years. They're in a position to win now.

Personally, I'd want even more from them.

I think Howden is their top guy (over Sergachev); people are sleeping on him because he brother was a bust but he is legit.

 

[Trxjw]

I think Howden is their top guy (over Sergachev); people are sleeping on him because he brother was a bust but he is legit.

Howden could be considered their best prospect outside of the NHL, but that's why he's in the package for me. He's my "get" in that trade, and Foote is the sweetener. The picks are nice, but you have to assume they're a ways off if the Rangers don't end up trading them in other deals. Howden and Foote are guys who will be in the NHL sooner rather than later, and that's what the Rangers are probably going after in a deal for McDonagh.

 

[Mac n Gs]

Howden could be considered their best prospect outside of the NHL, but that's why he's in the package for me. He's my "get" in that trade, and Foote is the sweetener. The picks are nice, but you have to assume they're a ways off if the Rangers don't end up trading them in other deals. Howden and Foote are guys who will be in the NHL sooner rather than later, and that's what the Rangers are probably going after in a deal for McDonagh.

What makes you like Howden more than Raddysh?

 

[Nopuckluck]

As much as I think we have the right to ask for that of Tampa, I don't think talks will progress anywhere if we ask for him. Sergachev is a stud dman who will have a long career in the top 31 in the league. Asking for him is as obnoxious as Winnipeg asking for Skjei + in return for Trouba.

Troubadour is better than Skjei IMHO

 

[Nopuckluck]

TB won't trade Sergachev but I would stay steadfast on him+ for McD.

I really dont want McD to go to Tampa #keepcallycupless #nocupcally

How can any Rangers fan hold a grudge against Cally. The guy was our team and sacrificed his body for our enjoyment

 

[Nopuckluck]

Would TBL want to trade Sergachev not even a year after getting him? He seems pretty integral to their team.

Also depends on what the Rangers want in return for McDonagh. Do they want a high-value D or fill out their forward depth which is pretty weak, especially if they're trading Grabner/Nash/DD. But their D depth after trading McDonagh would also be weak.

Really hard to gauge what happens here and depends on what they get in return for the other guys, which is why I think this would be a draft day deal.

If Sergachev gets traded again that would be twice in 2 years. Imwonder if this happened if the same people that put up red flags about ADA being traded twice in two years would say the same about Sergachev.

 

[Thirty One]

How can any Rangers fan hold a grudge against Cally. The guy was our team and sacrificed his body for our enjoyment

That sounds pretty kinky.

But yeah, I'm on #HashtagTeamNoHardFeelingsCallahan

 

[LeetchisGod]

If Sergachev gets traded again that would be twice in 2 years. Imwonder if this happened if the same people that put up red flags about ADA being traded twice in two years would say the same about Sergachev.

Not really comparable players. Sergachev is 3 years younger and has accomplished more.

 

[Avery16]

How can any Rangers fan hold a grudge against Cally. The guy was our team and sacrificed his body for our enjoyment

Because he also tried to sacrifice our playoff hopes for a contract he didn't deserve and cant play up to.

 

[TheTakedown]

If Sergachev gets traded again that would be twice in 2 years. Imwonder if this happened if the same people that put up red flags about ADA being traded twice in two years would say the same about Sergachev.

Or it could be that Montreal cannot evaluate talent, and the Lightning are in a position to win a stanley cup.

 

[Cheapshot]

How can any Rangers fan hold a grudge against Cally. The guy was our team and sacrificed his body for our enjoyment

To me and sure others share this opinion his last season here he pretty much knew he priced himself out of a contract here and simply gave up. Played it safe, he didn't bring that same level of effort and tenacity he had been known for. He did it for the right reason personally, you know his health his family etc. But that "softer" level of play from him on his way out really soured me on him. Although I have no problem if he succeeds in Tampa, the way he ended his tenure here just left a bad taste to me .

 

[Gardner McKay]

I'd absolutely ask for Sergachev from Tampa, but I'd be shocked if they agreed. I'd be very statisfied with a prospect-based package from them: McDonagh at 50% for Howden, Foote, 1st 2018, and a conditional 2nd in 2019 which becomes a first should they win a cup this year or next.

"Which becomes a first in 2019 should they make the SCF this year or next." Not just win the cup. Similar to the deal Sather made with them for St. Louis.

I agree. I'd also ask. There is no harm in asking. Maybe you catch Yzerman on a bad day and he says yes.

 

[Nopuckluck]

To me and sure others share this opinion his last season here he pretty much knew he priced himself out of a contract here and simply gave up. Played it safe, he didn't bring that same level of effort and tenacity he had been known for. He did it for the right reason personally, you know his health his family etc. But that "softer" level of play from him on his way out really soured me on him. Although I have no problem if he succeeds in Tampa, the way he ended his tenure here just left a bad taste to me .

Ok. Fair enough. I don’t remember it that way. And if his softer level of play bothered you than the only Ranger you can root for now is your bottom 6 and ADA!

 

[Trxjw]

What makes you like Howden more than Raddysh?

Well I'll almost always give an edge to a centermen, but I just love Howden's game. He's a complete player and has found the ability to drive the offense in the last two years. He can make plays, but isn't afraid to get into the dirty areas to score greasy goals. In fact he's extremely effective there. I think he has the ability to be a guy that plays every situation at a very high level and elevate the players around him.

Raddysh is a very potent offensive player in a big body, but I worry he's too much of a complimentary guy and not enough of a driver. He's played very well with some extremely good players, and that's a skill in it's own right, but I prefer a guy like Howden who I think is more of a driver of the play. The radish is also my least favorite vegetable.

 

[Machinehead]

Why? It's not a crippling contract, short term, and there's no reason a rebuilding team can't have some vets around to be apart of the transition. Especially actual good players like Shattenkirk.

We could have an actual good player like McDonagh too!

I think the move is McDonagh to Tampa.

Win-Now team. Needs a Dman. Can play with Girardi or Stralman at the minimum. A lot of prospects.

2018 1st & Raddysh is a very good starting point.

Yeah I'm sure McDonagh can't f***ing wait to play with Girardi again.

Not like that was the most ineffective pair in the NHL for two years or anything.

 

[DundeeRanger]

This may have been brought up elsewhere, sorry if it has, how long a rebuild period do you guys think the Rangers will need? How fundamental does the rebuild need to be? Are the fans and owner willing to have a few seasons out of the play off picture for longer term success?

The reason I ask is because this should dictate our strategy in terms of the pieces e keep or let go. I 100% agree that our rentals should go (as much as I like him, Nash, should go). Then it boils down to what we get in return and how long we are willing to wait for success. Otherwise, the risk is we make the wrong moves shooting at next season or the season after and again sacrificing the long term.

Aware that I am probably teaching many on the forum how to suck eggs....but I am new here.