Roster Building thread - Part X - (TDL edition)

[haohmaru]

I wouldn't have Wennberg and Kakko within 50 feet of my top-9. They're offensively bankrupt players.

Our entire bottom six are 4th liners.

Meh. I'd say Top 9 players on this roster on a GOOD team:

Zibanejad, Trochek, Panarin, Lafreniere, Chytil, Kreider

And you have to have a 4th line, so suitable 4th line players:

Vesey, Cuylle, Goodrow, Rempe.

I'm not sold that this is all Kakko will ever be.

I'll admit that I like Roslovic less with every passing minute, Wheeler needs to sit for however long the Rangers are still playing, Wennberg should be playing 4C, Johnny Bro is precisely where he should be, etc...

Florida has the better lineup. We have the better goalie. Let's see what happens tomorrow.

 

[GAGLine]

See post #6522 for edited update on Winnipeg to NYC income equivalent.

Those numbers aren't relevant when it comes to NHL contracts.

 

[UnSandvich]

Not to be a dick about it but I would say Kreider, Fox, Panarin, Trocheck, and Lafreniere are good players.

Gustafsson is fine. Schneider is ok and I guess Miller is also ok (I'm being a bit generous to Miller, I feel). Zibanejad is streaky and annoying but let's just not get side tracked and count him as a good player.

That's 9 out of 18. Everyone else is playing too high in the lineup or shouldn't be playing at all.

Open to hearing who I'm wrong about. It's really bad.

Regarding Trouba, I don't think we have the assets to acquire the caliber of LHD required to babysit him. I can buy that he has a niche, but I'd firmly rather not have that element and take my chances than have Trouba playing.

I'm gonna say wrong on Chytil (absolutely on fire to start the year, and made 3C Trocheck actually a possibility), Vesey (fell off towards the end of the year but was otherwise fairly decent), and Kakko (Will Cuylle might genuinely be the best 5v5 player he spent significant time with this season. Early season Kreider was dogwater, but he did improve eventually. All of his C's sucked ass at 5v5 offense).

 

[Machinehead]

I'm gonna say wrong on Chytil (absolutely on fire to start the year, and made 3C Trocheck actually a possibility), Vesey (fell off towards the end of the year but was otherwise fairly decent), and Kakko (Will Cuylle might genuinely be the best 5v5 player he spent significant time with this season. Early season Kreider was dogwater, but he did improve eventually. All of his C's sucked ass at 5v5 offense).

You're right on Chytil but I just don't know what he is right now.

Vesey is a fine 4th liner but his passing is a joke at this level and this is the second year in a row he got dabbed on when the games got tight.

Kakko, I'm done with. Siberia.

 

[Machinehead]

To have a positive thought, I really think Adam Edstrom is it.

Too many of our forwards are nothingburgers along the boards in both ends.

This guy is gonna be a hydra along the boards. He can skate and knows what the puck is. Give him the chance and he's going to be an injection into our top 9 like Hagelin and Fast were.

 

[zlev]

To have a positive thought, I really think Adam Edstrom is it.

Too many of our forwards are nothingburgers along the boards in both ends.

This guy is gonna be a hydra along the boards. He can skate and knows what the puck is. Give him the chance and he's going to be an injection into our top 9 like Hagelin and Fast were.

it's straight up stupid they never really gave him a real shot this year. i was thinking about this last night; they went with the sideshow of Rempe instead of getting Edstrom NHL reps. he could really be helping us right now but nah, gotta have Rempe in the lineup to play 4 shifts.

 

[Machinehead]

it's straight up stupid they never really gave him a real shot this year. i was thinking about this last night; they went with the sideshow of Rempe instead of getting Edstrom NHL reps. he could really be helping us right now but nah, gotta have Rempe in the lineup to play 4 shifts.

I like Rempe and I'm intrigued by him as a prospect, but if he's never gonna play, let him get reps in Hartford.

 

[Raspewtin]

I like Rempe and I'm intrigued by him as a prospect, but if he's never gonna play, let him get reps in Hartford.

eh. he's going to play in the bottom 6 there and won't develop much. he's in a weird spot.

 

[IDvsEGO]

I like Rempe and I'm intrigued by him as a prospect, but if he's never gonna play, let him get reps in Hartford.

rempe does absolutely nothing.
he's about as useful on the ice as Manute Bol and about as graceful.

Edstrom at least can pass a puck.

 

[nsvoyageurs]

Can Drury get a 1st for Kakko? Dach brought back a 1st. Flip that pick or the Rangers pick for an established NHL player. Move on.

Panarin disappeared again. You are not scoring goals in the playoffs from the perimeter.

Gustafsson sucks.

Roslovic sucks.

Trouba sucks.

I'd be pleasantly shocked if Drury got a 1st rd pick for Kappo. As much as I have been a proponent of Kakko, he needs to move on, for his own sake; change of scenery. He'll be a 60-70 pt player for someone but not the Rangers. They bleeped up his development (should've stayed in Finland/sent to Hartford his rookie season), but injuries and Kakko himself have been partly to blame.

They need to get rid of every defencemen on the roster not named Adam Fox; I'd keep K'Andre Miller but he needs to take a really big step forward. Panarin/Zibanejad need to be moved (NMCs I know); they are not playoff players. Zibanejad is not a no. 1 Centre on a top Stanley Cup contender, more like a no. 2. You don't win Cups with players like that in ther current roles. Whatever UFAs they have they should just let go sign elsewhere.

This roster needs to be blown up. I don't mean go into a full rebuild (they wouldn't do that anyway), they need to be faster, stronger, be pains in the ass to play against. Add depth. Rearrange the deck chairs, so to speak LOL

This is on Chris Drury and his staff to get this team to get to where they need to get to, to be a top Stanley Cup contender. Can you make a Tkachuk/Huberdeau type of trade involving Panarin/Zibanejad? You hope Lafreniere continues his progression, gets from 28 goals this year to 35ish next year. Hopefully, some of the kids can make a positive impact. You hope Chyil can get over his injuy issues, especially with his concussions. The cap will go up some, but that cap space has likely already been accounted for.

I wasn't vehemently for or against the Laviolette hire last summer, but they did win the Presidents Trophy, so he does get some credit for that. He helped Lafreniere break out this season. I'm not sure about hs assistant coaches though, outside of Benoit Allaire.

 

[JimmyG89]

To have a positive thought, I really think Adam Edstrom is it.

Too many of our forwards are nothingburgers along the boards in both ends.

This guy is gonna be a hydra along the boards. He can skate and knows what the puck is. Give him the chance and he's going to be an injection into our top 9 like Hagelin and Fast were.

I'm having him watch this series intently and have him watch film of Eetu Luostarinen on how he needs to play. That's the kind of player I can see him becoming if they are patient enough to let him develop.

 

[kovazub94]

The way I see it, is next year you kinda have to run it back with the exception of having jones replace gustafsson, edstrom join the 4th line and chytil back. The question is how does drury handle kakko? A 1 year QO and have him prove it but then hes only 1 year from UFA in July 2025? Asset mgmt with kakko is tough. Lets assume he gets a 1 year QO prove it deal

The pre-TDL lineup should be something like this.

Kreider-Mika-Vesey
Panarin-Trocheck-Laff
Cuylle-Chyil-Kakko
Edstrom-Goodrow-Rempe
Brodz

Lindy-Fox (what is reasonable to give lindy though?)
Kandre-Schneider
Jones-Trouba
Robertson

Igor
Quick

Then if that group doesnt get it done in 2024-2025 season you blow it up and reset.

Lets say they get bounced next playoffs. IMO you trade trouba, kreider, kakko and goodrow and you put the full court press on draisaitl and rantennen two known playoffs performers. And if you can land them you go into 2025-2026 with

Laff-Draisaitl-Perreault
Panarin-Trocheck-Rantennen
Cuylle-Mika-Chytil
Othmann-Rempe-Edstrom
13th vet at league min

Lindgren-Fox
Kandre-Schneider
Jones-bottom pair RD
7th D at league min

Igor
Backup

And yes, this is cap compliant

A. Drury doesn’t need to wait a year - it is pretty clear what needs to be done. B. This is the second time you post this imaginary lineup and say it’s cap compliant. Show your math because it doesn’t look compliant

 

[bernmeister]

Not to be a dick about it but I would say Kreider, Fox, Panarin, Trocheck, and Lafreniere are good players.

Gustafsson is fine. Schneider is ok and I guess Miller is also ok (I'm being a bit generous to Miller, I feel). Zibanejad is streaky and annoying but let's just not get side tracked and count him as a good player.

That's 9 out of 18. Everyone else is playing too high in the lineup or shouldn't be playing at all.

Open to hearing who I'm wrong about. It's really bad.

Regarding Trouba, I don't think we have the assets to acquire the caliber of LHD required to babysit him. I can buy that he has a niche, but I'd firmly rather not have that element and take my chances than have Trouba playing.

general, not complete agree
Rempe + Edstrom should have been here much earlier
+ sink or swim I was right about Robertson
now we are being undone by older vets

I wouldn't have Wennberg and Kakko within 50 feet of my top-9. They're offensively bankrupt players.

Our entire bottom six are 4th liners.

Wenn agree = garbage
KK = no, still has upside
don't sell cheap
put him with proper linemates
him w/Wenn Pejorative Slurs his possibilities

To have a positive thought, I really think Adam Edstrom is it.

Too many of our forwards are nothingburgers along the boards in both ends.

This guy is gonna be a hydra along the boards. He can skate and knows what the puck is. Give him the chance and he's going to be an injection into our top 9 like Hagelin and Fast were.

yes, him AND rempe

it's straight up stupid they never really gave him a real shot this year. i was thinking about this last night; they went with the sideshow of Rempe instead of getting Edstrom NHL reps. he could really be helping us right now but nah, gotta have Rempe in the lineup to play 4 shifts.

disagree
should have done both instead of Bonino. Pitlick etc
but that's what happens when they don't listen to bern and favor vets

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Zadorov-Fox
Miller-Schneider
Jones-Trouba

How much might Zadorov cost? What's the deal with him in the lockeroom? Seems to have had trouble in Van, Cal and Chi if I am remembering correctly. I like that defense more than with Lindgren and Gus. Jones breaks out better and Zadorov covers more ice and is more physical. I know Zadorov was a good skater for a big guy when I watched him more a couple years ago, but I didn't watch his time in Van this year.

Zadorov is about to become the new scapegoat for whatever team aquire him. He had a good year, about to be overpaid and will likely slow down immediately after.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

I'm just tired of guys where there skating is meh or them being small.

We need guys that can impose their will. Othmann could be that eventually, he has the mindset.... his AHL season was disappointing to me

Much like when Schneider was in Hartford he looked disappointing but when he joined the nhl roster he was much better. I think Othmann has very little to work with in Hartdford, he's not a guy who can lift a line up, he's a reall good compliment to other good players. If you wanna look at it another way, Lafreniere plays better with like minded players of higher skill. Othmann imo might look better on Mika's line than he does in the AHL if he's given some time to adjust. I'm not sure if it was something in his demeanor or what but he really wasn't given a chance at all when he was called up, maybe he rubbed the coaching staff wrong or something I dont know

 

[NYR Viper]

The projections for Othmann put him in the Kunitz mold. Kind of a PIA to play against, stocky, willing to go to the dirty areas. Guys with that kind of nose for the net and offensive ability can score in the NHL. In saying that, he’s unlikely to be the guy pushing guys 1v1 or creating glorious chances on his own.

Berard is another story. He’s a water-bug who uses his elusiveness and speed to force the opposition into bad decisions because he’s ALWAYS around the puck and he’s tenacious.

The team needs both honestly. Not just one. I’d argue that Berard is more likely to augment Zibanejad and Kreider while Othmann could be a really good fit with Panarin.

Panarin-Trochek-Othmann
Cuylle-Chytil-Lafreniere
Kreider-Zibanejad-Berard

 

[racamdim]

I'd be pleasantly shocked if Drury got a 1st rd pick for Kappo. As much as I have been a proponent of Kakko, he needs to move on, for his own sake; change of scenery. He'll be a 60-70 pt player for someone but not the Rangers. They bleeped up his development (should've stayed in Finland/sent to Hartford his rookie season), but injuries and Kakko himself have been partly to blame.

They need to get rid of every defencemen on the roster not named Adam Fox; I'd keep K'Andre Miller but he needs to take a really big step forward. Panarin/Zibanejad need to be moved (NMCs I know); they are not playoff players. Zibanejad is not a no. 1 Centre on a top Stanley Cup contender, more like a no. 2. You don't win Cups with players like that in ther current roles. Whatever UFAs they have they should just let go sign elsewhere.

This roster needs to be blown up. I don't mean go into a full rebuild (they wouldn't do that anyway), they need to be faster, stronger, be pains in the ass to play against. Add depth. Rearrange the deck chairs, so to speak LOL

This is on Chris Drury and his staff to get this team to get to where they need to get to, to be a top Stanley Cup contender. Can you make a Tkachuk/Huberdeau type of trade involving Panarin/Zibanejad? You hope Lafreniere continues his progression, gets from 28 goals this year to 35ish next year. Hopefully, some of the kids can make a positive impact. You hope Chyil can get over his injuy issues, especially with his concussions. The cap will go up some, but that cap space has likely already been accounted for.

I wasn't vehemently for or against the Laviolette hire last summer, but they did win the Presidents Trophy, so he does get some credit for that. He helped Lafreniere break out this season. I'm not sure about hs assistant coaches though, outside of Benoit Allaire.

I think getting a first round pick for KK is just slightly more likely than flipping Trochek for Draisatl.

 

[KevinFinnerty]

we should definitely get rid of Trouba this summer

 

[RangersFan1994]

I’d even dangle Othmann and Perrault for the right pieces

That is not going to fix the issues this team has

 

[rangersfansince08]

it's straight up stupid they never really gave him a real shot this year. i was thinking about this last night; they went with the sideshow of Rempe instead of getting Edstrom NHL reps. he could really be helping us right now but nah, gotta have Rempe in the lineup to play 4 shifts.

I was harping on this last night. Rempe is a novelty, a gimmick. Edstrom will be a legit player. Not sure about @Machinehead penciling him into the top 9 but I see a very good 4th line player at the least. Same thing with Rooboreck. I know we talk about Edstrom-Rooboreck-Rempe as a line but Rempe has no business being grouped in with those two. Replace him with Berard and you probably have an elite 4th line imo.

 

[mti79]

If Edstrom, Berard or Othmann can be a pain in the butt to play against, dress them tomorrow. They're young and don't know enough to be intimidated. If they show early that they can't hang, then staple them to the bench like you do with Rempe. Not like they're not playing a man short right now most games anyway.

Maybe one of the kids ignites something....

I do think this team can win this series. Yes, we're relying on Igor too much but if it wasn't for their PP goals, we'd be up in this series. Just don't go out with a whimper like the Tampa series. Go out fighting.

 

[ArPanet]

what would it take to get this guy? Ottawa is a poverty team with new owners they could handle the heat if trading him is controversial.

 

[Kendo]

Much like when Schneider was in Hartford he looked disappointing but when he joined the nhl roster he was much better. I think Othmann has very little to work with in Hartdford, he's not a guy who can lift a line up, he's a reall good compliment to other good players. If you wanna look at it another way, Lafreniere plays better with like minded players of higher skill. Othmann imo might look better on Mika's line than he does in the AHL if he's given some time to adjust. I'm not sure if it was something in his demeanor or what but he really wasn't given a chance at all when he was called up, maybe he rubbed the coaching staff wrong or something I dont know

The funny thing with Schneider's development is that he was a steady middle pair guy in the AHL, and then came up and looked like a steady middle pair guy in the NHL. I wouldn't state it that he did "better" once called up, but he oddly did "the same."

The projections for Othmann put him in the Kunitz mold. Kind of a PIA to play against, stocky, willing to go to the dirty areas. Guys with that kind of nose for the net and offensive ability can score in the NHL. In saying that, he’s unlikely to be the guy pushing guys 1v1 or creating glorious chances on his own.

Berard is another story. He’s a water-bug who uses his elusiveness and speed to force the opposition into bad decisions because he’s ALWAYS around the puck and he’s tenacious.

The team needs both honestly. Not just one. I’d argue that Berard is more likely to augment Zibanejad and Kreider while Othmann could be a really good fit with Panarin.

Panarin-Trochek-Othmann
Cuylle-Chytil-Lafreniere
Kreider-Zibanejad-Berard

Otter and Berard getting upwards of 40 games a piece next season would be a great step forward. Same with Edstrom and Rempe, but on the 4th line.

I'd do a 1 or 2 yr deal with Kakko, even if it's arbitrated. Give him at least the start of the season with 20-93 before we make a big move (unless a no-brainer move presents itself, obviously).

Rookie-infused "Run it Back" lineup:
Panarin - Trocheck - Lafreniere
Kreider - Zibanejad - Kakko
Berard - Chytil - Othmann
Cuylle - The Rest

Cuylle is first man up if either rookie needs a dozen games with the pack. The missing piece is a fourth option at C in the top 9. The same thing missing to start this season. If we deal Kakko, I want it to be for someone similarly young that's a C/RW instead of just a RW. Like a Necas maybe? Let's get complicated and make it a Zegras?

I just don't want to make 5 moves and we end up with two Roslovic's in the top 9 and only a spot for a half a rookie.

The "Modified Run it Back" on D is less pretty. We can replace Gus with Jones and replace Jones with literally anyone at 7D. Lindy and Trouba are issues. However, they both played significant roles on a President's Trophy team in the ECF. If we lead the league again and struggle in the ECF again, then we can make a sweeping move or two on D in 13 months.

Overall, my concern is that we make three moves this offseason, and end up worse on the ice even if it looks better on paper. I kinda like having a team that's better on the ice than on paper. That's been our MO for a few seasons and we've improved our coaching staff, youth, and depth in that time.

We've done a good job of fighting against time/aging. Lias and Krav busting are the reasons we're not overwhelming favorites right now. They're also the reasons for needing the Ros/Wenn band-aids, and we're STILL right in it. And I'm higher on those two than most.

 

[xsniper11x]

I may be jumping the gun here and some of the more analytics inclined members can check me on this. Is it starting to feel like Dmen are becoming increasingly more commoditized nowadays, much in the same way Gs have been for some time?

If we have a EDM-FLA cup matchup, that might be the worst group of Dmen on paper that I can recall seeing in a final. It’s not like VGK’s Dcore last year was full of world beaters either. It’s starting to feel like the forward group needs the vast majority of the cap dollars, then some good systems and a group of solid “game managers” on the blueline might be all that’s needed in today’s NHL. Build from the opponents net and back, not “from your net and out.” Am I way off?

 

[Kendo]

I may be jumping the gun here and some of the more analytics inclined members can check me on this. Is it starting to feel like Dmen are becoming increasingly more commoditized nowadays, much in the same way Gs have been for some time?

If we have a EDM-FLA cup matchup, that might be the worst group of Dmen on paper that I can recall seeing in a final. It’s not like VGK’s Dcore last year was full of world beaters either. It’s starting to feel like the forward group needs the vast majority of the cap dollars, then some good systems and a group of solid “game managers” on the blueline might be all that’s needed in today’s NHL. Build from the opponents net and back, not “from your net and out.” Am I way off?

EDM is unique, where they have two top 5(?) forwards in the world. You can't really compare their D or G situation to other teams.

FLA has a bona fide #1D, plus a lightning in a bottle #2 and some depth. They also have Bob. I guess I'm saying that their D isn't necessarily underwhelming...but it is at least "whelming."