Roster Building Thread IV (2019/2020)

[egelband]

Here's the one slight nuance where we disagree, though:

I don't think they're playing with fire; I think they're simply waiting as long as possible to keep their options open, on the off chance a trade does occur in time to clear more cap room for a multi-year deal. Then, if (once) it doesn't, they'll eventually sign for at or near their QOs just before camp opens. I could be wrong, but I'm 95% sure this isn't a big deal at all.

Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if Gorton and the two agents weren't already in complete agreement already on both 1-year (the QO) and 2-year deals – and just waiting to see if there's any chance at all that they'll be able to go the 2-year route.

This sounds right to me. They can wait it out. See if any money gets freed up. If so, sign longer deals. If not, take the one year deal and roll. Makes sense from both sides.

 

[Ola]

Here's the one slight nuance where we disagree, though:

I don't think they're playing with fire; I think they're simply waiting as long as possible to keep their options open, on the off chance a trade does occur in time to clear more cap room for a multi-year deal. Then, if (once) it doesn't, they'll eventually sign for at or near their QOs just before camp opens. I could be wrong, but I'm 95% sure this isn't a big deal at all.

Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if Gorton and the two agents weren't already in complete agreement already on both 1-year (the QO) and 2-year deals – and just waiting to see if there's any chance at all that they'll be able to go the 2-year route.

Exactly, and if nothing else, we at least cannot look at their current unsigned status and conclude that an hold-out already have begun.

Maybe its because I am looking at these things more from an agent POV this is a given for me -- but like just imagine if you where the agent for one of these kids. If your client was OK with taking the contract offered to these kids -- would you advice them to sign it now or a couple of days before camp? Its easy to sit here and say lol, Gorton have been trying to make a trade for 4 months what would change now? Facts are that if you have your client sign now and then Gorton out of the blue manage to deal Namestnikov or someone tomorrow, the other kid (TDA or Lemiuex) would get a lot more money and you will have wasted a lot of money for your client. Or you wait and there is zero harm in that. For an adviser like a player agent is this decision is a total no-brainer.

Why? In the individual case the risk is low and looked at isolated probably neglect-able. But if you take these kind of decisions daily in your profession, those unnecessary risks that can be avoided at zero cost will materialize regularly enough and end up costing you in the end. Also you never have the full picture in these situations. What can seem like a very low risk situation can be a lot more risky than it seems.

In addition, the alternatives to these kind of risks can often feel a bit uncomfortable for the client (the player in this case), not saying that it does in this case, but in general. Won't I look bad if I wait? Should we really bring this text into the agreement, it will look like I don't trust the other side. And so forth. The adviser will however go to lengths to avoid them for the above reasons.

 

[RangerBoy]

According to cap friendly, it is based on only base salary and not signing bonus.

Qualifying Offer Calculator - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

• The qualifying offer is calculated from the players base salary (NHL salary minus signing bonus), and at minimum must meet the seasons minimum salary requirements:
  • 110% of the base salary if the base salary is less than or equal to $660,000
  • 105% of the base salary if the base salary is greater than $660,000 or less than $1,000,000. However, this qualifying offer cannot exceed $1,000,000.
  • 100% of the base salary if the base salary is equal to or greater than $1,000,000.

$832,500 base for both players.

105%

$874,125 two way contract.

ADA and Lemieux were both eligible for two way QO's.

1. iii) A Club's Qualifying Offer must be a One-Way Qualifying Offer if the applicable Player has: (A) actually played (excluding games missed for injury, illness or disability) 180 or more NHL Games in the previous three (3) NHL Seasons, (B) played at least sixty (60) NHL Games in the previous NHL Season, and (C) not cleared Waivers in the period between the 12th day prior to the commencement of the previous Regular Season and the end of a Club's previous Playing Season. For purposes hereof only, a goaltender is deemed to have played an NHL Game when he was dressed and on the bench as a backup. In all other cases, a Qualifying Offer may be a Two-Way Qualifying Offer.

They didn't meet the criteria of a one way QO.

 

[Vitto79]

at this point do you think they eat 50% on Namestnikov just so it's not that tight on the cap with Lemieux and DeAngelo?

 

[Kovalev27]

at this point do you think they eat 50% on Namestnikov just so it's not that tight on the cap with Lemieux and DeAngelo?

I was hoping they’d already be trying this

 

[RangersFan1994]

at this point do you think they eat 50% on Namestnikov just so it's not that tight on the cap with Lemieux and DeAngelo?

no one is gonna want Namestnikov at even 50% in my opinion. he is not that good of a NHL player.

 

[LiveLongandProspal]

Bit of a funny thing happened on the way to work this morning. I was in Grand Central Station and there was this guy ahead of me with an Islanders hat (bet he took the LIRR...haha) and some guy with a Shattenkirk jersey shirt (go figure) was walking past us said aloud, "F'n Wolfpack have more fans than your crappy (he used a different word that I can't say on here) franchise."


I laughed. It was hilarious.

 

[Vitto79]

no one is gonna want Namestnikov at even 50% in my opinion. he is not that good of a NHL player.

I would think regardless they can get a pick for him at the deadline. overpaid by a bit sure but he's not a pile and can help the team on the bottom 6 and PK

next year they just let him go, Strome, Belesky, Fast as they will need the space. Playing the kids this year and next on the minimum contracts should be the plan anyway

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

Namestnikov at 2 million is okay value, not good, just okay. Nobody wants to give up any assets or do us any favors for okay value, and I'd rather not give up any assets to save a million or so dollars this year that we may or may not need.

Admittedly the market on him is softer than I anticipated. His highest value to us right now is as an established NHL body in our very green forward group.

 

[GAGLine]

at this point do you think they eat 50% on Namestnikov just so it's not that tight on the cap with Lemieux and DeAngelo?

If that deal were on the table, I imagine it would have happened already, unless the return just wasn't worth it. I imagine he'll get traded at some point between now and the deadline.

 

[RangerBoy]

There were teams interested in Namestnikov at the deadline last season but teams were wary of the extra season on his contract. The Rangers will wait until the February trade deadline to move him.

San Jose was one of those teams. Craig Custance reported that information.

Most of the contract will be paid off with 40 days left in the season at the deadline. The Rangers retain some of the remaining money to make the deal happen.

I think there are 184 days in the regular season. $4M cap hit and salary. $869,565 left at the deadline.

Can the Rangers get a 2nd for Vlad? Maybe. The rental market won’t have many great options at forward. The free agent list is very short on quality players.

Trade Kreider at the deadline for a 1st rounder plus. Maybe they retain on Kreider.

 

[True Blue]

no one is gonna want Namestnikov at even 50% in my opinion. he is not that good of a NHL player.

This is not Shattenkirk you are talking about. He evidenced that he could ride shotgun to top players. And if you forget about the salary, he showed that he can be a pretty good third line player pretty much on any team in the league.

 

[Kupo]

no one is gonna want Namestnikov at even 50% in my opinion. he is not that good of a NHL player.

Namestnikov at 2 million is okay value, not good, just okay. Nobody wants to give up any assets or do us any favors for okay value, and I'd rather not give up any assets to save a million or so dollars this year that we may or may not need.

Admittedly the market on him is softer than I anticipated. His highest value to us right now is as an established NHL body in our very green forward group.

The Sabre's gave up a third for Vesey at full pop. Names @ 50% is much better value than Vesey. Something tells me that Gorton values Names a lot more than some of you guys.

 

[True Blue]

If that deal were on the table, I imagine it would have happened already, unless the return just wasn't worth it. I imagine he'll get traded at some point between now and the deadline.

That is what I believe. As far as the possible return as well as when he goes. It would also not shock me if he finds himself riding shotgun on a line with Panarin and ZBad, to see if he can recreate his role and production when he was in Tampa.

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

The Sabre's gave up a third for Vesey at full pop. Names @ 50% is much better value than Vesey. Something tells me that Gorton values Names a lot more than some of you guys.

Maybe

or Maybe Botteril is an idiot. There is quite a bit of evidence to back up this claim.

 

[Kupo]

Maybe

or Maybe Botteril is an idiot. There is quite a bit of evidence to back up this claim.

That's not a good explanation. Names is the superior player, and he's more valuable for a couple hundred K less than lolVesey.

 

[Avery16]

 

[RangerBoy]

186 day season. Not 184.

Namestnikov will have $860,215 remaining in both real money and cap hit at the deadline.

Kreider's cap is $4.625M but his salary is $4M this season. He makes the same money as Namestnikov. Kreider is a bargain at $4M this season. His remaining cap hit at the deadline is $994,624. He will have $860,215 left in salary.

The Rangers retained money when they moved Nash and Zuccarello at the trade deadline. 50% on Nash. 30% on Zuccarello.

Fast is the other group III free agent forward. The Rangers should re-sign him unless he wants a crazy contract. The Rangers will need to expose two forwards who are signed for 2021-22 and who have played 70 NHL games combined in 19-20 & 20-21 or 40 NHL games in 20-21. The Rangers will need to start preparing for the draft in June of 2021 at some point during the season and next summer.

 

[RGY]

I can see Namestnikov having a decent year and increasing his value at the deadline.

If Rangers are 6 points or more clear of a playoff spot, I think they trade Namestnikov and keep Kreider. Maybe add a vet on the cheap / right deal that doesn’t nullify what they get for Namestnikov.

I know the above won’t be popular but it is absolutely a possible outcome.

 

[Ola]

Am I the only one who don’t care at all who we lose in the Seattle Expansion Draft — as long as I do NOT have to watch Matt Puempel play for two years???

 

[Thirty One]

Am I the only one who don’t care at all who we lose in the Seattle Expansion Draft — as long as I do NOT have to watch Matt Puempel play for two years???

Yes.

 

[Kupo]

Am I the only one who don’t care at all who we lose in the Seattle Expansion Draft — as long as I do NOT have to watch Matt Puempel play for two years???

 

[Edge]

Kemp was a kid I kept my eye on a little bit last season and as a potential late round draft pick for a team.

Kid has really good hands and isn't afraid to get into the higher percentage areas. The question is whether he's strong enough and quick enough to get their consistently, especially against better competition.

The hands keep getting him looks, but the speed/strength question keeps him from getting drafted.

 

[egelband]

Bit of a funny thing happened on the way to work this morning. I was in Grand Central Station and there was this guy ahead of me with an Islanders hat (bet he took the LIRR...haha) and some guy with a Shattenkirk jersey shirt (go figure) was walking past us said aloud, "F'n Wolfpack have more fans than your crappy (he used a different word that I can't say on here) franchise."


I laughed. It was hilarious.

Sounds more sociopathic than funny. But maybe I'm being a bit tone deaf here.

 

[Charlie Conway]

Is it possible to sign these players, or are the younger ones still draft eligible?

I like Maser. Looks like a tough kid with leadership qualities.