Roster Building Thread - Part VIII (2023-24 season)

[Kendo]

I truly think Hanifan is the right move this deadline. He upgrades the team now and for the long term. Outside of that, offensively, I’m not sure I see the appeal of Lindholm especially for the cost. If the team wants to look at someone in the offseason in terms of an upgrade I’d be open to it but so much depends on how Othmann and Berard continue to develop in Hartford. But there is no one coming on defense. That’s going to need to be upgraded externally.

The swap has legs. Upgrade on D for multiple seasons.

Adding in Lindholm would help quell some worries about Chytil since he can play C or W, so I see the appeal. I just balk at the "including Kakko and a 1st" part of the discussion and don't think getting both Flames would fit next season anyway. So I'm closer to agreeing with you than going all out and making it a blockbuster. Heck, I'm probably closer to wussing out and doing nothing than you are. I'm just contextualizing what others are saying.

I do not think Lindy has much to do with Fox's points per game this season since very few are at even strength.

Kreidbanejad have a lot to do with the ES numbers of Fox, Lindgren, and Kakko, as well as their own. There's no real way to prove causation in any direction, so we're talking more opinion than fact.

But the point remains, as long as the PP keeps Fox running at nearly a P/GP clip overall, then we can stomach 20 & 93 running a "5v5 PK" and not giving up much. That can't keep happening all season and into the playoffs, but for right now we're at the top of the Metro by a decent margin despite it.

 

[Kendo]

Rangers need defense more than a forward. If they are going to trade assets for anything, let it be Hanifan. Look to sign him and move on from Lindgren in the summer. Rangers love their BC guys

We're not scoring 5v5. I think a hypothetical even-money upgrade on Wheeler would do more for us than an even money upgrade on Lindgren. It's just that there's a valid target with Hanifin right now, but I don't know who is available for ~$1m that would qualify as an upgrade on Wheeler.

What would you say to holding off on the trade, making an offer for UFA Hanifin in July, and trading an RFA Lindgren shortly thereafter? Gain a pick instead of losing one. In the immortal words of a young Patches O'Houlihan, "That's a two point swing!"

 

[IDvsEGO]

We're not scoring 5v5. I think a hypothetical even-money upgrade on Wheeler would do more for us than an even money upgrade on Lindgren. It's just that there's a valid target with Hanifin right now, but I don't know who is available for ~$1m that would qualify as an upgrade on Wheeler.

What would you say to holding off on the trade, making an offer for UFA Hanifin in July, and trading an RFA Lindgren shortly thereafter? Gain a pick instead of losing one. In the immortal words of a young Patches O'Houlihan, "That's a two point swing!"

Wheeler has a ntc. Who’s he accepting a move to? Because my guess is, New Jersey and the islanders only.

 

[McRanger92]

We're not scoring 5v5. I think a hypothetical even-money upgrade on Wheeler would do more for us than an even money upgrade on Lindgren. It's just that there's a valid target with Hanifin right now, but I don't know who is available for ~$1m that would qualify as an upgrade on Wheeler.

What would you say to holding off on the trade, making an offer for UFA Hanifin in July, and trading an RFA Lindgren shortly thereafter? Gain a pick instead of losing one. In the immortal words of a young Patches O'Houlihan, "That's a two point swing!"

I’m fine with waiting but I also think the Rangers are the best team in a weak Eastern Conference. That effects the trade deadline calculation for a team with Cup expectations

 

[Flan the incredible]

Rangers need help 5v5. You know what helps that? Swapping a offensive blackhole for a top pairing puck moving dman.

 

[Avery16]

Rangers need help 5v5. You know what helps that? Swapping a offensive blackhole for a top pairing puck moving dman.

To pair with an already elite puck moving defenseman? That’s how you swap an offensive black hole with a defensive black hole. I don’t think that will fly with the way Shesty has been playing lately.

 

[huerter]

When was the last time you were walking down the street and overheard a Noah Hanifin discussion?

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

When was the last time you were walking down the street and overheard a Noah Hanifin discussion?

Who?

 

[Boris Zubov]

When was the last time you were walking down the street and overheard a Noah Hanifin discussion?

Three times this week, actually.

 

[Kendo]

Wheeler has a ntc. Who’s he accepting a move to? Because my guess is, New Jersey and the islanders only.

For sure. I don't see anyone available for an upgrade at similar money, regardless. If we magically find one, then Wheeler can choose to go the other way, sit in the press box, or get waived.

Rangers need help 5v5. You know what helps that? Swapping a offensive blackhole for a top pairing puck moving dman.

If Fox can't help fix 20 & 93, then a second Fox wouldn't do much either. That would also compromise 5v5 defense, which is one of the only things those two are doing well at ES. Again, that's appointing the causation to Lindgren because that's what your gut is telling you.

Even when fully healthy, we're missing a top 9 F, who is optimally a C/W hybrid. Wheeler and Goodie were both supposed to be, but neither are. It's a hole this season, and no kids in the system that fit that profile going forward.

When was the last time you were walking down the street and overheard a Noah Hanifin discussion?

I would be cised.

Am I doing that right? =P

 

[KOVALEV022473]

I’m fine with waiting but I also think the Rangers are the best team in a weak Eastern Conference. That effects the trade deadline calculation for a team with Cup expectations

I love how anytime the Rangers are having a successful season, it’s due to “a Weak Conference/Division” How about we just have a good team? Sometimes, that’s an acceptable answer as well.

 

[Levitate]

Rangers need help 5v5 at least in part because we don't even know if Chytil is ever coming back and Bonino as 3C is absolutely terrible

 

[McRanger92]

I love how anytime the Rangers are having a successful season, it’s due to “a Weak Conference/Division” How about we just have a good team? Sometimes, that’s an acceptable answer as well.

I’m not saying that, we’re a legit great team. but combined with the fact that the East isn’t looking too scary might make the GM more inclined to go for it

 

[Kendo]

I love how anytime the Rangers are having a successful season, it’s due to “a Weak Conference/Division” How about we just have a good team? Sometimes, that’s an acceptable answer as well.

This time, the argument has a lot of legs. The Devils were probably overhyped, even if there's a lot to like with their F & D corps. A lot of the top 8 preseason odds favorites are struggling. We're doing well. We're a good team. We have a couple of issues and are still chugging along despite some key injuries.

Quick has been a revelation under Allaire. Gus has solidified the top 6 D. Wheeler seems like a really nice guy? LOL

In a stronger Division/Conference, having a 3C Bonino would get punished harder, yet here we are. I think we're a damn good team. But the weakness of other teams is why we're not doing worse while having two 4th liners in the top 9. If the kids come back and play at their .5 P/GP level that we know they have in them, then we're a bona fide wagon. Anyone that says it's just because of a weak year for other teams can suck it.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

We're not scoring 5v5. I think a hypothetical even-money upgrade on Wheeler would do more for us than an even money upgrade on Lindgren. It's just that there's a valid target with Hanifin right now, but I don't know who is available for ~$1m that would qualify as an upgrade on Wheeler.

What would you say to holding off on the trade, making an offer for UFA Hanifin in July, and trading an RFA Lindgren shortly thereafter? Gain a pick instead of losing one. In the immortal words of a young Patches O'Houlihan, "That's a two point swing!"

Honestly i think kreider and mika need a divorce. Its always that line that struggles 5 on 5, i thought some of our best games last year was when Kreider was with Trochek, not saying I'd change the other line but swapping Cuylle and Kreider might have a positive effect on either Kreider or Mika.

I love how anytime the Rangers are having a successful season, it’s due to “a Weak Conference/Division” How about we just have a good team? Sometimes, that’s an acceptable answer as well.

Well it must be weak the Rangers are doing well....thats the logic lol

 

[Lindberg Cheese]

I'm not sure we can fit for next season:
20-93-78
10-16-13
50-Lindholm-72
X-21-26
Hanafin-23
79-8
X-4
31
X

If the numbers can work, then we're "busting our nut" as it were, by moving Kakko and a 1st. If we had a Perreault or Othmann level C prospect, then we could use Chytil in the trade instead, and save some space, but alas.

It would be a bold move, I'll give it that. It would certainly set us up for 2 or 3 runs past this one, at the cost of room to maneuver. I'm not fully against it, but that would be the one deal we make for quite a while.

20-93-24
10-16-13
78-72-Pinto
50-21-26
55-23
79-8
6/Rob - 4
31
X

One smaller move, without costing a ton, and still a lot of flexibility going forward. It's admittedly not as much of a wagon as the other proposed lineup. I would argue that the maneuverability would afford us a higher ceiling past this season.

Right now, we're a top team with reinforcements on the way without any trades. This is a season to really go for it since there's not a presumptive "team to beat" unless it's the Rangers. If we stand pat and lose in the ECF, it could be viewed as a missed opportunity. If we trade another 1st and still fall short, it's more wasted assets and still not even a B prospect at Center (BMB needs to take a step forward to count, which while I'm confident in, he's merely "almost" there).

I would lobby for a half-measure instead of either standing pat or going all in. I respect both other trains of thought though, as long as they're grounded in reality cap-wise and have some sort of plan for next year as well.

I think that we could sign one of Lindholm and Hanifin as UFAs. I believe in cycling good teams generally and not mortgaging the future, but I feel it this year. Next year is next year but say we do lose Kakko, Lindgren and all our UFAs maybe hold on to Gus.

CK MZ Othmann
AP Tro Laf
Cuylle Chytil Sundqvist/Johnson/Sturm
Vesey Goodie Edstrom

OEL Fox
Key Trouba
Jones/Gus Schneider

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Rangers need help 5v5 at least in part because we don't even know if Chytil is ever coming back and Bonino as 3C is absolutely terrible

I have a feeling Laviolette absolutely LOVES Bonino

I love how anytime the Rangers are having a successful season, it’s due to “a Weak Conference/Division” How about we just have a good team? Sometimes, that’s an acceptable answer as well.

We definitely have a good team. But at this stage in our cycle, anything short of a cup finals is not good enough.

So identifying and fixing issues is important even if we have a great record

 

[Raspewtin]

We're not scoring 5v5. I think a hypothetical even-money upgrade on Wheeler would do more for us than an even money upgrade on Lindgren. It's just that there's a valid target with Hanifin right now, but I don't know who is available for ~$1m that would qualify as an upgrade on Wheeler.

What would you say to holding off on the trade, making an offer for UFA Hanifin in July, and trading an RFA Lindgren shortly thereafter? Gain a pick instead of losing one. In the immortal words of a young Patches O'Houlihan, "That's a two point swing!"

Lindgren being upgraded on would greatly help our offense so it's not an automatic turnover whenever he gets it

 

[Kendo]

I think that we could sign one of Lindholm and Hanifin as UFAs. I believe in cycling good teams generally and not mortgaging the future, but I feel it this year. Next year is next year but say we do lose Kakko, Lindgren and all our UFAs maybe hold on to Gus.

CK MZ Othmann
AP Tro Laf
Cuylle Chytil Sundqvist/Johnson/Sturm
Vesey Goodie Edstrom

OEL Fox
Key Trouba
Jones/Gus Schneider

I'm with you on the fact that there's some "mojo" this year. I feel it too.

Wait, in this hypothetical, did we trade Kakko and Lindgren for a rental or two? Or are you supposing that we recoup some draft capital by trading them away in the off-season, therefore opening up cap space? HUGE difference.

OEL would be a pretty big question mark. If he wants a similar 1-yr deal to what he just got this year, I could entertain it. Same if Gus wants sub $3x1. I'm more keen on signing a UFA Hani and trading RFA Lindy rather than trading Lindy+. One more pick/prospect rather than one less. Admittedly, that leads to the "missed opportunity" conversation if we get bounced in the ECF when one player could have arguably made the difference.

A 2022 version of Copp added to today's roster would make us the team to beat, imo. A proven 2nd line quality C/W with some JAM, on the right side of 30, for around $2m with a little retention? I'd dangle our 1st for that kind of rental. Not dangling Kakko for that, though.

 

[Kendo]

Lindgren being upgraded on would greatly help our offense so it's not an automatic turnover whenever he gets it

Wouldn't he have worse giveaway stats if that were true? Honest question, not snark.

The only players on the team with fewer giveaways are 4th liners that play half his minutes, or players that have played way fewer games.

 

[kovazub94]

This time, the argument has a lot of legs. The Devils were probably overhyped, even if there's a lot to like with their F & D corps. A lot of the top 8 preseason odds favorites are struggling. We're doing well. We're a good team. We have a couple of issues and are still chugging along despite some key injuries.

Quick has been a revelation under Allaire. Gus has solidified the top 6 D. Wheeler seems like a really nice guy? LOL

In a stronger Division/Conference, having a 3C Bonino would get punished harder, yet here we are. I think we're a damn good team. But the weakness of other teams is why we're not doing worse while having two 4th liners in the top 9. If the kids come back and play at their .5 P/GP level that we know they have in them, then we're a bona fide wagon. Anyone that says it's just because of a weak year for other teams can suck it.

NHL is a very difficult league to succeed. (duh). What I mean specifically and why there’s so much talk about veteran leadership, intangibles etc is because it’s true. Yeah, there are exceptions from time to time but crossing this line from rebuilding into contender is extremely difficult. Look into the East: who thought that Ottawa and Buffalo (and Columbus to a lesser extent) will continue to lag so badly in the standings? How quickly Detroit de-integrate because of lack of depth? That veteran (read over-the-hill) roster of Boston and Isles will be in position they’re in?
This leads to my point about Devils. They’re very talented and kind of surprising most with the way they were able to reach success seemingly overnight last season and continued to build on this in the offseason. However IMO they bought into the hype and thought it was going to be easy going for them in the regular season just like it was last season. Somewhat similar to what the Rangers were dealing with before the helmet toss. Carolina on the other hand just looks tired of going through the same steps as they’ve done in the last few seasons only to fall short in playoffs again. They seem to need some core changes and influx of new blood. Both of these teams don’t have goaltending to fall on while trying to right the ship.
In the end do you think Isles AND Flyers will be 2-3 in Metro? Maybe one of them but gun to the head I’d probably put money on neither.

 

[RangersFan1994]

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

Edstrom and Othmann should see more cups of coffee even after Chytil comes back.

I know it's tough with cap.

This way, they can maybe turn their attention to other areas for the TDL.

 

[Flan the incredible]

If Fox can't help fix 20 & 93, then a second Fox wouldn't do much either. That would also compromise 5v5 defense, which is one of the only things those two are doing well at ES. Again, that's appointing the causation to Lindgren because that's what your gut is telling you.

Even when fully healthy, we're missing a top 9 F, who is optimally a C/W hybrid. Wheeler and Goodie were both supposed to be, but neither are. It's a hole this season, and no kids in the system that fit that profile going

If a second fox was available you do everything to get him. Imagine Colorado saying no to another Makar.

Toews and Makar are also an amazing pair on defense. This is potentially what Hanifin and Fox would be. If teams were switched you're literally arguing for a worse version of Erik Johnson thinking he in some way has helped Makar.

 

[Go Rangers]

fine. 2 bad signings and 2 bad trades.
His midseason trades in 21 were widely applauded and a big reason we made the ECF.
His midseason trades in 22 were widely applauded (pre kane).
His signing of trocheck has turned out to be great.
His signing of wheeler and quick have turned out to be solid signings.

He's made more good moves than bad. Thats literally all you ask.
He doesn't get fleeced in trades, he gets solid value and doesn't mortgage our farm system for a "name".
He actually sees the same holes in our game as the board sees. We talked all last season about a RW and a LD, and look he went out and got a RW and a LD.

His drafting record is solid as well.
Sykora
Othmann
Perreault
BMC

He's willing to be patient and grab skill that needs time, he's not all in on physicality or "grit" but he values it.

Nobody in his position has any intention in physicality. It doesn’t matter who is in charge.