NickyFotiu
NYR 2024 Cup Champs!
- Sep 29, 2011
- 17,385
- 9,498
Im going to take the high road and let you know that is not a record you want to revisit.
Proposal: Roster Building Thread Part IV: High Hopes
- Thread starter Gardner McKay
- Start date
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Im going to take the high road and let you know that is not a record you want to revisit.
Mac n Gs
Drury plz
- Jan 17, 2014
- 22,840
- 13,580
This is true, but the same thing did happen to Klein too. Maybe there is something there to the really high shooting% we've seen under AV? That is unless you're Derek Stepan who's a fat balding slob that can't skate or win a faceoff if their life depended on it
Gardner McKay
RIP, Jimmy.
Why not. The only thing that held them back last post season was coaching. You even said it yourself that they were good enough to win the cup last year.
Take away all your coaches favorite problem toys and you don't have that same issue.
Our offense, even without Stepan is better than Nashville and our defense is slightly worse. They just went to the cup final.
NoQuitInNewMexico
it's okay cause it's all just the way it should be
I'm not sure we "solved shot quality" but we were a visibly ridiculous odd man rush team, especially when Grabner was hot.
Machinehead
Fox Mafia Consigliere
Some of them, sure.
But there are plenty that would say "muh I think advanced statalytics should be taken with a grain of salt," and then trade for a fighter.
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Maximus
Registered User
Been doing alot of business travel lately and haven't been around as much but question for my Ranger brothers:
I've been listening alot to NHL Network on Sirrius in my travels and the impression I'm getting from alot of the callers and hosts is that our boys are not considered a threat to either the Pens, Jackets or Caps.
In fact, we are being lumped with the Canes who I do think have improved and even Flyers in the Metro and that we are going to struggle to make the playoffs.
I'm sorry fellas but I'm not buying that one iota. The same **** was said about us last year and we clinched a playoff spot by end of February. I'm not saying it's going to be easy but I don't see us struggling to make the playoffs at all. I think our team is much better than last year's version as Gorton has done a masterful job addressing pretty much every need our team had. Seriously I love what this team can potentially do even withought a so called #1 center. I got a feeling JG will address this during the season anyways. I love love love what JG did to revamp the back end and we have enough firepower for sure especially if Buch and Vesey take the next steps.
Maybe I'm missing something but I honestly think we are going to be battling till the end for the division. I can see us getting 110 or so points and right there with the Pens and in front of the Jackets and Caps.
I'm thinking so long as Hank comes into the season with a chip on his shoulder, which I think he will, to show his detractors that last years struggles were a fluke and we stay relatively healthy, this season could be quite magical and a long playoff run could be in the cards.
Thoughts? Are we being disrespected by the media and other fans outside of NY as is the norm?
I've been listening alot to NHL Network on Sirrius in my travels and the impression I'm getting from alot of the callers and hosts is that our boys are not considered a threat to either the Pens, Jackets or Caps.
In fact, we are being lumped with the Canes who I do think have improved and even Flyers in the Metro and that we are going to struggle to make the playoffs.
I'm sorry fellas but I'm not buying that one iota. The same **** was said about us last year and we clinched a playoff spot by end of February. I'm not saying it's going to be easy but I don't see us struggling to make the playoffs at all. I think our team is much better than last year's version as Gorton has done a masterful job addressing pretty much every need our team had. Seriously I love what this team can potentially do even withought a so called #1 center. I got a feeling JG will address this during the season anyways. I love love love what JG did to revamp the back end and we have enough firepower for sure especially if Buch and Vesey take the next steps.
Maybe I'm missing something but I honestly think we are going to be battling till the end for the division. I can see us getting 110 or so points and right there with the Pens and in front of the Jackets and Caps.
I'm thinking so long as Hank comes into the season with a chip on his shoulder, which I think he will, to show his detractors that last years struggles were a fluke and we stay relatively healthy, this season could be quite magical and a long playoff run could be in the cards.
Thoughts? Are we being disrespected by the media and other fans outside of NY as is the norm?
NYRFAN218
King
I think people are underrating the team and I do believe they are better than last year. But there's a lot of variables at play. How does Pavelec do in his 25+ starts? I'm not expecting him to be Raanta but can he give the team a chance to win? The defense is drastically improved but how will it all mesh together, in particular a Staal - Holden/DeAngelo/Bereglazov/Pionk pair? How are the Rangers going to get by with a current center core of Mika - Hayes - Center TBD - Desharnais? And on that point, who is going to be killing penalties at center in Stepan's spot?
I can see the Rangers putting up the same general point total as last year. Pens and Caps are still the #1 and #2 teams in the division. That being said, the Rangers are more equipped to do damage in the playoffs as currently constructed than they were last year and there's still plenty of time to resolve that glaring hole at center which IMO doesn't really have to be patched up until the trade deadline. They can get by until then with what they have.
Maximus
Registered User
You raise some good points for sure. Here's the way I'm looking at it and why I agree with you that we are being underrated by observers of our team.
-Staal in a bottom #3 paring, it's quite possible won't hurt us as badly as he has the past few years.
-Pavelec has talent and has never in his career played behind such a good defense as the one we should have this season. Would it really be surprising to any of us if under the tutelage from the master, Benny Alaire, that Pavelec might not end up being en fuego like Talbot and Raanta before him were? I know I wouldn't be.
I do agree with you that Mika needs to jump to that next tier that his potential seems to indicate he can get too. I'm thinking 60-65 points for him would be a nice season from an offensive standpoint. We need Hayes and JT to play more like they did the first 4 months of last season than they did the last two.
I really liked the Deshanais signing and think he's going to be this year's version of what Grabner did for us last year. Him being in a 3rd or 4th line center role is perfect for him as he was put in a situation in Montreal where he was playing a top 6 role and he just isn't that kind of player. Don't be surprised if DD ends up with close to 45-50 points in a bottom 6 role which would be tremendous.
I don't know maybe it's a good thing that the rest of the league under estimates us and thinks we are going to suck. It makes it that much sweeter when we beat their *****, make the playoffs as usual and win a few rounds in the playoffs vs teams we aren't supposed to beat. I really like the making of this team and Gorton has once again proved he is one of the top GM's in the league.
I think we are going to have a heck of good team and it's going to be fun times, even better than last years team was
Inferno
Registered User
i think overall the rangers have gotten significantly better. i think teams around them have gotten better...and gotten worse...
i think its unlikely they have an easier path to the SCF than they did last year..which makes me worried.
I think if they can get a true blue #1 center without gutting their team, they can make a run at the cup.
i think its unlikely they have an easier path to the SCF than they did last year..which makes me worried.
I think if they can get a true blue #1 center without gutting their team, they can make a run at the cup.
GordonGecko
First Ping Pong Ball
What makes you think AV won't be giving him major shift time trying to decide if Staal should be on the #1 pairing or the #2 pairing?
not sure where you're getting that from, I haven't seen any of that
Sportsnet ranking us 9th best offseason:
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/nhl-off-season-power-rankings-whos-improved-far/
Maximus
Registered User
Le'ts see as I kind of agree with you:
Pens have stayed pretty much the same.
Caps have gotten worse...that there is not a doubt about
Jackets have stayed pretty much the same tho the Panarin for Saad exchange seems to be tilted in Jackets favor. Let's see how he does withought Kane before we annoint him
Canes have certainly gotten better as they were on their way last year.
Flyers are about the same tho we'll see how good Patrick is which could make them. is Elliot for Mason that much of an upgrade? Not impressed
Islanders are about the same....not a huge fan of Eberle but I can see them being a a pain in the ass as they usually are for us.
Devils will likely be a bit better but not alot as they really can't be any worse.
And us, we definitely got better as JG fixed pretty much everything that ailed us. Only thing missing is a Stepan type 1B type center. I'm sure JG will address that sometime during season.
Overall...taking my 8 ball out, I can easily see us being right there with Pens and Jackets for top 3 slots in Metro with the Caps dropping down a peg and battling it out with Canes for WC spot.
Maximus
Registered User
I'm assuming...call me nuts that Shatty/McD is our #1 pairing and Skjei and Smith are our #2 pairing. I don't think AV would be stupid enough as much as most peeps in here hate him, for him to tinker with our top 4.
I was going by what alot of callers on the NHL Network and some of the hosts have been talking about basically not giving Rangers alot of love. I really think the Caps are going to take a tumble this season and most people I've read and heard still think they will be good enough to contend for the division. I don't.
GordonGecko
First Ping Pong Ball
Maximus
Registered User
"Guarantee"? C'mon bud....really? Why do you say that?
I realize you aren't an AV fan but no way Staal is going to be on the top 4.
GordonGecko
First Ping Pong Ball
Because this is what AV does, outdated vet loyalty mindset. Shatty/McD will definitely be the top pairing but AV has zero recognition of what Skjei / Smith brings to the game and will be playing Staal on that #2 pairing and would not be surprised to see Staal occasionally on the first pairing. Nothing AV has ever done leads me to believe he will skate the correct lines & pairings. Ruff as assistant coach does give me some hope though
Maximus
Registered User
Dang GG...I can see why some AV haters in here can be jaded but that's going a bit too far my friend what you are saying.
I think AV knows what he's got in Skjei and Smith and I would not be surprised at all if JG has "suggested" to him who he thinks is our top two parings and it doesn't include Staal.
Let's see what happens but I think you'll be pleasantly surprised at how things end up turning out when it comes to ice time for our back end.
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
You need depth scoring in the playoffs. The team might be better set up to keep the puck out of the net, which they've struggled with in the playoffs the last two years, but until something changes they're going to have a harder time scoring than they have in previous years.
Maximus
Registered User
I hear ya but keep in mind it's not like Steps was lighting it up last year. He had some major issues putting the puck into the net as I believe there were two bigtime goal less streaks he went on last year. One I believe went 23 or so games and the other was something like 12.
Not saying we aren't going to miss Steps production but if Deshanais performs as I anticipate....45-50 points in a bottom 6 role(not a missprint as I truly think he's going to flourish here and be the 2018 version of Grabner from last year) and with improvements and stepping up from the Buch's,Vesey's, Hayes,JT and Mika along with what we know will be JG trade for someone who will help us down the middle, I think we'll be just fine offensively.
To be honest, my real concern when I look at everything is if Hank plays better than last year. If he does and I do think he will as I expect him to come into the season with a chip on his shoulder to prove his detractors wrong and that last year's roller coaster of a ride, was a fluke. If he plays as well as I expect, I truly believe this team will be more dangerous than last year and will be one of the top teams in the East and will be poised to make a long playoff run....longer than last years was. We'll see but I'm feeling pretty damn optimistic about our prospects for the season and once again I think we will prove the doubters wrong....
Boruto
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- Jun 27, 2011
- 15,613
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I think the way this hand is stacked, it'll be hard for AV to play Staal in the top 4. Hard but not impossible. We've had a barely 7th D man Girardi play on the top pairing for years. We've had a barely 7th D man Staal play on the top 4 during crunch time in the playoffs again and again even as the ship split into two pieces and people were falling to their deaths and corpses were floating to the surface. If AV starts camp off by writing off Bereglazov, the 3LD spot is Staal's and with the way AV constructs his pairings to create 3 not great but not bad pairings (save Staal-Holden), we could legitimately see a Staal-Shattenkirk play 18-20 minutes a night and Skjei-ADA/Pionk will end up with 18-20 minutes as well. If Girardi can man the 1RD spot with McDonagh all these years, that 1RD spot is anyone's to take as long as they're not a rookie.
I'd argue they might see more offense from the blueline and more offense facilitated by the blueline, but we'll see. Also as I've said I think it's totally plausible they address the center position during the season at some point as well.
Boruto
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- Jun 27, 2011
- 15,613
- 436
I mean, you need everything to win in the playoffs. If you ran a simulator for any randomly or thoughtfully constructed team that featured Staal-Holden 20 minutes a night and to defend leads in the final minutes, it would take about 300 years to win a cup by chance and luck. multiple center ice goals, goalie knocking puck into his own net, the puck going in our net at an angle that no referee or camera could discern, the other team putting the puck into their own net on a delay penalty.
We lost in the playoffs last year entirely because we couldn't keep the puck out of our net and because Vigneault kept playing Staal-Holden. Scoring was just fine last year and Stepan basically did nothing offensively both on the score sheet and on the ice. Offense might come and go and be hot and cold but a bad defense is 60 minutes a night and is the real reason why teams' offense can be hot and cold. If you have Erik Karlsson on the ice for the 3:45 of the final 4:00 trailing by a goal and you're up against Staal-Holden? That's how teams "find" offense.
eco's bones
Registered User
As currently constructed for the Rangers to do well both Zibanejad and Hayes are going to have to have big years--maybe huge years. It's possible. Objectively the center position is not a particular strength of ours.
The ability of the defense to move the puck has certainly taken an uptick--I'm just not sold right now on the forwards and the goaltending.
Big years from Kreider, Miller and Buchnevich, Vesey would really help. I don't worry about Zucc--he will always be good. I'm not a fan of Desharnais.
As for the goaltending--Henrik IMO did not play that well last year and I've got very little faith in Pavelec. Henrik shouldn't play more than 55 games so it will be important for his backup to play very well.
Gorton should have bought out Staal. His will be a $5.7 mil black hole of a contract. He will block a younger and better defenseman from making the team. His contract will complicate the Rangers ability to bring in a quality center.
So until we upgrade at the forward position and Henrik shows he still got it--I'm kind of skeptical. I'm looking at this upcoming year as a real dog fight for us to make the playoffs--that if we get in we'll be the 7th or 8th seed. I don't see us right now as a legit contender.
The ability of the defense to move the puck has certainly taken an uptick--I'm just not sold right now on the forwards and the goaltending.
Big years from Kreider, Miller and Buchnevich, Vesey would really help. I don't worry about Zucc--he will always be good. I'm not a fan of Desharnais.
As for the goaltending--Henrik IMO did not play that well last year and I've got very little faith in Pavelec. Henrik shouldn't play more than 55 games so it will be important for his backup to play very well.
Gorton should have bought out Staal. His will be a $5.7 mil black hole of a contract. He will block a younger and better defenseman from making the team. His contract will complicate the Rangers ability to bring in a quality center.
So until we upgrade at the forward position and Henrik shows he still got it--I'm kind of skeptical. I'm looking at this upcoming year as a real dog fight for us to make the playoffs--that if we get in we'll be the 7th or 8th seed. I don't see us right now as a legit contender.
Agreed. There's nothing threatening about our offense in comparison, and having Kevin Hayes at 2C seems a bit premature to me. But looking around the league, there's a handful of teams who have a real 1-2 punch down the middle.
Our D though, it looks solid. I'm hopeful that our Top 4 remain healthy and aren't banged up going into the playoffs. It's a nice move, a luxurious one at that, to have Lindy Ruff as the assistant, hopefully to keep AV in check, otherwise, c ya pal. And while I don't think we're contenders, anything can happen, that's why the games are played. Just like how we laid down for OTT...
Our D though, it looks solid. I'm hopeful that our Top 4 remain healthy and aren't banged up going into the playoffs. It's a nice move, a luxurious one at that, to have Lindy Ruff as the assistant, hopefully to keep AV in check, otherwise, c ya pal. And while I don't think we're contenders, anything can happen, that's why the games are played. Just like how we laid down for OTT...
TheTakedown
Puck is Life
- Jul 11, 2012
- 13,694
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I've played at ice house so I know exactly what you're talking about...
Holy ****, that's insane.
BBKers
Registered User
Yes
And they will add an ST to their name
What is the ST you might ask?
"Seeking Tanner" of course!
The Quebec Strangers
AV with a lifetime irrevocable deal too!
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