Roster Building thread - Part X - (TDL edition)

[Amazing Kreiderman]

 

[OriginalLimbo]

Exactly this. In some sense, and while I know it's an unpopular subject, Kakko plays a similar style where his point totals don't show it, but he effects the game positively.

From past iterations, guys like Fast, Stralman, Hagelin were other examples

I agree. And we should save some money because the points aren’t there. That would be best value case scenario for NYR. But, am I minorly concerned with KK’s mindset. It may not happen at all. But if we offer a fair contract based on production, I can see him saying: screw it, I’ll go to UFA in a couple of years - someone will overpay for me and will give more opportunity (even if not completely earned).

And if CD does think that may happen, he does need to think trades and about maximizing any return, and sooner rather than later. I guess we will know in the next year or so.

 

[bobbop]

All of the above and he’s C-H-E-A-P which is invaluable in today’s NHL.

Unfortunately, he’s about to stop being cheap.

 

[Alluckks]

Hmmmmmm

 

[The Crypto Guy]

But I was told Lindgren is garbage and we need to trade him ASAP?

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

This is the kind of analysis that pisses me off because checking line Larry is intentionally ignoring a bunch of shit.

Under those TOI parameters, they're 18th out of 20 in xG%.

xGA, they're 13th/20

xGF? They're 20th out of 20. Very bottom of the barrel.

They're actually our performing their expected goal output as a pair (2.15 per 60 vs 2.05 expected per 60) and HEAVILY outperforming their expected against (1.25 per 60 vs 2.55 expected per 60.)

I know this is going to be met with a bunch of "DURRRR END LINE RESULTS DURR" but the point is that if their actual performance doesn't improve, their end line results are going to start to spike up towards what the expected results are. All this does is tell me that they should thank their goalies for showing up behind them.

I don't know that I'd consider having a pair with Fox on it as the worst pair of all pairs at generating offense with over 700 minutes 5v5 is a good thing either.

It's been 3 games, but they HAVE been better since Trouba went out. I don't know what the correlation is but it's been a thing.

 

[NYR Viper]

This is the kind of analysis that pisses me off because checking line Larry is intentionally ignoring a bunch of shit.

Under those TOI parameters, they're 18th out of 20 in xG%.

xGA, they're 13th/20

xGF? They're 20th out of 20. Very bottom of the barrel.

They're actually our performing their expected goal output as a pair (2.15 per 60 vs 2.05 expected per 60) and HEAVILY outperforming their expected against (1.25 per 60 vs 2.55 expected per 60.)

I know this is going to be met with a bunch of "DURRRR END LINE RESULTS DURR" but the point is that if their actual performance doesn't improve, their end line results are going to start to spike up towards what the expected results are. All this does is tell me that they should thank their goalies for showing up behind them.

I don't know that I'd consider having a pair with Fox on it as the worst pair of all pairs at generating offense with over 700 minutes 5v5 is a good thing either.

It's been 3 games, but they HAVE been better since Trouba went out. I don't know what the correlation is but it's been a thing.

Thanks for laying this out, this matches the eye-test much better

 

[redwhiteandblue]

Unfortunately, he’s about to stop being cheap.

He's definitely getting a raise. I think if they can sign him to a 6 year deal for $30 mil that would be good for both parties. That is term and security, with a substantial raise, and will take him to an age where he can sign another big contract.

If at worst he's a middle 6 forward, that is a huge shutdown presence, who can chip in offensively, and is on one of the best third lines in the league, for $5 mil that sounds fair with a Cap that goes up slowly but surely. It also is a good gamble for a guy that could continue to project into a nearly (or even) PPG player.

That's my hope for Kakko.

This is the kind of analysis that pisses me off because checking line Larry is intentionally ignoring a bunch of shit.

Under those TOI parameters, they're 18th out of 20 in xG%.

xGA, they're 13th/20

xGF? They're 20th out of 20. Very bottom of the barrel.

They're actually our performing their expected goal output as a pair (2.15 per 60 vs 2.05 expected per 60) and HEAVILY outperforming their expected against (1.25 per 60 vs 2.55 expected per 60.)

I know this is going to be met with a bunch of "DURRRR END LINE RESULTS DURR" but the point is that if their actual performance doesn't improve, their end line results are going to start to spike up towards what the expected results are. All this does is tell me that they should thank their goalies for showing up behind them.

I don't know that I'd consider having a pair with Fox on it as the worst pair of all pairs at generating offense with over 700 minutes 5v5 is a good thing either.

It's been 3 games, but they HAVE been better since Trouba went out. I don't know what the correlation is but it's been a thing.

Helluva post. I love Lindy for all the same reasons everyone else does, but ignoring his decline this year in front of us would be negligent on Drury's part.

 

[bernmeister]

Show some realism. These suggestions are patently absurd.

That is yr opinion, to which y9ou are entitled, not a statement of fact.

 

[lakeshirts37]

Lolwut

I could understand, respect, and agree with a SSS argument, but to take the position that possessing the puck - which is what corsi is supposed to measure - is somehow not relevant is weird.

These are the stats that kickstarted the analytics revolution in hockey, and the teams that are good at them usually win a lot. The Rangers have generally been an outlier in this regard due to going on 2 decades of sparkling goaltending, but LAK, CHI, and TBL certainly all proved the concept of the value of those stats.

Fwiw, before tonight, Rempe had a 50% corsi and a small + corsirel, but was much worse in fenwick.

I understand their origin, not that it has any bearing on its usage today…they’re primitive and have been replaced with better models such as expected goals.

 

[jay from jersey]

I REALLY don't want to give up major assets for Chychrun who very well could hit UFA at years end. Now when he hits UFA? I'm game.

I don’t really want him at all tbh….
He’d be a PP2 QB… he’s had his stretch’s where he’s impressed no doubt, but he’s oft injured…..
I don’t want a chytil on D with a 5 mill cap hit…. I don’t want to give up the assets it will cost to acquire him…..
I don’t like that he’s never played on a winner…..
I think he’d be a bad partner for fox as well. If they got him, he’d likely be paired with Schneider imo….
And I don’t trust a kAm-fox pairing either tbh

 

[SA16]

I don’t really want him at all tbh….
He’d be a PP2 QB… he’s had his stretch’s where he’s impressed no doubt, but he’s oft injured…..
I don’t want a chytil on D with a 5 mill cap hit…. I don’t want to give up the assets it will cost to acquire him…..
I don’t like that he’s never played on a winner…..
I think he’d be a bad partner for fox as well. If they got him, he’d likely be paired with Schneider imo….
And I don’t trust a kAm-fox pairing either tbh

He's not even a PP QB. He's a guy who plays in the right circles taking one timers. That's why in his career he has 25 PPG to 32 PPA which is an extraordinarily high ratio for a defenseman. By extraordinarily high I mean it is literally the highest PPG : PPP ratio of any active dman in the league since he debuted (min 10 ppgs)

 

[Savant]

But I was told Lindgren is garbage and we need to trade him ASAP?

this says more about Fox

 

[80shockeywasbuns]

This is the kind of analysis that pisses me off because checking line Larry is intentionally ignoring a bunch of shit.

Under those TOI parameters, they're 18th out of 20 in xG%.

xGA, they're 13th/20

xGF? They're 20th out of 20. Very bottom of the barrel.

They're actually our performing their expected goal output as a pair (2.15 per 60 vs 2.05 expected per 60) and HEAVILY outperforming their expected against (1.25 per 60 vs 2.55 expected per 60.)

I know this is going to be met with a bunch of "DURRRR END LINE RESULTS DURR" but the point is that if their actual performance doesn't improve, their end line results are going to start to spike up towards what the expected results are. All this does is tell me that they should thank their goalies for showing up behind them.

I don't know that I'd consider having a pair with Fox on it as the worst pair of all pairs at generating offense with over 700 minutes 5v5 is a good thing either.

It's been 3 games, but they HAVE been better since Trouba went out. I don't know what the correlation is but it's been a thing.

 

[JimmyG89]

I take back everything I said. Don't care that he ditched it. He's going to need to repent his sins to Trocheck's grandmother to be forgiven.

 

[bl02]

View attachment 835771

If Miller/Schneider keep playing like this for the next 7-10 games I just hope the coach realizes it and puts Trouba on the third pair with Gus. Not sure how much that's gonna help but at least you have Miller/Schneider as a pretty good mobile big 2nd pairing. 90 percent it won't happen tho.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

View attachment 835771

What's the point of posting this? Clearly this is at the end of a long shift, Laff can barely skate. And Lindgren isn't even on the ice.

 

[80shockeywasbuns]

What's the point of posting this? Clearly this is at the end of a long shift, Laff can barely skate. And Lindgren isn't even on the ice.

The point is that Fox/Lindgren would probably be underwater this year if not for that kind of goaltending

 

[aufheben]

If Miller/Schneider keep playing like this for the next 7-10 games I just hope the coach realizes it and puts Trouba on the third pair with Gus. Not sure how much that's gonna help but at least you have Miller/Schneider as a pretty good mobile big 2nd pairing. 90 percent it won't happen tho.

He’s the captain. It won’t happen.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

He’s the captain. It won’t happen.

If he's the captain, he should insist upon it...

 

[Flan the incredible]

This is the kind of analysis that pisses me off because checking line Larry is intentionally ignoring a bunch of shit.

Under those TOI parameters, they're 18th out of 20 in xG%.

xGA, they're 13th/20

xGF? They're 20th out of 20. Very bottom of the barrel.

They're actually our performing their expected goal output as a pair (2.15 per 60 vs 2.05 expected per 60) and HEAVILY outperforming their expected against (1.25 per 60 vs 2.55 expected per 60.)

I know this is going to be met with a bunch of "DURRRR END LINE RESULTS DURR" but the point is that if their actual performance doesn't improve, their end line results are going to start to spike up towards what the expected results are. All this does is tell me that they should thank their goalies for showing up behind them.

I don't know that I'd consider having a pair with Fox on it as the worst pair of all pairs at generating offense with over 700 minutes 5v5 is a good thing either.

It's been 3 games, but they HAVE been better since Trouba went out. I don't know what the correlation is but it's been a thing.

Could it be that its not Trouba and new additions at the trade deadline? Not sure how Trouba would factor into defense pairings when he isn't on the ice with them as opposed to the new forwards who are.

Great analysis though. Thank you

 

[bobbop]

He's definitely getting a raise. I think if they can sign him to a 6 year deal for $30 mil that would be good for both parties. That is term and security, with a substantial raise, and will take him to an age where he can sign another big contract.

If at worst he's a middle 6 forward, that is a huge shutdown presence, who can chip in offensively, and is on one of the best third lines in the league, for $5 mil that sounds fair with a Cap that goes up slowly but surely. It also is a good gamble for a guy that could continue to project into a nearly (or even) PPG player.

That's my hope for Kakko.


Helluva post. I love Lindy for all the same reasons everyone else does, but ignoring his decline this year in front of us would be negligent on Drury's part.

Best case…Best Case if he has a great playoffs is the Chytil contract. Not getting 6 years from Drury unless he’s making a buck two eighty.

 

[kovazub94]

What's the point of posting this? Clearly this is at the end of a long shift, Laff can barely skate. And Lindgren isn't even on the ice.

It’s Trouba with Miller lol

 

[haohmaru]

That is yr opinion, to which y9ou are entitled, not a statement of fact.

Let’s try Jonathon Quick on the wing too. He can play there when he’s not in the net.

Zibanejad is the number one center on this team, a position which he’s paid to play and has played his entire adult life. Switching him to right wing is a complete fantasy and that IS a statement of fact.

 

[kovazub94]

He’s the captain. It won’t happen.

What does it have to do with anything? There’s been captains playing bottom-6 forwards even 4th line, as well as 3rd pair D. If Laviolette asks it to make the whole team better as a captain Trouba should be embracing this role.