Roster Building Thread - Part XI (Off-season edition)

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2014nyr

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if i'm drury/lavi, i'm telling berard/sykora this summer is a massive opportunity for them. they have the potential to be an answer for what this roster desperately needs.

one thing the rangers get dinged with is lacking team speed. that isn't the case, the forward group has plenty of speed overall. what they do lack is guys who change the pace of the game. everyone looks faster with a mcdavid, hintz, point, hughes, barzal, etc...and similarly down the lineup guys like evan rodrigues, duclair, duhaime, lizotte, hoglander...they can change the complexion of your entire roster. their pace impacts the pace of the game and makes everyone else appear faster. when you lack those guys, it logically has the opposite effect.

if i'm drury, maybe the biggest priority this summer is how they inject some pace into the lineup. obviously, you aren't going to add an elite talent who brings that element outside of some wildly unexpected development, but you don't need to. there's plenty of skill and forechecking depth in the lineup, but you need 1-2 spark plugs who create the conditions for them to thrive.

if i'm drury, obviously you kick the tires on tkachuk and see what that might take, but you can't view that as any sort of end-all be-all. if you find a deal that works, i'd love to add him.

but...but...the answer is probably not moving trouba and definitely not moving kakko. anyone who knows anything about asset management knows this is not the time to sell here. these are probably the two most motivated players heading into this offseason, their return value isn't likely to get any lower. in trouba's case, you run into an argument that can be made depending on what else transpires and where that puts us in relation to the salary cap...but as of now you assume he's coming back and coming back off a summer he spent highly motivated to change the narrative about his game. i don't think anyone can question how much he cares or how much he means to his teammates...you'd be crazy not to think he doesn't have a much better year next season. kakko, on the other hand, will come cheap, is at a minimum a very solid bottom 6 piece who still absolutely has offensive upside potential and will have a ton of motivation to prove it...esp after watching laf take off this year ahead of him. the absolute worst decision you could make right now is taking pennies on the dollar to free up under 3 million of cap space for a guy who has a very reasonable probability to significantly outperform that, at a minimum will deliver it, and knowing you'll be spending at least that on any replacement that will come with a lot more uncertainty in terms of what you'll get to the downside. it would be complete dereliction of duty to sell on kakko at this point - at least in any deal centered around him. i would understand including him in a hypothetical bigger deal but that would entirely depend on who it was for and what else was included.
 

Machinehead

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Everyone waxed poetic about Jesper Fast and his career high for goals in a season is four less than Kakko’s best. How many goals should your third line guy get?
Fast was a lot less streaky. Kakko goes through long stretches where he's not an NHL player on offense.

He's also nowhere near the defender Fast is.
 

PuckLuck3043

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I would view him as a solid 3rd line guy if I had more faith in him scoring than the popcorn guy.
He had 13 goals in 60 games this year and was 18/22 last year. He can be a 20/20 defensively responsible 3rd line guy that helps keep the puck in the Ozone which isn't bad. Expecting more is going to lead to disappointment. FWIW I don't think he gets another chance here but will achieve those numbers elsewhere.
 
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Machinehead

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He had 13 goals in 60 games this year and was 18/22 last year. He can be a 20/20 defensively responsible 3rd line guy that helps keep the puck in the Ozone which isn't bad. Expecting more is going to lead to disappointment. FWIW I don't think he gets another chance here but will achieve those numbers elsewhere.
6 of his 13 goals game in 14 games.

That's 46 games, plus 16 in the playoffs, where he was 8-7-15 in 62 games.

He always gets his production in a big bunch and is utterly useless 3/4ths of the season.
 

17futurecap

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The coach has no use for Kakko, doesn’t PK, couldn’t even get time on the horrendous second unit pp, he played 6:01 on the pp during the playoffs.
 

PuckLuck3043

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6 of his 13 goals game in 14 games.

That's 46 games, plus 16 in the playoffs, where he was 8-7-15 in 62 games.

He always gets his production in a big bunch and is utterly useless 3/4ths of the season.
So what they all count. A lot of guys are streaky. What about last year? He put up 40 points. I would take that from a 3rd line guy. I would still like to see Cuylle, a healthy Chytil, and Kakko to see what they could do. We won't but I would like to.
 

Machinehead

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So what they all count. A lot of guys are streaky. What about last year? He put up 40 points. I would take that from a 3rd line guy. I would still like to see Cuylle, a healthy Chytil, and Kakko to see what they could do. We won't but I would like to.
If he's not hot in the playoffs, he's gonna score 1 goal like he just did.

Everyone is a bit streaky, but Kakko is extreme. He does absolutely nothing most of the season.
 

PuckLuck3043

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If he's not hot in the playoffs, he's gonna score 1 goal like he just did.

Everyone is a bit streaky, but Kakko is extreme. He does absolutely nothing most of the season.
This is true but I would still give him 1 more shot with a healthy Chytil unless they have a better option for the 3rd line.
 

McRanger92

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After hearing the players, I think shaking up the core coming off a Pres trophy and 2 ECFs in 3 years, is an overly emotional decision. Trouba is the exception, I’d actively be looking to move him.

Now, if you’re not going to change up the core, you need to change up the scenery. Kakko and Lindgren are RFAs the Rangers don’t want to overpay on. 2 extremely clear spots to consolidate assets and upgrade, ideally with guys who fit the Laffy/Fox/Trocheck timeline. I really don’t think this offseason is rocket science. We are going to be right there again next season.

Oh and Igor is getting paid. Swallow the bitter pill and be happy knowing we have an all world goalie. Learn from the sins of the Hank era, Drury, don’t screw up the rest of the roster because feelings got in the way.
 
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JimmyG89

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one thing the rangers get dinged with is lacking team speed. that isn't the case, the forward group has plenty of speed overall. what they do lack is guys who change the pace of the game. everyone looks faster with a mcdavid, hintz, point, hughes, barzal, etc...and similarly down the lineup guys like evan rodrigues, duclair, duhaime, lizotte, hoglander...they can change the complexion of your entire roster. their pace impacts the pace of the game and makes everyone else appear faster. when you lack those guys, it logically has the opposite effect.
To me this is because they lack defense that can transition the puck up the ice. It was amplified when Fox couldn't move.

It's more than even making a clean pass, but more that it isn't a quick decision. When they attempt to speed themselves up to do this, there are too many in prominent roles that turn it over more than you'd like.

Lindgren is culprit #1 on this and Trouba is #2. Until this is addressed they will look slower than most.
 
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The Crypto Guy

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After hearing the players, I think shaking up the core coming off a Pres trophy and 2 ECFs in 3 years, is an overly emotional decision. Trouba is the exception, I’d actively be looking to move him.

Now, if you’re not going to change up the core, you need to change up the scenery. Kakko and Lindgren are RFAs the Rangers don’t want to overpay on. 2 extremely clear spots to consolidate assets and upgrade, ideally with guys who fit the Laffy/Fox/Trocheck timeline. I really don’t think this offseason is rocket science. We are going to be right there again next season.

Oh and Igor is getting paid. Swallow the bitter pill and be happy knowing we have an all world goalie. Learn from the sins of the Hank era, Drury, don’t screw up the rest of the roster because feelings got in the way.

What did they say that made you think they wouldn't just shit the bed again in an ECF?

Mika will still be shit, Panarin will keep taking playoffs off. Kreider will play great every 4-5 games, then take the others off.

Are we really going to just waste Igor's window? The core is rotten and things need to change.
 

McRanger92

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What did they say that made you think they wouldn't just shit the bed again in an ECF?

Mika will still be shit, Panarin will keep taking playoffs off. Kreider will play great every 4-5 games, then take the others off.

Are we really going to just waste Igor's window? The core is rotten and things need to change.

I just don’t see it that way. Adjustments and improvements need to be made but they lost to a better team.
 

McRanger92

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This team will be set back for years if we give Igor the 12+ reported amount(which I dont know if its from any actual real sources). Id rather have great forwards/defense and an average goalie.

If Igor won’t budge on 12 I think Drury has to move him this summer. Realistically Igor needs to figure out what he wants. He knows full well he will never win here if he signs a 12+ mil contract. If it’s closer to 10-11 like Bob, that works a little better. Rangers need to be able to put a team around him.
 
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Crease

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12 sounded like speculation. Like, here’s the percentage of the cap the Rangers paid Lundqvist and this is what it would translate to in today’s dollars.

I can see Igor’s camp demanding 11, but he won’t get that. I think a deal can be had around 9.5-10.5, but I don’t actually know what the Rangers’ high end is.
 
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mike14

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To me this is because they lack defense that can transition the puck up the ice. It was amplified when Fox couldn't move.

It's more than even making a clean pass, but more that it isn't a quick decision. When they attempt to speed themselves up to do this, there are too many in prominent roles that turn it over more than you'd like.

Lindgren is culprit #1 on this and Trouba is #2. Until this is addressed they will look slower than most.
Agreed. Speed on the puck, especially from the back end is as important, if not more, than foot speed. If Jones isn't part of the solution (for some reason) then Drury's main focus has to be on bringing in at least two guys who can move it quickly and effectivly
 
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JimmyG89

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Conor Hellebuyck signed a 7 year 8.5M AAV contract at the beginning of this season. Vasilevskiy signed his 8 year 9.5M AAV contact beginning during the 20-21 season.

Is it possible Igor gets 8x10? I can see it. Anything beyond that I think it too high. Maybe 10.5M is the final asking price and I can see it being met.

The other thing is this, we'd have a goalie and winger making over 10M+ for 1 season. After that Panarin would be an UFA. He's clearly not being moved this summer, but anything except a cup next season and it needs to be entertained and probably done next summer.
 
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McRanger92

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Conor Hellebuyck signed a 7 year 8.5M AAV contract at the beginning of this season. Vasilevskiy signed his 8 year 9.5M AAV contact beginning during the 20-21 season.

Is it possible Igor gets 8x10? I can see it. Anything beyond that I think it too high. Maybe 10.5M is the final asking price and I can see it being met.

The other thing is this, we'd have a goalie and winger making over 10M+ for 1 season. After that Panarin would be an UFA. He's clearly not being moved this summer, but anything except a cup next season and it needs to be entertained and probably done next summer.

If Florida wins with Bob this year it shows Igor and the Rangers that there’s a path to a Cup at that 10-10.5 number. If the interest is mutual it will get done, if not he’ll be traded. Drury has no choice either way and the decision needs to be made soon. If they want to let Igor ride to free agency that’s and extremely dangerous game and they should be loading up for one last run.
 
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mike14

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If Florida wins with Bob this year it shows Igor and the Rangers that there’s a path to a Cup at that 10-10.5 number. If the interest is mutual it will get done, if not he’ll be traded. Drury has no choice either way and the decision needs to be made soon. If they want to let Igor ride to free agency that’s and extremely dangerous game and they should be loading up for one last run.
As a % of cap, Igor's caphit would be ~$11,100,000 if he got a contract similar to Bob's. Obviously that % would come down by the end of the contract assuming there's no repeat covid type stoppage.
That would be an insane increase from Shesty's last contract, but when you compare it to Trouba, Fox and Panarin, as well as other top level goalies you can understand why he'd be asking for it.
I am very intrigued to see which way Drury jumps on this. I don't think there's a 'right' answer, and whatever path we end up on it's something that will be second guessed and debated for a long time
 
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2014nyr

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To me this is because they lack defense that can transition the puck up the ice. It was amplified when Fox couldn't move.

It's more than even making a clean pass, but more that it isn't a quick decision. When they attempt to speed themselves up to do this, there are too many in prominent roles that turn it over more than you'd like.

Lindgren is culprit #1 on this and Trouba is #2. Until this is addressed they will look slower than most.

i actually think they have a pretty solid all around group defensively, especially when it comes to skating and puck moving ability. i get what you're saying though in terms of they undeniably struggled collecting pucks in their end and initiating a coordinated breakout...i just don't think it's an ability thing, at least on the back end. i put a lot more on the centers and coaches that led to confusion, then panicked decisions, and ultimately turnovers. wennberg and troch were really the only centers who effectively supported the dmen in-zone. even they struggled to support dmen gaining possession by finding a spot as an outlet that gave the ability to make a tape-to-tape pass rather than being immediately forced into pushing it up the wall or flipping it into the nz.

there were def decision making issues at times with the dmen, besides the panicked puck moves. fox, lindgren, braden, kandre, and gus - even trouba to an extent, are all capable enough with the puck and as skaters to initiate the breakout themselves, especially with the pressure a team like florida is bringing. they did a poor job of recognizing when the center support was being leaned on and knowing the florida dmen were stepping up aggressively on the wings - that's where they potentially had the ability to really make a difference. simply skating it to the circles would have backed florida off and completely opened up the ice underneath where the forwards would be able to actually receive passes on the move...and of course the d would have had plenty of space to simply skate it themselves. kandre actually did this a lot in game 5 successfully, no idea why that wasn't a point of emphasis in g6.

i would just be very wary of trying to get too cute with the defensive composition and getting too carried away with puck movers. at the end of the day, every recent cup champion has had their d core skewed heavily towards big bodies who aren't there to be puck movers. this year, granted edm isn't exactly the model d core...they're smallest dman in the top 6 is 6'2 190 and they only have 1 who's a good puck mover...the rest are borderline completely inept. florida is a bit more mobile, but doesn't have a dman under 6 ft 190 and only montour/forsling are solid puck movers. the rest are big boys who handle the puck like a grenade. i would have loved to see zac jones get a chance this year against fl because fox was so limited, and i love him as a player...but i'm not sure he fits in a defense that also has fox and lindgren amongst the 6. championship rosters just don't look like that. there's exceptions to every rule, and maybe they'd be that, but the probabilities certainly don't favor it. every winner has a back end with at most one smaller puck moving dman and multiple big boys who square the puck and skate like they got some real heavy boots on. vegas, col, tampa, stl, was, chi, lak...pit is really the only recent champ who didn't have a huge back end, though they didn't have 3 undersized guys either. they did have crosby and malkin tho...and we don't have crosby and malkin.

the rangers need better defensive support from centers/whoever is filling the down low covg in the dzone and better coordination between all 5 players in terms of understanding where each other are and where the outlet should be/what the safe bailout is. mistakes will happen, be it misreads or flubbed passes etc...but there needs to be a plan that creates some consistent structure in how they move the puck up ice in all situations. it can't be high flips and throw it up the wall fire drills all the time. you don't need elite puck movers for this stuff...you just need puck support and a system with players on the same page.
 
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