Roster Building thread - Part X - (TDL edition)

[Fitzy]

I don't see much point to adding a defenseman that can't be trusted to play important minutes in the playoffs.

If the argument is that Gus and Lindgren are both playing at a 3rd pairing level, the only advantage is if you get a guy measurably better than both. I don't see that on the table.

Just sort of have to hope one of the two can step up in the playoffs. Why was Lindgren-Gus competent when Fox was injured but now each have declined since?

Another Mikkola doesn't help us much unless someone gets injured.

 

[IDvsEGO]

Devils aren’t trading Toffoli to the rangers.

Like the player and the fit (if the bromance dies) but it isn’t going to happen.

Rangers traded Grabner to the devils, same gm for them. No issues trading once the devils are out of it, which isn’t far off.

 

[McRanger92]

Rangers traded Grabner to the devils, same gm for them. No issues trading once the devils are out of it, which isn’t far off.

I think the hesitancy is on little brothers side more than ours

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Rangers traded Grabner to the devils, same gm for them. No issues trading once the devils are out of it, which isn’t far off.

Shero was their GM.

 

[KennyWu]

Rangers traded Grabner to the devils, same gm for them. No issues trading once the devils are out of it, which isn’t far off.

And got a 2nd which helped them move up to get Miller

 

[IDvsEGO]

I think the hesitancy is on little brothers side more than ours

Right and I’m saying we’ve been partners recently.

 

[SA16]

Compared to recent years, this is a real slow moving trade market. Once the top two centers were moved, the market seems to have froze up. There are a lot of teams waiting as long as possible to make their buy/sell decisions. Thursday and Friday will be crazy.

So the same as every year

 

[bbny]

A Zegras deal might make sense even if Chytil is coming back.

If Chytil comes back, the Rangers need to tell him he's being moved to the wing permanently and then go find another good young center. They can't depend on Chytil's health, and center is too critical of a position to keep getting caught with their pants down because he can't catch a break with avoiding injury.

I'd buy Zegras to play center whether Chytil is back or not.

 

[bbny]

Eberle and Gourde/Wennberg is an ideal deadline.

I do like Toffoli.

Its too bad PIT won’t deal Crosby and/or deal him here and/or he waives to come here. That would be a mountain moving acquisition.

What’s the cost on Gourde and Eberle, half retained on both

 

[LaffyTaffy13]

if we really wanna go for it, the move is

To ANA: Kakko

To NYR: Henrique and Vatrano

1) Realistically, for us, Kakko will always be a 3rd liner. Hes not better than Laff and Gabe looks very promising. Our RW top 6 is set for the next decade. Yes yes, I know that laff could always move back to LW.

2) Vatrano can provide the 1 year bridge in 24-25 season to allow gabe one more year in college before making the jump

3) Kakko is an RFA this summer, he likely wont want to sign a long term deal because he wants to prove hes worth more and can hit ufa at age 25 if he signs just a 2 year deal. If he signs a 2 year deal, we lose leverage. A 1 year deal puts him just 1 year from ufa when that expires and a long term deal would likely mean low aav which he doesnt want.

All in all, due to the aforementioned, I could see this happening

To ANA: Kakko

To NYR: Vatrano and Henrique with rico 50% retained

To NYR: Duclair
To SJS: 3rd that becomes a 2nd if we make conference finals

Kreider-Mika-Vatrano
Panarin-Trocheck-Laff
Cuylle-Henrique-Duclair
Vesey-Goodrow-Rempe
Rempe/Brodz

That lineup is nails

 

[LannyMcdonald]

I don't see much point to adding a defenseman that can't be trusted to play important minutes in the playoffs.

If the argument is that Gus and Lindgren are both playing at a 3rd pairing level, the only advantage is if you get a guy measurably better than both. I don't see that on the table.

Just sort of have to hope one of the two can step up in the playoffs. Why was Lindgren-Gus competent when Fox was injured but now each have declined since?

Another Mikkola doesn't help us much unless someone gets injured.

Over four rounds of playoffs, Dmen get injured…

 

[bhamill]

At Even Strength in 2022-23
81 games 19 goals, 29 assists in 15:59 minutes
82 games 18 goals, 19 assists in 13:58 minutes
Because clearly you need this to.

Similar sample sizes...
Now add kakko's defensive strength, whos head and shoulders above?

YUP.

 

[bhamill]

View attachment 828686View attachment 828687View attachment 828688

Zegras has been clearly the better offensive player, which is what I was arguing about. Kakko has been better defensively, but I would much prefer the profile of Zegras, he’s a forward and generally it’s easier to become a better defensive player than vice versa and I think that is more valuable anyway.

And yet Zegras has shown NO inclination to play even the slightest bit of defense for four years. Nor go to any of the dirty areas. Kakko is the better overall player, and IMO it’s no even close. I’d take Zegras on gladly as a project, but he’s not worth Kakko. Not even close. He’s completely overrated.

Last word on Krav
water under the bridge, and bern wanted Dobson instead...

Just imagine if we had gone for Dobson…

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

I would drive Kakko to Anaheim myself for Zegras, thinking otherwise is nonsense lol

 

[bhamill]

The pearl clutching for a forward with 11 points in 40 games and zero plus-level-skills is astounding.

Keep him. Dump him. Doesnt matter. Brodz does more both good and bad, in an average game.

Ahahaha. You’re really equating Kakko and Brodz… and higher on Brodz? You are certainly on an island my friend. Get back to me when Brodz scores 40 points in a season this late in his career like Kakko did at 21-22 years of age.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

And yet Zegras has shown NO inclination to play even the slightest bit of defense for four years. Nor go to any of the dirty areas. Kakko is the better overall player,and IMO it’s no even close. I’d take Zegras on gladly as a project, but he’s not worth Kakko. Not even close. He’s completely overrated.


Just imagine if we had gone for Dobson…

He would be f***ing hated here.

I do think that its comical that hes a guy who developed under Trotz (others too, but broke in under Trotz) and has become an all offense/no defense player.

FWIW, I loved him in his draft year based on his potential to be a real 2 way stud. He's way better offensively than I thought he'd be and the defense just hasn't come around at all.

 

[bhamill]

I would drive Kakko to Anaheim myself for Zegras, thinking otherwise is nonsense lol

Zegras is so overrated it’s not even funny anymore. Last year, without PP1, which he would not sniff here, Zegras outscored Kakko by 8 points. And does exactly ZERO else. Hahahaha.

He would be f***ing hated here.

I do think that its comical that hes a guy who developed under Trotz (others too, but broke in under Trotz) and has become an all offense/no defense player.

FWIW, I loved him in his draft year based on his potential to be a real 2 way stud. He's way better offensively than I thought he'd be and the defense just hasn't come around at all.

I’m not saying he is Norris material but we took Kravtsov, who is nothing for this team. Dobson with all of his faults is ridiculously head and shoulders above that

 

[Alluckks]

Kakko should just look to play exactly Jesper Fast’s game. Be a version of that that scores a little bit more and that is a very strong complimentary middle 6 player. Would not be a #2 pick profile, but would be a very long and productive career.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Zegras is so overrated it’s not even funny anymore. Last year, without PP1, which he would not sniff here, Zegras outscored Kakko by 8 points. And does exactly ZERO else. Hahahaha.


I’m not saying he is Norris material but we took Kravtsov, who is nothing for this team. Dobson with all of his faults is ridiculously head and shoulders above that

I wanted him based off of what was available when the Russian rube was taken.

Just saying that he'd be hated here and thrown in every single trade proposal ever if the Rangers had selected him.

 

[Boris Zubov]

And yet Zegras has shown NO inclination to play even the slightest bit of defense for four years. Nor go to any of the dirty areas. Kakko is the better overall player, and IMO it’s no even close. I’d take Zegras on gladly as a project, but he’s not worth Kakko. Not even close. He’s completely overrated.

This is homerism at its finest. I'm not a Zegras guy at all, but if the Ducks offered him straight up for Kakko, you take it & run. Kakko's defense isn't Selke level, nor is it irreplaceable on the 3rd line. As soft & one dimensional as Zegras is, at least he can produce consistently & impact games. If you were a Ducks fan like @Leonardo87 , you wouldn't entertain that trade seriously.

 

[RGY]

Dubas has to sell asap. He should be selling the important parts too. That franchise is toast.

 

[80s Kid]

if we really wanna go for it, the move is

To ANA: Kakko

To NYR: Henrique and Vatrano

1) Realistically, for us, Kakko will always be a 3rd liner. Hes not better than Laff and Gabe looks very promising. Our RW top 6 is set for the next decade. Yes yes, I know that laff could always move back to LW.

2) Vatrano can provide the 1 year bridge in 24-25 season to allow gabe one more year in college before making the jump

3) Kakko is an RFA this summer, he likely wont want to sign a long term deal because he wants to prove hes worth more and can hit ufa at age 25 if he signs just a 2 year deal. If he signs a 2 year deal, we lose leverage. A 1 year deal puts him just 1 year from ufa when that expires and a long term deal would likely mean low aav which he doesnt want.

All in all, due to the aforementioned, I could see this happening

To ANA: Kakko

To NYR: Vatrano and Henrique with rico 50% retained

To NYR: Duclair
To SJS: 3rd that becomes a 2nd if we make conference finals

Kreider-Mika-Vatrano
Panarin-Trocheck-Laff
Cuylle-Henrique-Duclair
Vesey-Goodrow-Rempe
Rempe/Brodz

That lineup is nails

Listen to Bern, don't trade youth for vets.

Seriously though, I really would rather not trade Kakko. He's still young and did put up 40 mostly 5v5 pts last year. He may never live up to the expectations of a 2OA but still can be/is a solid 3rd liner with upside without a big cap hit.

Unless there's a massive change to the cap rules, you can't just keep splurging on expensive FAs. You need cheap youth to contribute or you're stuck with a team that has no depth because you blew all the $ on expensive vets.

I agree in principle with a lot of what Bern says but don't understand why so much love for Zegras and Sanderson in hypothetical trades. I would be curious if Bern would trade youth for McDavid though.

 

[bhamill]

I wanted him based off of what was available when the Russian rube was taken.

Just saying that he'd be hated here and thrown in every single trade proposal ever if the Rangers had selected him.

You’re probably right..
And for what it’s worth I wanted Wahlstrom or Dobson as well.

 

[bhamill]

if we really wanna go for it, the move is

To ANA: Kakko

To NYR: Henrique and Vatrano

1) Realistically, for us, Kakko will always be a 3rd liner. Hes not better than Laff and Gabe looks very promising. Our RW top 6 is set for the next decade. Yes yes, I know that laff could always move back to LW.

2) Vatrano can provide the 1 year bridge in 24-25 season to allow gabe one more year in college before making the jump

3) Kakko is an RFA this summer, he likely wont want to sign a long term deal because he wants to prove hes worth more and can hit ufa at age 25 if he signs just a 2 year deal. If he signs a 2 year deal, we lose leverage. A 1 year deal puts him just 1 year from ufa when that expires and a long term deal would likely mean low aav which he doesnt want.

All in all, due to the aforementioned, I could see this happening

To ANA: Kakko

To NYR: Vatrano and Henrique with rico 50% retained

To NYR: Duclair
To SJS: 3rd that becomes a 2nd if we make conference finals

Kreider-Mika-Vatrano
Panarin-Trocheck-Laff
Cuylle-Henrique-Duclair
Vesey-Goodrow-Rempe
Rempe/Brodz

That lineup is nails

Oof. This trade is bad in the short term and f***ing awful long term. Frankie and Henrique don’t move the needle on our cup hopes.

 

[bl02]

Dubas has to sell asap. He should be selling the important parts too. That franchise is toast.

I'm shocked the Erik Karlsson trade didn't work out and pretty much served no purpose lol
Signed for 3 more years at a 11.5 million cap hit. My goodness. Let's not forget their first round pick which looks more and more like it will be a very good one.
I'm glad the "genius" Dubas is steering that ship in Pittsburgh. He's not too far behind the other genius Chayka who pretty much destroyed the Coyotes.