Roster Building Thread - Part VIII (2023-24 season)

[80shockeywasbuns]

To be fair laviolette said that vesey didn't really deserve to be scratched and that they were looking at different combinations etc

What does that even mean though. Who test runs combinations that don’t include your 12 best skaters in game #1? Clearly that was the 4th line he thought would be best based on whatever “role” he had in mind.

 

[bhamill]

Yeah, show me one post where Lindgren is labeled “untouchable”??? But put upgrading him in the context of the Rangers situation and sorry if we’re having doubts about realistic feasibility of such development in-season without a big overpayment (and in this case the same posters who call for this upgrade will be screaming bloody murder and calling for Drury’s head on a stick).

Well, I was addressing someone who stated he was not untouchable. I wasn’t saying anyone in particular unequivocally STATED he was. And I’ve agreed, in posts on this thread, that it will be VERY difficult to upgrade this season, especially in light of our cap situation.
In short: we agree.

 

[Clark Kellogg]

What does that even mean though. Who test runs combinations that don’t include your 12 best skaters in game #1? Clearly that was the 4th line he thought would be best based on whatever “role” he had in mind.

To be fair laviolette said that vesey didn't really deserve to be scratched and that they were looking at different combinations etc

Talking out of my hat here but I don’t believe Laviolette would have said anything different no matter what the truth was.
How would that play out?
Reporter: Hey coach why isn’t Jimmy Ve$ey in the lineup on opening night?
Coach: He just isn’t as good as the 12 forwards that dressed. His game is too vanilla.

 

[80shockeywasbuns]

Talking out of my hat here but I don’t believe Laviolette would have said anything different no matter what the truth was.
How would that play out?
Reporter: Hey coach why isn’t Jimmy Ve$ey in the lineup on opening night?
Coach: He just isn’t as good as the 12 forwards that dressed. His game is too vanilla.

exactly it’s the kind of question where the coach gives you some word salad 99% of the time. He thought Bonino/Goodrow/Pitlick were better options than Vesey, it’s that simple

 

[Machinehead]

I will leave assertion that Miller would become a better defender than Lindgren when paired with Fox for another day, but the issue that we’re trying to address is on the offensive side. And here is my issue. I get the concern that Lindgren can’t keep up as needed with Fox (even though personally I think he Lindgren was much better at it last season so I’m still hopeful that he has room for improvement that is not just wishful thinking). But when we assert that the issue is puck control, ie passing and Miller is not much better at it than Lindgren. So I can see why yet another coaching staff doesn’t want to shuffle Fox-Lindgren and Trouba-Miller because losing the developed chemistry benefits won’t be offset by implement elsewhere like offense from Fox’s pair.

Fox can pass. Miller could just carry it and never have to pass again except to Fox. Lindgren does neither.

 

[SA16]

exactly it’s the kind of question where the coach gives you some word salad 99% of the time. He thought Bonino/Goodrow/Pitlick were better options than Vesey, it’s that simple

I think he planned to rotate those four spots to see what worked best and figured the fairest way to do it was to go in alphabetical order.

 

[hardnosed]

Fox can pass. Miller could just carry it and never have to pass again except to Fox. Lindgren does neither.

Great. So you fixed our 1st pair. Now what do we do for the other 35-40 minutes? Lindgren/Trouba? Guys on here head's would explode. Lindgren/Schneider, that's worse and we have seen Gus and Trouba. That wasn't too smooth either.

 

[Machinehead]

Great. So you fixed our 1st pair. Now what do we do for the other 35-40 minutes? Lindgren/Trouba? Guys on here head's would explode. Lindgren/Schneider, that's worse and we have seen Gus and Trouba. That wasn't too smooth either.

This entire conversation has been predicated on adding a LD.

 

[hardnosed]

This entire conversation has been predicated on adding a LD.

Good luck with that. Not going to happen until the summer. At least not someone better than the 6/7 depth options that are available at the deadline. That's why this whole argument is just a waste of time

 

[Fitzy]

I think you'd all find that Lindgren was a slightly better exit passer than you all thought were he to play on a pairing where he wasn't always deferential to Fox

 

[JimmyG89]

Kakko skating even on his own is a boost for the team. Figure he needs conditioning, since he has missed a month and it was lower body, I wonder if he makes the west coast trip beginning 1/18. If not, after the break it will be.

They're going to take their time with both Kakko and Chytil cause they can. Their deadline moves will be pieces in for pieces out. The upgrade for Bonino is needed, and we should be rooting for the Kraken to lose games, cause Bellemare would be my target.

 

[Levitate]

What does that even mean though. Who test runs combinations that don’t include your 12 best skaters in game #1? Clearly that was the 4th line he thought would be best based on whatever “role” he had in mind.

I don't remember Vesey being particularly good in preseason, or even at the start of the year once he got into the lineup. I think it took him a little bit to ramp up into current form

that said yeah still think he had more "upside" than pitlick or goodrow even if he wasn't playing well at the time (but good luck convincing any coach that goodrow should sit)

 

[Avery16]

Talking out of my hat here but I don’t believe Laviolette would have said anything different no matter what the truth was.
How would that play out?
Reporter: Hey coach why isn’t Jimmy Ve$ey in the lineup on opening night?
Coach: He just isn’t as good as the 12 forwards that dressed. His game is too vanilla.

We've had coaches say similar things.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Kakko skating even on his own is a boost for the team. Figure he needs conditioning, since he has missed a month and it was lower body, I wonder if he makes the west coast trip beginning 1/18. If not, after the break it will be.

They're going to take their time with both Kakko and Chytil cause they can. Their deadline moves will be pieces in for pieces out. The upgrade for Bonino is needed, and we should be rooting for the Kraken to lose games, cause Bellemare would be my target.

Kakko is skating already?

Edit- just saw it in the Kakko thread, nice!

 

[Machinehead]

Good luck with that. Not going to happen until the summer. At least not someone better than the 6/7 depth options that are available at the deadline. That's why this whole argument is just a waste of time

Yeah because you have this really weird opinion that good players aren't going to be available at the trade deadline. Good luck with that.

 

[kovazub94]

Fox can pass. Miller could just carry it and never have to pass again except to Fox. Lindgren does neither.

Agree but I also don't think Miller's ability to carry is what's critically needed to x-Fox pair.

 

[kovazub94]

I think he planned to rotate those four spots to see what worked best and figured the fairest way to do it was to go in alphabetical order.

Vesey's upset Zibanejad wasn't part of the rotation

 

[Machinehead]

At last year's deadline, Hronek, Chychrun, Gostisbehere, Zaitsev, McCabe, Orlov, and Ekholm were all moved.

This year, no defensemen are available because no reason.

Over the summer, teams will be beating the door down to take Lindgren, who was untradeable 90 days ago in March because no reason.

Have I accurately summed up the events that soothsayers have foreseen?

 

[hardnosed]

Yeah because you have this really weird opinion that good players aren't going to be available at the trade deadline. Good luck with that.

We'll see who we add at the deadline. Talk to you then

 

[Machinehead]

We'll see who we add at the deadline. Talk to you then

You didn't say we wouldn't acquire them, you said they wouldn't be available until the summer for some reason.

 

[hardnosed]

You didn't say we wouldn't acquire them, you said they wouldn't be available until the summer for some reason.

I said that Lindgren wasn't going anywhere until the summer. That's a big difference.

 

[Machinehead]

I think you'd all find that Lindgren was a slightly better exit passer than you all thought were he to play on a pairing where he wasn't always deferential to Fox

I would absolutely agree with that...before this year.

And his decline is super concerning considering how often he's been rocked.

 

[Machinehead]

I said that Lindgren wasn't going anywhere until the summer. That's a big difference.

But why? That doesn't make any sense. He's either getting traded or he's not. If he is, the Rangers have no reason to wait.

 

[hardnosed]

But why? That doesn't make any sense. He's either getting traded or he's not. If he is, the Rangers have no reason to wait.

Why is this so freaking complicated. The only way to get a very good defenseman in season is to move somebody making decent money for cap reasons. When I say this, someone says trade Lindgren for him. And I reply that it's impossible to make an in season trade where one team trades a defenseman for another teams defenseman. It's like looking for the perfect storm of a trade. And to top it off, if some team has a young defenseman with some offensive skills that everyone thinks we need, Drury won't make that deal because our coaches would prefer Lindgren.
So, Lindgren stays until the off season when maybe Drury can make a deal and has time to restructure what we have on D.

 

[Machinehead]

Why is this so freaking complicated. The only way to get a very good defenseman in season is to move somebody making decent money for cap reasons. When I say this, someone says trade Lindgren for him. And I reply that it's impossible to make an in season trade where one team trades a defenseman for another teams defenseman. It's like looking for the perfect storm of a trade. And to top it off, if some team has a young defenseman with some offensive skills that everyone thinks we need, Drury won't make that deal because our coaches would prefer Lindgren.
So, Lindgren stays until the off season when maybe Drury can make a deal and has time to restructure what we have on D.

It's freaking complicated because people are discussing normal ass hockey trades and you're acting acting we're proposing Fox for McDavid.

Maybe it happens or maybe it doesn't, but there's absolutely nothing impossible or out of the ordinary about what has been discussed.

If we traded, just to give an example, Lindgren, a prospect, and a 1st for Hanifin, you'd be the only hockey fan on Earth surprised.