Speculation: Roster Building Thread Part VII: Now with less frenzy!

[NYR Viper]

For a full season of a guy who almost scored 40 2 years ago?

Yeah its pretty bad.

He had 49 points last year.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

He had 49 points last year.

And he still scored 25.

Pu as the prospect return is fine, the other pieces aren't much.

Would you be happy with this return for a full season of Zucc or Hayes?

 

[Ghost of jas]

Yes Montreal and Detroit too.

Here is a fun fact though:
From january 1st on, the Rangers literally had the worst record in the league (with Hank posting a 920+ sv percentage in January and March.) Worse than Vancouver, Worse than Buffalo, worse than Montreal who started to sit players with ingrown hairs and hurt feelings once they fell out of it.

Thats more than half a seasons worth of games. There is no doubt that the Rangers suffered their share of injuries, but its not like other teams didn't.

The Rangers were icing a bad defense in part because of injuries and lost Kreider and Zibanejad, too. So if that all happens again, what has changed? The likes of O’Gara and Gilmour and potentially others rookies would be doing exactly what was done last year. The team does not have the depth for the same things to happen.

 

[NYR Viper]

And he still scored 25.

Pu as the prospect return is fine, the other pieces aren't much.

Would you be happy with this return for a full season of Zucc or Hayes?

If the player was Zuccarello and it was known he wouldn’t be re-signing, yes.

Hayes is a center so it’s a little different

 

[NYR]

The biggest loss this team suffered defensively happened the moment they traded Stepan..

 

[DanielBrassard]

And he still scored 25.

Pu as the prospect return is fine, the other pieces aren't much.

Would you be happy with this return for a full season of Zucc or Hayes?

If Buffalo sucks, which is probably likely, it's really not that bad of a return. The difference between a late 1st and early 2nd is not great. If the normal return is late 1st+ OK prospect, then an early 2nd+3rd+6th and an OK prospect isn't much different IMO.

 

[Kovalev27]

Were bringing back literally the same team we had at the end of February and adding healthy kreider and Shattenkirk with a better back up goalie. We’re in draft hell. 9-12 range.

I don’t see us bottoming out at all with the roster gorton decided to cling to.

Kreider Zibanejad Buchnevich
Namestnikov Chytil Zucc
Spooner Hayes Fast
Vesey Nieves Andersson
Mcleod

Skjei Shattenkirk
Smith DeAngelo
Staal Pionk
Claesson

Hank
Georgiev

That’s not a bottom 5 team. It’s also not good.

That’s where my problem arises.

 

[Savant]

The defense alone is bad enough to make them a bottom 5 team because although the forwards have upside, they certainly cannot outscore teams either.

I foresee a lot of 4-2 losses.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Were bringing back literally the same team we had at the end of February and adding healthy kreider and Shattenkirk with a better back up goalie. We’re in draft hell. 9-12 range.

I don’t see us bottoming out at all with the roster gorton decided to cling to.

Kreider Zibanejad Buchnevich
Namestnikov Chytil Zucc
Spooner Hayes Fast
Vesey Nieves Andersson
Mcleod

Skjei Shattenkirk
Smith DeAngelo
Staal Pionk
Claesson

Hank
Georgiev

That’s not a bottom 5 team. It’s also not good.

That’s where my problem arises.

No one wants Smith and Staal. Shattenkirk probably wont return much at the moment.

Do you want to trade Kreider or Zibby?

What are you supposed to do with Names and Spooner, let them walk for nothing just so we suck more? Terrible asset management. What about Hayes? You see what Skinner just returned. We wouldn't be getting shit for him.

Gorton has done the right thing this off season.

 

[Kovalev27]

Is it that bad?

Those are all capable nhl dmen that won’t be playing AVs garbage system anymore. It’s going to improve.

 

[Kovalev27]

No one wants Smith and Staal. Shattenkirk probably wont return much at the moment.

Do you want to trade Kreider or Zibby?

What are you supposed to do with Names and Spooner, let them walk for nothing just so we suck more? Terrible asset management. What about Hayes? You see what Skinner just returned. We wouldn't be getting **** for him.

Gorton has done the right thing this off season.

We should have dealt Zucc at the deadline

We should have moved at least ONE of Hayes spooner or namestnikov by now not all but someone and if it were for that package then so be it.

We SHOULD be planning to bottom out if we’re serious about acquiring elite top 5 talent in the draft.

You really think the package is going to get better at the deadline? It won’t.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Skinner return seems underwhelming on the surface

Hopefully Zuccarello will fetch more at the deadline but who knows

 

[Gardner McKay]

Is it that bad?

Those are all capable nhl dmen that won’t be playing AVs garbage system anymore. It’s going to improve.

No. So what is the problem?

Sucking to get a better draft pick accomplishes nothing. We could finish last and still pick 4th overall. It is pointless. Not only that, but being that bad does nothing but hurt the confidence of your young players that you are trying to groom. You want them to have competent line mates. You want them to be playing with other skilled players.

Obviously the trade market made it such that Gorton decided to resign all his players and hope that a better spot arises for a trade. Nothing wrong with that strategy. Teams get desperate and overpay at the deadline. They aren't desperate to make moves in the off season.

You continue to be critical of management for the sake of being critical. You aren't even attempting constructive criticism at the moment.

 

[Kovalev27]

If you’re drafting top 5 every year then yeah you’re right however we NEVER get top 5 talent. We need it we need two elite players.

I don’t think Andersson is one

I’m not sure about Chytil or kravstov. We shall see with them

But we need to bottom out a year here. We haven’t in what 50 years?

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Obviously the trade market made it such that Gorton decided to resign all his players and hope that a better spot arises for a trade. Nothing wrong with that strategy. Teams get desperate and overpay at the deadline. They aren't desperate to make moves in the off season.

I think he’s got a point though. No guarantee the deals will be any better at the deadline

Gorton is gambling here and it could blow up in his face

 

[Gardner McKay]

I think he’s got a point though. No guarantee the deals will be any better at the deadline

Gorton is gambling here and it could blow up in his face

He does not have a point. Not even remotely. Tell me with a straight face that it is really gambling when you see what Skinner just returned.

There is never a guarantee. Again. I will make this point over and over because it is an important one. Completely removing most of the talent from this team is an idiotic idea. You want your youngsters to be sheltered to an extent. You want them playing with other good talent. That is how they gain confidence. That is how they grow. Putting them out there with no other talent night in and night out, that is how you ruin a player.

Keeping some of the players for this season gives your younger guys time to settle in while at the same time you hope they produce and up their trade value.

 

[Kovalev27]

Reading skinner was vetoing trades everywhere. Really limited Carolina.

Hayes and the rest didn’t have the leverage.

 

[Kovalev27]

I don’t have a point? Or you don’t agree.

With all due respect my friend Didn’t you just tell me The other day I should be more open to other people’s opinions? And not shoot them down so aggressively?

Didnt you just do that?

Kreider Zibanejad Fast Staal Shattenkirk Skjei Vesey Henrik even Smith is another veteran.

We had plenty so let’s not say gutting the entire team of vets. We should have dealt Zucc and at least one of Hayes Namestnikov or Spooner. We ALL agreed that was what we should have done before the summer started. We didn’t do that now saying we messed up is a crime because it’s a shot at management?

Sorry But no That’s hypocritical

 

[Leetch3]

And he still scored 25.

Pu as the prospect return is fine, the other pieces aren't much.

Would you be happy with this return for a full season of Zucc or Hayes?

i'd probably be ok with the return at the deadline if that was the best we could do. i would not be happy with that move today. its not a deal to jump

 

[NYR713]

He does not have a point. Not even remotely. Tell me with a straight face that it is really gambling when you see what Skinner just returned.

There is never a guarantee. Again. I will make this point over and over because it is an important one. Completely removing most of the talent from this team is an idiotic idea. You want your youngsters to be sheltered to an extent. You want them playing with other good talent. That is how they gain confidence. That is how they grow. Putting them out there with no other talent night in and night out, that is how you ruin a player.

Keeping some of the players for this season gives your younger guys time to settle in while at the same time you hope they produce and up their trade value.

I agree. Build as much of a winning culture as you can at all times. Trying to set up for failure is moronic. I also agree with Kovalev27... the team isn't terrible. I'm not judging that defense until I see them play under Quinn, but the forwards and depth provide plenty potential for scoring. Most likely they end up battling with a couple teams for the 8th spot if they stay healthy.

Or, they completely bomb out like a bunch of mediocre vets with no star talent and young guys that need development definitely could. Then, in the team's current situation, awesome. We'll get a better pick. But I'm not rooting for it.

This is a time for precision moves... quality over quantity and Gorton has plenty of puzzle pieces to play with.

 

[Ghost of jas]

Were bringing back literally the same team we had at the end of February and adding healthy kreider and Shattenkirk with a better back up goalie. We’re in draft hell. 9-12 range.

I don’t see us bottoming out at all with the roster gorton decided to cling to.

Kreider Zibanejad Buchnevich
Namestnikov Chytil Zucc
Spooner Hayes Fast
Vesey Nieves Andersson
Mcleod

Skjei Shattenkirk
Smith DeAngelo
Staal Pionk
Claesson

Hank
Georgiev

That’s not a bottom 5 team. It’s also not good.

That’s where my problem arises.

And when the injuries start happening, as they always do????

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

That’s a disaster for Carolina, honestly.

Canes fans told me Dundon wans to spend and that he isn’t cheap. Guess that was bullshit (well, it obviously was bullshit).

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

He does not have a point. Not even remotely. Tell me with a straight face that it is really gambling when you see what Skinner just returned.

There is never a guarantee. Again. I will make this point over and over because it is an important one. Completely removing most of the talent from this team is an idiotic idea. You want your youngsters to be sheltered to an extent. You want them playing with other good talent. That is how they gain confidence. That is how they grow. Putting them out there with no other talent night in and night out, that is how you ruin a player.

Keeping some of the players for this season gives your younger guys time to settle in while at the same time you hope they produce and up their trade value.

We’ll agree to disagree I guess

I don’t want to strip the team down by the way. But I think it may turn into a mistake that they held onto their assets instead of moving some of them

And it’s a gamble because if they don’t produce it can blow up in your face.

There’s always risk. Gorton traded McDonagh at the deadline because he thought he would get less this summer. And it looks like he was correct.

But he may not be correct on this.

 

[Kovalev27]

And when the injuries start happening, as they always do????

I don’t wish that on anyone but we’ve got some depth. We’ve got 4 pretty good scoring lines there

We’ve got a lot of talent in the minors now because we didn’t open up too many spots.

Even with all we did last year we still finished 8th and the whole bottom fell out.

The switch in defensive schemes and having a competent back up goalie alone at worst keeps us around 8 to 10

 

[NYR]

Were bringing back literally the same team we had at the end of February and adding healthy kreider and Shattenkirk with a better back up goalie. We’re in draft hell. 9-12 range.

I don’t see us bottoming out at all with the roster gorton decided to cling to.

Kreider Zibanejad Buchnevich
Namestnikov Chytil Zucc
Spooner Hayes Fast
Vesey Nieves Andersson
Mcleod

Skjei Shattenkirk
Smith DeAngelo
Staal Pionk
Claesson

Hank
Georgiev

That’s not a bottom 5 team. It’s also not good.

That’s where my problem arises.

There's a good chance that Chytil and Andersson aren't even ready yet.
That D spells doom .

Even Arizona easily has a better team then this.
Bottom 3 if not the worst in the league this year..Watch