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Speculation: Roster Building Thread DCLXXXIV: We have Cap space! Hoorraayy!!!

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Machinehead said:
They traded a 1st and a 2nd for a glorified Rob Scuderi.

They got fleeced.
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A player who is in the NHL is more valuable (today) than a future draft pick. So let's see what those picks become for the Isles. I agree it's a good bit to give up, but the picks need to pan out.
 
Machinehead said:
There is no perfect time to trade your #1 D. There's not even a good time to do it. That's why nobody does it, unless a better #1 D is coming back. (Weber for Subban)

Everyone is wetting themselves over the Hamonic deal but some a couple of things to consider -

-Hamonic was basically their #4 D. McDonagh is arguably our best player. What the two teams would be losing is not remotely comparable.

-Calgary got fleeced so hard that a ram tried to mate with them. It's an outlier value that can't be applied to other trades. "Oh if Hamonic got that, imagine what McDonagh gets..." Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if McDonagh only brought back slightly more from a GM who isn't drunk.
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Even if he brings back "slightly more" it is worth discussing. This is how the Rangers should rebuild their center depth. The rest of the Rangers forwards are young enough that they will survive an off year. Maybe the Rangers can win the Dahlin lottery. Anything can happen.

We should wait for free agency before doing anything rash but it will be a clear indication of what Gorton thinks of this team.

But if they move McDonagh and can get a return like Reinhart+ from Buffalo. Johnson+ from Tampa. Kadri or Nylander+ from Toronto. Barkov or Trocheck+ from Florida. Those are all deals that should be explored if the deal is going into a rebuild. It would be irresponsible not to. It would also be irresponsible to give McDonagh over 7m going into his 30s on a rebuild team.
 
Machinehead said:
There is not perfect time to trade your #1 D. There's not even a good time to do it. That's why nobody does it, unless a better #1 D is coming back. (Weber for Subban)

Everyone is wetting themselves over the Hamonic deal but some a couple of things to consider -

-Hamonic was basically their #4 D. McDonagh is arguably our best player. What the two teams would be losing is not remotely comparable.

-Calgary got fleeced so hard that a ram tried to mate with them. It's an outlier value that can't be applied to other trades. "Oh if Hamonic got that, imagine what McDonagh gets..." Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if McDonagh only brought back slightly more from a GM who isn't drunk.
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Well, you are of the "go for it" frame of mind, so obviously you wouldn't be willing to move McD. I'm of the opinion that this, and maybe next, year are about a turnaround. Which means, yes, that this would be the optimal time to trade him. Especially since I think Skjei can be just as good as soon as this year.

As to returns, we'll have to agree to disagree, because I think we've seen a trend now of crazy prices for defensemen. And I think McDonagh would be the best to be moved, and would therefore bring back a commensurate return. Also, in terms of Calgary getting fleeced, they're fully expecting their picks to all be extremely late, and there's a big difference between 5 and 25.

Then again, I thought Stepan would return a full tier better value although, so what do I know. (Although, now that I think about it, maybe the fact that we got a... DEFENSEMAN... in the deal reduced the amount of other assets we could pry away. Which would actually be completely consistent with my argument.) :)
 
Machinehead said:
Is this the same fantasy land where we trade McDonagh for a stud young center, 23 first round picks, and the Queen of England?

Or does each team have a different fantasy land allocated specifically to that team?
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Mcdonagh would get a top young player and a couple picks, but it would still be a big haul, but no one is going to empty their team for him.
 
It's not even about "going for it"

It's about not moving a player you absolutely can't replace.

Who's our #1 D in 2018 if we trade McDonagh? Who's our #1 D in in 2020 if we trade McDonagh? Who's our #1 D potentially in 2025 if we trade McDonagh?

If your answer is "I don't know" then you don't make the trade. If your answer is "Brady Skjei" then your answer is "I don't know."
 
Lundsanity30 said:
Miller maybe?.. I dunno..

I do know other than Kane, the Sabres have some very awful forwards, Foligno? Gionta? like I said Rinehart is playing wing for them, that's how bad their wings are.

Kane is also a UFA after this season.
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I bet thepy'd demand MZA or Miller and a 2nd...
 
Machinehead said:
It's not even about "going for it"

It's about not moving a player you absolutely can't replace.

Who's our #1 D in 2018 if we trade McDonagh? Who's our #1 D in in 2020 if we trade McDonagh? Who's our #1 D potentially in 2025 if we trade McDonagh?

If your answer is "I don't know" then you don't make the trade. If your answer is "Brady Skjei" then your answer is "I don't know."
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Who is our #1 (or 2 center)? yet we traded Derek Stepan...
 
Machinehead said:
It's not even about "going for it"

It's about not moving a player you absolutely can't replace.

Who's our #1 D in 2018 if we trade McDonagh? Who's our #1 D in in 2020 if we trade McDonagh? Who's our #1 D potentially in 2025 if we trade McDonagh?

If your answer is "I don't know" then you don't make the trade. If your answer is "Brady Skjei" then your answer is "I don't know."
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Who is our #1 D if McDonagh declines into his 30s with all the mileage that he has, and he is eating over 7m of the teams' cap?

It was a very good run but sometimes you need to take a step back to take two steps forward. This is the Rangers best chance to replenish assets to either trade for that player or god forbid draft one. I don't know if Skjei is that guy but there is only one way to find out.
 
BobMarleyNYR said:
I bet thepy'd demand MZA or Miller and a 2nd...
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I would do Miller and a lower pick than a 2nd. I think that's a fair trade..

Would give the Rangers Zibanejad, Reinhart, hayes and something else down the middle.. sign Dadonov to replace Miller. sign Shattenkirk.. there's your "rebuild while trying to win" mantra.
 
Savant said:
Who is our #1 D if McDonagh declines into his 30s with all the mileage that he has, and he is eating over 7m of the teams' cap?

It was a very good run but sometimes you need to take a step back to take two steps forward. This is the Rangers best chance to replenish assets to either trade for that player or god forbid draft one. I don't know if Skjei is that guy but there is only one way to find out.
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Trading your #1 defenseman isn't taking a step back to move two steps forward.

It's shooting yourself in the head to pray you run into a generational talent at the draft with no actual plan.

Why would he suddenly decline? Why is everyone so afraid of that now?

Because Girardi declined? ********. Girardi was overused and mediocre when he was 24, but nobody wanted to listen.
 
Machinehead said:
Meanwhile Shattenkirk is just sitting there for free.

But on heavens no, we can't hand out expensive contracts to good players, because handing them out to terrible players has hurt us in the past!!!! :scared:
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in a nutshell, this is most Ranger fans..
 
Has there been any additional news on Klein since it was reported he may retire? One would think the Rangers would want an answer before the end of this week.
 
Bereglazov shoots left - wouldn't he be fine playing on the left side despite being a right defenseman the past year in the KHL?

Either move Staal this year or in the next off-season and go with this

McDonagh Shattenkirk
Skjei Smith
Bereglazov DeAngelo

You could even flip Smith and DeAngelo, or Smith and Bereglazov
 
UAGoalieGuy said:
Has there been any additional news on Klein since it was reported he may retire? One would think the Rangers would want an answer before the end of this week.
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In his post-draft interview, Gorton said he'd talk with Klein within the next few days.
 
Can't get my cap geek to load here... so gonna type it out.

Zibanejad 5 years 5,250,000
Fast 2 years 1,750,000
Dadonov, 3 years 3,750,000
Shattenkirk 6 years 6,500,000

Klein - retirement..

Trades. Jt MIller and 2018 3rd round pick for Reinhart.

Nash/Zib/Buch
Kreider/Reinhart/Zucc
Vesey/Hayes/Dadonov
Fast/?/Grabner.
Puempel 13 F

Mcd-Shatt, Skjei-Deangelo, Staal-Berezgalov, Holden as the 7th.

Still leaves us with a ton of cap space, almost 6,500,000 and Nash's contract to expire next year IF by some miracle Tavares hits FA.
 
They can't trade McD right now. Defenseman are just too hard to come by these days.
Not sure why it hasn't been tried before but I think you have to give Skjei a legit shot at #2.
Lose Staal, Holden and Klein.
Hopefully they can sign Smith to a reasonable contact.
DeAngelo is obviously in the mix for a spot and I hope Graves has a strong camp and earns a spot as well.
 
Lundsanity30 said:
Can't get my cap geek to load here... so gonna type it out.

Zibanejad 5 years 5,250,000
Fast 2 years 1,750,000
Dadonov, 3 years 3,750,000
Shattenkirk 6 years 6,500,000

Klein - retirement..

Trades. Jt MIller and 2018 3rd round pick for Reinhart.

Nash/Zib/Buch
Kreider/Reinhart/Zucc
Vesey/Hayes/Dadonov
Fast/?/Grabner.
Puempel 13 F

Mcd-Shatt, Skjei-Deangelo, Staal-Berezgalov, Holden as the 7th.

Still leaves us with a ton of cap space, almost 6,500,000 and Nash's contract to expire next year IF by some miracle Tavares hits FA.
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Buffalo laughs at that Reinhard offer. That's terrible.
 
Machinehead said:
Trading your #1 defenseman isn't taking a step back to move two steps forward.

It's shooting yourself in the head to pray you run into a generational talent at the draft with no actual plan.

Why would he suddenly decline? Why is everyone so afraid of that now?

Because Girardi declined? ********. Girardi was overused and mediocre when he was 24, but nobody wanted to listen.
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He would decline because of his age. Time is undefeated. They can't afford to pay a player that is no longer in his prime the kind of money that McDonagh will demand. This is a salary cap league.

The plan is to become cap solvent and either develop the right defenseman or use cap space or trade assets to get one. Not to be eating a 7m+ cap hit for a player into his 30s when this is the best sellers market for defensemen of all time.
 
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