Roster Building Thread IV (2022-23): Luck of the Irish

[Leonardo87]

Kakko and the dearly departed Kravtsov didnt exactly bust the door down to play in the top 6 though right? Would we all feel better if we were watching the lottery odds this year and last instead of, you know, actually being a good team and a contender?

Of course want to see the team be contending. I just like them to draft and develop more homegrown players like Kreider, Miller, and Chytil, instead of always going after aging vets. Our window would stay open longer, that's all I'm implying.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

Bure? Gartner?

You don't even have to go back that far, just since 2010:

Nash, Gaborik, Zuccarello, Buchnevich, MSL and Callahan.

Who there has Kakko even been close to?

 

[pld459666]

I think if the Rangers had a do-over they wouldve traded Kreider at the trade deadline before covid hit. But they were in a playoff race and had no way of knowing they'd somehow end up with the #1OA pick who played the same position. Hard for me to blame them.

In Kakko's case, they did try to clear the decks for him. They traded Buchnevich to give him a top 6 spot, Kakko got hurt in like game 3 against the Habs last year and stagnated. He's become a big, strong guy who wont go to the net. He's in the same position Chytil was last year when he was scratched late in the regular season. It's nut up or pack it up time for 24.

Also the bolded is like the opposite of what the Rangers are doing lol. They are clearly more than fine letting these guys develop slowly behind the real difference makers. It's the fans that arent OK with that.

I do not believe that these kids are developing into the players they were drafted to be.

I'm not OK with the idea that neither guy was stapled to the top 6 and PP/PK units during their first 2-3 seasons.

I don't think it's in the players or organizations best interests to ask them to play a defensive game when both were drafted to be, and had been up to their draft years been offensive guys.

I'd rather have a player that's somewhat deficient defensively than incapable offensively.

 

[MrAlmost]

The line might not be ideal at the moment, but the effort is there. Vladdy has been doing quite well recently. We talked about Kane, but Tarasenko having his family all set and now time to practice and work through things is a big thing. The Rangers had a lot of road games the last month. I can't imagine it being easy that you are trying to get your family set in NYC when you are doing the western Canada swing.

Kane probably has things figured out as well. Not having a game day for 4 days, can get a lot done for him and his GF/Kid.

It's a big reason why I'm not a proponent of changing the lines just yet. Also Gallant getting the lines some indirect PP work together was a good idea too. We talk about building chemistry, and these guys are all talented, but having that extra time and space could spark something and carry it over in 5v5 play.

Get that rational garbage out of here. We only want panic-button mashing around here. That point about the PP lines has seemed to fly well over people's heads.

Speaking of the lines, fans don't realize just how common it is for players to want to play with certain other players cause they are comfortable with them. I can tell you that Laf, Chytil and Kakko have all expressed a desire to play together, as well as a comfort level while playing together.

Is the team going to suddenly start crushing all their opponents and coast to the Stanley Cup? No, but we gotta give it some time. I try not to post right after games too much cause I am always a little more worked up. It seems like most get more worked up the longer we go without a game. Haha

 

[DanielBrassard]

Didn't Laff start in the top 6 his first year here?

His first game was with Fil and Gauthier but after that he was moved to a line with Panarin and Strome, I don't remember how long that lasted though.

 

[duhmetreE]

surprising that PPO were higher at the turn of the century

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

Once Tank and Kaner settle in ya'll in here are going to be straight creaming yourselves. Tank is just STARTING to settle in now and Kaner will take time.

Just like I stand by my kids line, I stand by these vets. It's all going to click and honestly I hope it all clicks somewhere in the last 10ish games of the season and we roll into the playoffs looking white hot.

 

[Lua]

If players are deciding what lines they are on, what do we need GG for?

For one, he does a bang-up job of insulating our darling forwards from criticism

 

[duhmetreE]

The line might not be ideal at the moment, but the effort is there. Vladdy has been doing quite well recently. We talked about Kane, but Tarasenko having his family all set and now time to practice and work through things is a big thing. The Rangers had a lot of road games the last month. I can't imagine it being easy that you are trying to get your family set in NYC when you are doing the western Canada swing.

Kane probably has things figured out as well. Not having a game day for 4 days, can get a lot done for him and his GF/Kid.

It's a big reason why I'm not a proponent of changing the lines just yet. Also Gallant getting the lines some indirect PP work together was a good idea too. We talk about building chemistry, and these guys are all talented, but having that extra time and space could spark something and carry it over in 5v5 play.

Zibs needs to start shooting from all angles again.

Gallant blamed him 'being in the bumper' as to why he didn't shoot being all alone in the slot... It's a microcosm of where his game has gone imo.. he defers and tries to be like Panarin way too much.

Even Panarin has degenerated. He was sniping before covid.. we're lucky if he hits the net now, if he does shoot

P.S. - I've really grown to love Tarasenko's game and the person.

 

[McRanger92]

I do not believe that these kids are developing into the players they were drafted to be.

I'm not OK with the idea that neither guy was stapled to the top 6 and PP/PK units during their first 2-3 seasons.

I don't think it's in the players or organizations best interests to ask them to play a defensive game when both were drafted to be, and had been up to their draft years been offensive guys.

I'd rather have a player that's somewhat deficient defensively than incapable offensively.

Id rather have team success with Lafreniere in a lesser role as a 21 year old with the intenion that he'll be one of the go-to guys when Panarin or Kreider are gone (which is on the horizon). I mean if he was currently producing at a Stutzle type level one of he, Chytil or Miller would be gone for sure this summer. I just think the hyperbole of him being talentless or that the Rangers are ruining him somehow is based on part of the fanbase wanting to be able to brag about our high draft picks.

 

[pld459666]

Id rather have team success with Lafreniere in a lesser role as a 21 year old with the intenion that he'll be one of the go-to guys when Panarin or Kreider are gone (which is on the horizon). I mean if he was currently producing at a Stutzle type level one of he, Chytil or Miller would be gone for sure this summer. I just think the hyperbole of him being talentless or that the Rangers are ruining him somehow is based on part of the fanbase wanting to be able to brag about our high draft picks.

I believe he COULD be producing at a Stutzle type level if he was handled differently in years 1 and 2

 

[haohmaru]

You don't even have to go back that far, just since 2010:

Nash, Gaborik, Zuccarello, Buchnevich, MSL and Callahan.

Who there has Kakko even been close to?

Amonte? Larmer?

JOEY KOCUR?

I believe he COULD be producing at a Stutzle type level if he was handled differently in years 1 and 2

Nothing I've seen (yet) suggests that at all.

 

[McRanger92]

Zibs needs to start shooting from all angles again.

Gallant blamed him 'being in the bumper' as to why he didn't shoot being all alone in the slot... It's a microcosm of where his game has gone imo.. he defers and tries to be like Panarin way too much.

Even Panarin has degenerated. He was sniping before covid.. we're lucky if he hits the net now, if he does shoot

The entire team deferring out of grade A scoring position constantly is a much much bigger concern than what the line combos are or what the kids are doing. This is also a complaint of every fanbase, but still feels pronounced with us and our talent.

I will say they did it far less in the playoffs last year. It's part of why I have confidence in them. They play the straight line playoff type game, when they have to. I think they are a team that has the ability to "flip the switch" as the cliche goes.

I believe he COULD be producing at a Stutzle type level if he was handled differently in years 1 and 2

Fair enough but I think its a stretch to say he'd be on an 80 point pace if he played the bumper on PP1 and out of position in the top 6 his first 2 years in the league, one of which was during covid with no fans.

 

[pld459666]

The entire team deferring out of grade A scoring position constantly is a much much bigger concern than what the line combos are or what the kids are doing. This is also a complaint of every fanbase, but still feels pronounced with us and our talent.

I will say they did it far less in the playoffs last year. It's part of why I have confidence in them. They play the straight line playoff type game, when they have to. I think they are a team that has the ability to "flip the switch" as the cliche goes.



Fair enough but I think its a stretch to say he'd be on an 80 point pace if he played the bumper on PP1 and out of position in the top 6 his first 2 years in the league, one of which was during covid with no fans.

Again, he'd not have been out of position with CK being moved to the 3rd line.

Amonte? Larmer?

JOEY KOCUR?



Nothing I've seen (yet) suggests that at all.

And with the way he's been brought along, I doubt we ever see it.

 

[Machinehead]

surprising that PPO were higher at the turn of the century

Told you clutch and grab is back with a vengeance

 

[haohmaru]

Again, he'd not have been out of position with CK being moved to the 3rd line.

So, the guy who scored 52 freaking goals last year should've been on the 3rd line so, maybe, Lafreniere develops and puts up better numbers?

That means that that production would never have happened for the sake of a maybe and for a guy who is crystal clearly more comfortable playing with Kakko and Chytil than he is anywhere else.

Some of the conjecture and speculation around here is truly startling.

 

[Avery16]

Seems to me that Kane and Panarin should be putting in this kind of extra effort also.

 

[Fitzy]

I think there's two possible causal mechanisms there

1) PPs around the league have gotten more dangerous so teams play with more discipline

2) """"" so refs call penalties more conservatively

However, if you're looking at the year to year percentage vs penalties called, the correlation seems to suggest that the drop in penalties preceded the improvement in PP%, which invalidates both theories.

For me- let me see more PP time. Call penalties. If teams score on a delayed penalty they should get a powerplay too.

 

[McRanger92]

Again, he'd not have been out of position with CK being moved to the 3rd line.


And with the way he's been brought along, I doubt we ever see it.

That was never a real option though. No team wouldve done that. Uprooting the longest tenured and homegrown top line winger for an 18 year old who never played a game in the NHL probably wouldnt have been a good move for Lafreniere's development either. Just one man's opinion.

 

[haohmaru]

And with the way he's been brought along, I doubt we ever see it.

Tage Thompson, Brad Marchand, Martin St. Louis, Rick Tocchet, Adam Oates, Blake Wheeler, etc... are just a few "late" bloomer examples.

Lafreniere is 21 years old. People need to tap the brakes and be patient.

 

[LokiDog]

Ugh sorry man, Hope you feel better.

Thanks brother. We have tickets for Islanders v. Capitals this Saturday and got Henry a little Ovie jersey because I want him to see some of Ovie’s pursuit of history, but I don’t think I’m gonna be able to make it to the game.

 

[Leonardo87]

Thanks brother. We have tickets for Islanders v. Capitals this Saturday and got Henry a little Ovie jersey because I want him to see some of Ovie’s pursuit of history, but I don’t think I’m gonna be able to make it to the game.

That stinks man, best to just rest up now, and not push yourself. Even when you are feeling better, can always have a setback if you try and do too much,

 

[LokiDog]

That stinks man, best to just rest up now, and not push yourself. Even when you are feeling better, can always have a setback if you try and do too much,

Yeah, that’s kind of the thinking. I’ve never really had any major health issue in life. Always the type to load up on Zinc, C, Turmeric, etc. and bounce back in 36 hours no matter what. Only broken bones I’ve ever had were a couple ribs when I was deployed. I’ve never really gotten walloped like this, even with a bad flu or whatever - being so short of breath, sore everywhere, tired, dizzy and unable to really get a good full lung when I take a deep breath has definitely made me take rest and recovery more seriously. In the past I’d take maybe one day off, take a bunch of vitamins and go to the gym and sauna the next day. I’m realizing that this is way worse than anything I’ve had before and I actually have to just sit on the couch and shiver and eat soup all week and it blows. I want a beer.

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

Get better soon Klaus.

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

Tage Thompson, Brad Marchand, Martin St. Louis, Rick Tocchet, Adam Oates, Blake Wheeler, etc... are just a few "late" bloomer examples.

Lafreniere is 21 years old. People need to tap the brakes and be patient.

We've seen Chytil pop.

Its tailed off a bit but could you imagine if all three of them go off onto another level at the same time? Say, in this years playoffs? lol

I mean its kinda what we had all hoped for during those draft years, knowing all of the talent that is surrounding them. Now you add Tank and Kane. It would be scary