Speculation: Roster Building Thread II (2019/2020) - DeAngelo and Lemieux Left

[will1066]

It's easy to settle. How did the team do when it didn't go to OT? Theres your answer

They did good?

 

[Procrastinator]

Just curious... how much of D’Angelo’s improvement was due to Ruff’s coaching?

Zero. Didn’t like him as a player. Don’t like him more as a coach. Him and Sather need to sit down for drinks together at a retirement resort.

 

[kovazub94]

Just curious... how much of D’Angelo’s improvement was due to Ruff’s coaching?

Good question. How many defensemen Ruff had a positive impact developing over his career?

 

[Ola]

lol

Truth to be told, I wonder if Drury is GM material. He just don’t seem that...I don’t want to say bright, but like very creative.

Even if Gorton doesn’t exactly sound like a professor when talking and uses the same quantity of cliches as everyone else, it always shines through that he has a clear picture of what he wants and so forth. I would never underestimate him. But with Drury, nothing shines through. I am sure he can be someone’s right hand, errand boy. But the architect?

 

[alkurtz]

As usual, Drury is under-appreciated and underrated.

 

[Procrastinator]

Truth to be told, I wonder if Drury is GM material. He just don’t seem that...I don’t want to say bright, but like very creative.

Even if Gorton doesn’t exactly sound like a professor when talking and uses the same quantity of cliches as everyone else, it always shines through that he has a clear picture of what he wants and so forth. I would never underestimate him. But with Drury, nothing shines through. I am sure he can be someone’s right hand, errand boy. But the architect?

Ola. Great point. You verbalized what I was thinking.

 

[Procrastinator]

As usual, Drury is under-appreciated and underrated.

No. Not really. A few clutch playoff goals don’t make you a GM.

 

[bobbop]

Zero. Didn’t like him as a player. Don’t like him more as a coach. Him and Sather need to sit down for drinks together at a retirement resort.

I’ll take the over for $1000, Alex.

 

[Procrastinator]

I’ll take the over for $1000, Alex.

What is “living on past accomplishments”?

 

[will1066]

I need the Athletic to do an expose on Lindy Ruff. I want to know why he is still employed as a coach.

 

[will1066]

What is “living on past accomplishments”?

Correct. Also, "what is the 2006 Buffalo Sabres?" would've been accepted.

 

[Procrastinator]

Correct. Also, "what is the 2006 Buffalo Sabres?" would've been accepted.

God. That pre dates one of my kids. But yes, acceptable.

 

[eco's bones]

If you look at the past three years in total, you'll see that the A1/A2 split is pretty much 50/50 both 5v5 and on the PP (looking at the top-20, top-50 - i.e. scrubs not included).

5v5
Top 20: 48.82 A2%
Top 50: 50.01 A2%

5v4
Top 20: 49.92 A2%
Top 50: 49.54 A2%

Tony had 6 A1 and 8 A2 5v5 last year and is at 10+9 over the past three.

He did have an abnormal amount of A2 on the PP though (3+7 5v4, 9+12 over the past three), but he will likely spend more time on the top PP (and likely on a better unit) than he did last year which should balance it out.

5v5 defenceman points 16/17 to 18/19
Player Season Totals - Natural Stat Trick

5v4 defenceman points 16/17 to 18/19
Player Season Totals - Natural Stat Trick

Actually Trouba had 50 points for Winnipeg last year--playing second fiddle behind Byfuglien on the right side for the half season that Dustin wasn't injured. Trouba had 18 power play points and 3 shorthanded. I wouldn't be surprised if Jacob got the most power play time of the Rangers defensemen and if Fox is around he will get some too. That's not to say that I don't think DeAngelo will get power play time but this coming season might be a lot like last season for him as far as those kind of minutes. Tony did average 19 minutes of ice time for the Rangers--though he was scratched numerous times. But 19 minutes is pretty much top 4 minutes when he played. Very little of that ice time was shorthanded--his defense and physical strength have been weaknesses in his overall game and physical strength and fighting ability are two different things by the way. He's not really a physical player but he fights very very well for his size.

Unless Fox has a great training camp though I would think DeAngelo is going to slot onto the 2nd pair on RD behind Trouba. What would be very helpful would be improved defensive play and more regular time penalty killing. A defenseman is much more valuable if he can play in all situations.

 

[Procrastinator]

Actually Trouba had 50 points for Winnipeg last year--playing second fiddle behind Byfuglien on the right side for the half season that Dustin wasn't injured. Trouba had 18 power play points and 3 shorthanded. I wouldn't be surprised if Jacob got the most power play time of the Rangers defensemen and if Fox is around he will get some too. That's not to say that I don't think DeAngelo will get power play time but this coming season might be a lot like last season for him as far as those kind of minutes. Tony did average 19 minutes of ice time for the Rangers--though he was scratched numerous times. But 19 minutes is pretty much top 4 minutes when he played. Very little of that ice time was shorthanded--his defense and physical strength have been weaknesses in his overall game and physical strength and fighting ability are two different things by the way. He's not really a physical player but he fights very very well for his size.

Unless Fox has a great training camp though I would think DeAngelo is going to slot onto the 2nd pair on RD behind Trouba. What would be very helpful would be improved defensive play and more regular time penalty killing. A defenseman is much more valuable if he can play in all situations.

You think we would give some pp time to a dman we sign for 8m? Or would we use him as just a shut down dman?

 

[kovazub94]

Honestly, this whole prediction conversation seems to be missing the biggest influencer.

Turnover.

Yes, there are lots of kids. And lots of skill/talent added.

But in my years of following this team and hockey in general, you rarely see a team that's undergone this much turnover and to key aspects of the roster, to expect anything but inconsistency for a decent chunk of the season.

So much has to come together -- line combos, style of play, kids figuring out how to play in the NHL, the team figuring out which ones aren't ready, etc. Players understanding each other's tendencies, and communication in the D zone.

While I'm a huge fan of this offseason, as I considered the sheer amount of change to the core -- I couldn't help but get a few flashbacks to off-seasons from 15-20 years ago -- where they tried to bring in elite talent to turn the team around quickly. That off-season where they added Kamensky, Fleury, Quintal, Lefebvre. That year with Drury and Gomez. That off-season with Lindros and Lafontaine.

Those were different times. And I truly believe this is a much better situation. But when you make a ton of changes to the core of the team then the identity takes time to re-form. Plus chemistry, development of youth, getting the systems down, etc. I believe the more realistic way to view this upcoming season is:

first 30-40 games: up and down. forming the identity, figuring out the lineup, sorting out the kids.
next 20-30 games: (if all goes well) hitting some sort of stride and putting a few streaks together.
last 10-20 games: up-and-down. deadline moves, teams playing harder as they fight for playoff positioning.

At the end of the day, we just need: the kids to get better; To grow an identity as a hard-working team with speed and skill; for Trouba and Panarin to play up to their paychecks.

And I really don't care about the playoffs. I care about what happens with Chris Kreider more. He needs to stay healthy and have the season of his career -- a) so the kids get some space to grow without pressure. b) so he can be flipped for a future top 6 center prospect or a pick that allows us to draft one.

Completely agree. A lot of fans will be flipping out in the first half when Quinn will be figuring out line combos and pairing on top of everything else going in terms of development.

 

[Rongomania]

Correct. Also, "what is the 2006 Buffalo Sabres?" would've been accepted.

That was the year I truly had my first adult man heartbreaking playoff series loss.

That series is like the butterfly effect series to me, where in some alternate dimension that '06 and beyond team clicked 100% all the time dynasty style for ten years.

Except in reality, well, we all f***in' know what happened there.

 

[Thirty One]

Good question. How many defensemen Ruff had a positive impact developing over his career?

Well if we continue to use the standard that every defensemen that does well does so in spite of him and every defensemen that does poorly does so because of him, it will be zero.

 

[eco's bones]

You think we would give some pp time to a dman we sign for 8m? Or would we use him as just a shut down dman?

Of course Jacob's going to get power play time this year. He put up 50 points last year--there's not a lot of defensemen that did that. He's going to be doing everything for us.

 

[Leetch3]

No. Not really. A few clutch playoff goals don’t make you a GM.

agree 100% that a few clutch goals doesn't make you a GM...but what about all the people with actually knowledge of anything on the subject saying he's a great young executive and at least 2 teams wanting to hire him to be their GM? that meaningless too?

 

[will1066]

That was the year I truly had my first adult man heartbreaking playoff series loss.

That series is like the butterfly effect series to me, where in some alternate dimension that '06 and beyond team clicked 100% all the time dynasty style for ten years.

Except in reality, well, we all f***in' know what happened there.

And ain't that a beech for them? Lol

I remember that series too. Part of a long-running string of heartbreaks.

 

[nyr2k2]

agree 100% that a few clutch goals doesn't make you a GM...but what about all the people with actually knowledge of anything on the subject saying he's a great young executive and at least 2 teams wanting to hire him to be their GM? that meaningless too?

Yeah, he's pretty apparently highly-regarded. I don't know why anyone would try to argue that.

 

[bbny]

Well if we continue to use the standard that every defensemen that does well does so in spite of him and every defensemen that does poorly does so because of him, it will be zero.

It's a high standard, but if we hold each other accountable we can continue to make it work.

 

[will1066]

It's a high standard, but if we hold each other accountable we can continue to make it work.

 

[will1066]

Actually Trouba had 50 points for Winnipeg last year--playing second fiddle behind Byfuglien on the right side for the half season that Dustin wasn't injured. Trouba had 18 power play points and 3 shorthanded. I wouldn't be surprised if Jacob got the most power play time of the Rangers defensemen and if Fox is around he will get some too. That's not to say that I don't think DeAngelo will get power play time but this coming season might be a lot like last season for him as far as those kind of minutes. Tony did average 19 minutes of ice time for the Rangers--though he was scratched numerous times. But 19 minutes is pretty much top 4 minutes when he played. Very little of that ice time was shorthanded--his defense and physical strength have been weaknesses in his overall game and physical strength and fighting ability are two different things by the way. He's not really a physical player but he fights very very well for his size.

Unless Fox has a great training camp though I would think DeAngelo is going to slot onto the 2nd pair on RD behind Trouba. What would be very helpful would be improved defensive play and more regular time penalty killing. A defenseman is much more valuable if he can play in all situations.

You gotta expect Trouba to get PP1 time, the lions share of it. He's a prized acquisition. And you gotta expect the PP to be 4 forwards and 1 D. ADA will be on the second unit. Fox is going to have to do some amazing things to earn PP time, even if his reputation on offense precedes him.

 

[FIRE DRURY]

You know you’ve reached “The Very End” of the offseason when you’re reading about people’s opinion about an-ex players ability to run a franchise.

Let’s see if Drury can turn around an AHL franchise before giving him any special blessings.