Speculation: Roster Building Thread LXXXIX: Going 11-3 to close out this crazy year should do it!

[Matt Rentfree]

Maybe. But when Rangers had Stepan and Brassard as top six centers, many here felt that they werent good enough. They were not "elite". And they were the first two significant trades Gorton made. When he was trying to rebuild "on the fly". Before the letter and the teardown.
Gorton will try to trade for Eichel.

I agree that Gorton is going to try - here are my questions - not for you or anyone else on these boards to answer - just what I think about.

1) What do we have to give up?

2) Do the returns for Buch and Zib/Strome mitigate what we gave up for Eichel?

3) Is this team better with Eichel or better with Buch and Zib/Strome?

 

[RangersFan1994]

Maybe. But when Rangers had Stepan and Brassard as top six centers, many here felt that they werent good enough. They were not "elite". And they were the first two significant trades Gorton made. When he was trying to rebuild "on the fly". Before the letter and the teardown.
Gorton will try to trade for Eichel.

rather get the complete player in Barkov. Eichel reminds me of someone with drama that does not know how to deal with it. only 2 goals in 21

 

[brians1128]

Don't forget Barron. He's going to be a solid 3/4 type guy.

Cuylle

 

[Daves a mess]

Extending Chytil on at least 6 year deal should be a no brainer.

Extending Buchnevich is a tougher call but should be done if he's amiable to take around $6m AAV on a long-term deal without NTC so he's movable when / if he's being squeezed out of position by younger players and the cap is an issue.

Find a way to move Kreider. This one could go into the unrealistic bucket but it would be great way to solve a lot of issues that signing caused (as a result of drafting Lafreniere and flat post-covid cap).

Other decisions to be punted until the next TDL or offseason.

I'm in the don't want to spend the assets to get Jack with a neck problem AND I don't want to extend Mika at the 7 year 60 something mill dollar deal either. Only player I can say i do want and will slightly overpay for is Trevor Zegras.

I think Captain Jack ends up a King.

 

[Daves a mess]

.

There were similar concerns with Jeff Carter prior to being a King. They may have a higher threshold for what concerns them

Mike Richards too.

 

[IDvsEGO]

rather get the complete player in Barkov. Eichel reminds me of someone with drama that does not know how to deal with it. only 2 goals in 21

The bigger difference is that Eichel has a locked in contract, while barkov is a ufa in 22.
barkov is older, and his age doesn’t quite work with the prime of the kids.

 

[Avery16]

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Maybe. But when Rangers had Stepan and Brassard as top six centers, many here felt that they werent good enough. They were not "elite". And they were the first two significant trades Gorton made. When he was trying to rebuild "on the fly". Before the letter and the teardown.
Gorton will try to trade for Eichel.

There are those who still think C positional value is a thing and that you can't win with out an elite "C". I can guarantee that those same people would have said the same thing about the Blues before they won.

The Step/Brass Rangers were good enough to win, they came close twice and the true deficiencies of that group really lied elsewhere (D, more specifically Staal and Girardi in the top 4.) Even if you subscribe to the C positional value theory, what they have right now 1-2-3 has been as productive (if not more) than most of the teams people would consider contenders - Both Zibanejad (with a rough start) and Strome would be pacing 70+ points in a full year and Chytil would be around 45 over an 82 game season.

Seems kind of silly to sell the farm when it's unnecessary, especially when that farm would go for Eichel who comes with his own list of concerns. I think they'll try as well, but I also don't think they're going to go nuts for him. I get that the entire landscape at the position for the Rangers will shift dramatically in 14 months as both Zibanejad and Strome will be UFA's, but their will be other options available between now and then too. You don't need Eichel to win, every team in the history of the NHL has won with out Jack Eichel at the position and many have won with lesser talents than Eichel down the middle.

Also your time line is a bit off. Brass for Zibanejad was well before the rebuild on the fly. Stepan was really the move that kicked that short lived process off but the situations between this group and that one couldn't be more different. It wasn't so much that Stepan and Brass weren't "elite" enough to win with, but it was about replacing them (or attempting to replace) them with younger players who could contribute more in the coming years. I think most of us would sign up for a replay of the Zibanejad trade right now rather than doing what would be the equivalent of the Rick Nash route with Eichel.

 

[ETTER DE]

There are those who still think C positional value is a thing and that you can't win with out an elite "C". I can guarantee that those same people would have said the same thing about the Blues before they won.

The Step/Brass Rangers were good enough to win, they came close twice and the true deficiencies of that group really lied elsewhere (D, more specifically Staal and Girardi in the top 4.) Even if you subscribe to the C positional value theory, what they have right now 1-2-3 has been as productive (if not more) than most of the teams people would consider contenders - Both Zibanejad (with a rough start) and Strome would be pacing 70+ points in a full year and Chytil would be around 45 over an 82 game season.

Seems kind of silly to sell the farm when it's unnecessary, especially when that farm would go for Eichel who comes with his own list of concerns. I think they'll try as well, but I also don't think they're going to go nuts for him. I get that the entire landscape at the position for the Rangers will shift dramatically in 14 months as both Zibanejad and Strome will be UFA's, but their will be other options available between now and then too. You don't need Eichel to win, every team in the history of the NHL has won with out Jack Eichel at the position and many have won with lesser talents than Eichel down the middle.

Also your time line is a bit off. Brass for Zibanejad was well before the rebuild on the fly. Stepan was really the move that kicked that short lived process off but the situations between this group and that one couldn't be more different. It wasn't so much that Stepan and Brass weren't "elite" enough to win with, but it was about replacing them (or attempting to replace) them with younger players who could contribute more in the coming years. I think most of us would sign up for a replay of the Zibanejad trade right now rather than doing what would be the equivalent of the Rick Nash route with Eichel.

Of course he is not selling the farm for Eichel. The whole point to trade for Eichel is that he is younger and can play with "the farm". That is why I said "will try to trade" for him.

 

[Fitzy]

We continue to fall into the false premise that a team is either a championship team on paper, or not a championship team on paper. It's all a matter of probability. No one thought Vegas had the roster to compete for a cup, yet they did.

As for 'elite' players, we have plenty, in my opinion. What the team is awaiting is better consistent secondary scoring, development from current young roster players like Miller who are far from their ceiling, and a more reliable third pairing.

 

[NoQuitInNewMexico]

I know Domi's kind of a hot mess of a person but it worries me that he's a completely different player every season when him and Kakko have the same exact medical issue that's rare for top-level athletes

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I know Domi's kind of a hot mess of a person but it worries me that he's a completely different player every season when him and Kakko have the same exact medical issue that's rare for top-level athletes

It isn't due to him being diabetic.

 

[Chytilmania]

NJ can build its army of speedy twinks, thats now how you win. Once this team matures, look out. Can be like St. Louis but better.

What about a more talented 2010s Kings?

 

[leetch99]

Of course he is not selling the farm for Eichel. The whole point to trade for Eichel is that he is younger and can play with "the farm". That is why I said "will try to trade" for him.

Yes LOL ...Barkov will be the ripe old age of 31 .....AFTER his 5th season as a Ranger ! He will be so OLD he won't be of any use to us LOL.....I think if we had a shot I would take my chances of him being successful until the Senior Home age of 33 on a 7 year deal starting in the 22-23 season .

 

[The New Russian Five]

I would much rather prefer Barkov. Eichel strikes me as immature. Sure the sabres suck, but he should still have been putting in the effort game in and game out. Barkov went through that with the Panthers, but never once complained and kept playing his game. I rather get the Selke level center with sick hands. I don't care if he's a couple years older. Players like Barkov age well and I can see his high IQ game really meshing much better with Panarin than Eichel would.

 

[Fitzy]

5x5 for Strome with a limited NTC, who says no?

Same contract we gave Brassard in 2014 after only a 45 point season.

 

[RangersFan1994]

I would much rather prefer Barkov. Eichel strikes me as immature. Sure the sabres suck, but he should still have been putting in the effort game in and game out. Barkov went through that with the Panthers, but never once complained and kept playing his game. I rather get the Selke level center with sick hands. I don't care if he's a couple years older. Players like Barkov age well and I can see his high IQ game really meshing much better with Panarin than Eichel would.

I totally agree. give me more players that are 200 ft players over players that can wow you and not play the defensive side of the puck. smart players like Barkov age well.

 

[effen]

5x5 for Strome with a limited NTC, who says no?

Same contract we gave Brassard in 2014 after only a 45 point season.

Strome, for sure. He's gonna get a mint.

 

[Fitzy]

Strome, for sure. He's gonna get a mint.

Kind of depends.

The market for secondary scorers and complimentary offensive players is going to be poor with the flat cap.

Strome gets a chance at some security, both locational and financial, and gets to take a leadership position on a young team primed for many seasons of deep playoff runs.

 

[Matt Rentfree]

5x5 for Strome with a limited NTC, who says no?

Same contract we gave Brassard in 2014 after only a 45 point season.

If Strome takes that as a ppg player, I'll do backflips. Not saying it WON'T happen - I have no idea. Just saying that's a great price to lock him up.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

5x5 for Strome with a limited NTC, who says no?

Same contract we gave Brassard in 2014 after only a 45 point season.

Strome says no I think

 

[RangersFan1994]

If Strome takes that as a ppg player, I'll do backflips. Not saying it WON'T happen - I have no idea. Just saying that's a great price to lock him up.

Strome seems like the guy who would take a little less for stability but who knows anymore. i rather keep him if it does not overpay. id offer limited NTC to keep him. . some players don't mesh no matter how talented they are. remember Gomez Jagr Drury era

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

5x5 for Strome with a limited NTC, who says no?

Same contract we gave Brassard in 2014 after only a 45 point season.

Both parties with any luck

 

[Matt Rentfree]

Strome seems like the guy who would take a little less for stability but who knows anymore. i rather keep him if it does not overpay. id offer limited NTC to keep him. . some players don't mesh no matter how talented they are. remember Gomez Jagr Drury era

The problem with Gomez was that they paid a fast complimentary puck mule superstar money. I can't remember how many times he'd skate it into the O zone only to have his four slow as molasses in an ice storm line mates still behind the red line. He'd get surrounded by 4 opposing players and lose the puck. lather rinse repeat.

 

[cheech70]

There are those who still think C positional value is a thing and that you can't win with out an elite "C". I can guarantee that those same people would have said the same thing about the Blues before they won.

The Step/Brass Rangers were good enough to win, they came close twice and the true deficiencies of that group really lied elsewhere (D, more specifically Staal and Girardi in the top 4.) Even if you subscribe to the C positional value theory, what they have right now 1-2-3 has been as productive (if not more) than most of the teams people would consider contenders - Both Zibanejad (with a rough start) and Strome would be pacing 70+ points in a full year and Chytil would be around 45 over an 82 game season.

Seems kind of silly to sell the farm when it's unnecessary, especially when that farm would go for Eichel who comes with his own list of concerns. I think they'll try as well, but I also don't think they're going to go nuts for him. I get that the entire landscape at the position for the Rangers will shift dramatically in 14 months as both Zibanejad and Strome will be UFA's, but their will be other options available between now and then too. You don't need Eichel to win, every team in the history of the NHL has won with out Jack Eichel at the position and many have won with lesser talents than Eichel down the middle.

Also your time line is a bit off. Brass for Zibanejad was well before the rebuild on the fly. Stepan was really the move that kicked that short lived process off but the situations between this group and that one couldn't be more different. It wasn't so much that Stepan and Brass weren't "elite" enough to win with, but it was about replacing them (or attempting to replace) them with younger players who could contribute more in the coming years. I think most of us would sign up for a replay of the Zibanejad trade right now rather than doing what would be the equivalent of the Rick Nash route with Eichel.

Game 5 and 7 at home..I was there...shutout...our centers were less than what we have now...