Roster Building thread - Part X - (TDL edition)

[SML2]

Brodzinski instead of Cuylle
Trying Trouba at top 4 again
Making Jones sit out

It’s so wild how, I can agree with just about everything and be in awe of the coach for 75 games. And then in the final week of the season he develops senility or somehow strays from common sense.

Trouba is pretty closely following Marc Staal career honestly they are very similar players and one thing about Marc Staal is he adapted his game to be much safer and defensive minded. Trouba has yet to acknowledge his regression and thinks his issues are “easily fixable”. No they’re not dude you’re cooked now play shutdown 3rd pair role. Staal reinvented himself amidst decline. Trouba is stuck on denial.

Staal was horrible. How that guy got that contract is a mystery. He must have seen some shit with his good eye that would have put the GM in a bad spot and got paid to keep his mouth shut. Just like KAM is barely in the frame for goals against, you could count in the ginger Cyclops to be laying in the middle of the slot with the red light spinning at least once a night.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

This is why I hate coaches like Snowblind hates goalies.

ChatGPT would do a better job.

 

[JoeGarelli]

if jones isnt in the lineup, i dont think they are worth watching..

yeah sure he is a younger player.. But he has improved every game, even throwing a few checks recently.. Must be extremely disappointing to him to have to sit out and watch trouba do what he does whatever it is.

 

[EdJovanovski]

Brodzinski instead of Cuylle
Trying Trouba at top 4 again
Making Jones sit out

It’s so wild how, I can agree with just about everything and be in awe of the coach for 75 games. And then in the final week of the season he develops senility or somehow strays from common sense.

Trouba is pretty closely following Marc Staal career honestly they are very similar players and one thing about Marc Staal is he adapted his game to be much safer and defensive minded. Trouba has yet to acknowledge his regression and thinks his issues are “easily fixable”. No they’re not dude you’re cooked now play shutdown 3rd pair role. Staal reinvented himself amidst decline. Trouba is stuck on denial.

Marc Staal was a great player before the back nine of his career, Trouba is far worse and was never good

 

[duhmetreE]

last 3 years.... while being paired together...

how is that even possible.

 

[UnSandvich]

Marc Staal was a great player before the back nine of his career, Trouba is far worse and was never good

Nah, he was decent for a 4 yr stretch in Winnipeg. Good even. Here, well, not so much

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Cuylle could be banged up a bit for all we know, I find it hard to believe Lav is in love with Brodzinski's game so much he's going to sit a kid who's played well, plyas physical, and has been in the lineup since game 1 of the season.

 

[EdJovanovski]

Nah, he was decent for a 4 yr stretch in Winnipeg. Good even. Here, well, not so much

You don't think Staal was way better at that age than Trouba was though? Staal was a great player in his prime. There were a lot of red flags with Trouba even back in Winnipeg, his hockey IQ didn't magically fall off a cliff he has always been a very dumb guy

 

[UnSandvich]

You don't think Staal was way better at that age than Trouba was though? Staal was a great player in his prime. There were a lot of red flags with Trouba even back in Winnipeg, his hockey IQ didn't magically fall off a cliff he has always been a very dumb guy

I didn’t say that, I was only addressing your statement that Trouba’s always been bad. Staal had some genuinely elite years defensively, then the injuries piled up

 

[mas0764]

Coaching staff is losing points with the roster management. Why must every coach be like this.

Cause we (well, some of us) vastly overestimate the competence and intelligence of these coaches relative to your average message boarder?

Same goes for GMs. They are almost all ex players and thus ex jocks.

I'm sure, like, Jeremy Roenick is just as smart as your average accountant, business executive, lawyer, doctor, dentist, etc. (hint: sarcasm)

 

[UnSandvich]

last 3 years.... while being paired together...

how is that even possible.

View attachment 845047

If you want to feel sad, go to NST and look up Millers WOWY’s over last 3 years with Trouba

 

[17futurecap]

My only realistic hope with the coaching staff for the playoffs when down going into the third, he just spams Miller and Fox together for all of the offense.

 

[SA16]

If you want to feel sad, go to NST and look up Millers WOWY’s over last 3 years with Trouba

That's an especially good thing to do if you want to misuse stats too considering almost all of their normal ice time is together and the majority of when it's separate has to do with line changes, times they've done Miller/Fox when trailing, and a few games here and there with players out of the lineup.

Here are the numbers.

21-22 to 23-24	CF	CA	CF%
Miller	4033​	4047​	49.91%​
Miller without Trouba	933​	855​	52.18%​
Miller without Trouba/Fox	644​	708​	47.63%​

It's not that Miller's numbers improve without Trouba because he's not with Trouba. It's because the numbers with Fox are so overwhelming that even 224 minutes out of 4281 minutes has a big effect on the numbers.. If you take out Fox it gets much worse than it is just with Trouba. This does not mean the pair of Miller/Fox is elite because of the results (obviously it would be just because of Fox). It's because that pair is sometimes put together in situations when trailing and they're pushing for offense and has outrageous numbers in minimal ice time (to the tune of a 74 CF% in 72 minutes of play).

 

[mas0764]

Trouba back home to Detroit this summer should be a pretty enticing move for both sides. Detroit needs a real "leader" and have a big hole at RD behind seider, who they probably would like to take the pressure off of. Justin Woll and 37 year old Jeffy Petry arent moving the needle. Lots of UM guys (Larkin/Copp/Compher) there as well. They'll have cap space and all their picks.

Makes too much sense.

I bet we can get a first or at least two seconds.

Rebuilds work when they are run by competent organizations, which some of the "long term" rebuilds haven't had, that's why they are still rebuilding.

Exactly, that's why Arizona and Buffalo are in endless rebuilds. We aren't Arizona or Buffalo.

We have our struggles developing offensive talent and the org is definitely to blame for that, but we can produce competent defensemen and star goalies all day long. And with that in hand, we can lure star offensive players to come here and underachieve but at least get us to the playoffs whenever we have an opening.

We have a free pass to relevance with those abilities.

 

[zlev]

im ok with giving Cuylle a rest, he's a rookie that has never played this deep into an NHL season and there's hopefully still another 2 and a half months left.

 

[bl02]

It's interesting that Rempe is possibly back in vs of all teams Newark.

 

[GAGLine]

Cause we (well, some of us) vastly overestimate the competence and intelligence of these coaches relative to your average message boarder?

Or conversely, and far more likely, we vastly overestimate the competence and intelligence of the average message boarder relative to these coaches.

Coaches have their reasons, whether you understand or agree with them. That doesn't make them right, but it helps to try to put yourself in their shoes once in a while and understand that you might not have all the information.

 

[Fitzy]

This is why I hate coaches like Snowblind hates goalies.

ChatGPT would do a better job.

You can't really believe that.

We don't even have AI that can drive a car properly yet, which like 90% of the American public can do (poorly)

Epistemological advancements through greater statistical complexity and availability have turned online hockey fans into a bunch of Italian FSM-forum style populists who think the average jackass with a computer can improve on decades of institutional knowledge and qualitative elements, and it isn't our best look.

 

[80shockeywasbuns]

This is why I hate coaches like Snowblind hates goalies.

ChatGPT would do a better job.

You show laviolette some respect. He has the team in contention for presidents trophy and knows more about hockey than you and you should be thankful for him

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Jesus, get Brodz off the team, he's so f***ing bad and I don't understand how he is playing on the 3rd line.

 

[mas0764]

Or conversely, and far more likely, we vastly overestimate the competence and intelligence of the average message boarder relative to these coaches.

Coaches have their reasons, whether you understand or agree with them. That doesn't make them right, but it helps to try to put yourself in their shoes once in a while and understand that you might not have all the information.

Sometimes that's the case but far from all the time.

The "you wouldn't know since you never coached," excuse is invalid often enough that it needs to be put to bed permanently and the merits debated on their own.

Fans have access to TONS of information these days. It's not 1980 anymore.

The way more likely scenario is that the coach doesn't have much more relevant information than Joe Fan on a message board anymore and in reality the coach is simply falling back on old hockey cliches.

We know that is the case a lot of times. We know it. We know that the NYR love "big players," and think that size equals quality. We know that they give too much bonus points to size.

And they are wrong.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

You show laviolette some respect. He has the team in contention for presidents trophy and knows more about hockey than you and you should be thankful for him

I read the same stuff about Gallant.

I think Lav is better than Gallant but his lineups are garbage

 

[17futurecap]

 

[fm]

rip

 

[GAGLine]

Fans have access to TONS of information these days. It's not 1980 anymore.

They do, but that's still not nearly as much as coaches have. Can you at least acknowledge the possibility that Lavi might be making his decision based on information that you aren't privy to? Or that it's probably just because Goodrow and Vesey kill penalties, and that is a valid enough reason?