Speculation: Roster Building Thread DCLXXV: Marc Staal... Come on Down!!!

[Bluenote13]

Taking Jessiman over Getzlaf...that's the crime.

But lions......

Ugh.

Getzlaf, Parise, Kesler, Brown, Richards, Seabrook, Carter - these were the main names being talked about on HF before the draft. Jessiman was also in the picture but not mentioned as often as those others. The majority of mocks had Getzlaf, Parise and Jessiman going to the Rangers.

I still think a big part of taking Hugh, besides the ranger fan factor and being from CT, was that the Isles pick was 3 selections later and Devils were 5 selections later, they didn't want to see this behemoth go to a rival. Up until that point the Rangers had a size complex compared to those teams.

Looking back, the Isles had a brutal draft, swing and a miss on their first, and all 3 2nd rounders that year.

 

[True Blue]

But lions......

Would have been better to have been the mouse and have some cheese

 

[True Blue]

Getzlaf, Parise, Kesler, Brown, Richards, Seabrook, Carter - these were the main names being talked about on HF before the draft. Jessiman was also in the picture but not mentioned as often as those others. The majority of mocks had Getzlaf, Parise and Jessiman going to the Rangers.

We are not prognisitcators, but EVERYONE here wanted someone besides Jessiman. I remember beating the drum for Getzlaf as we was being compared to a young Holik.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

I'm not comparing the Rangers to the Penguins, what I'm saying is it's not like the Rangers were without ample opportunity to grab a good player in 6 out of 8 draft years from 98 to 05.

Yeah, but you don't get the opportunity to grab

'04: Ovechkin, Malkin
'05: Crosby
'06: Toews, Backstrom, Kessel
'07: Kane
'08: Stamkos, Doughty, Pietrangelo
'09: Tavares, Hedman, Duchene
'10: Hall, Seguin, Johansen
'11: Landeskog, Huberdeau
'12: Galchenyuk
'13: MacKinnon, Barkov, Drouin, Jones
'14: Ekblad, Draisaitl
'15: McDavid, Eichel, Marner
'16: Matthews, Laine

If you don't pick in the top 5.

Are there great players to be found elsewhere? Of course. But your odds are much better in the top five, and the vast majority of the greats in the game today (especially the forwards) were picked in that range.

Again, I believe that with smart asset management, you don't need to pick top 5 for multiple years in a row in order to be successful, but I just don't see that 6-out-of-8 years averaging around the 9th pick as all that special an opportunity (in particular given the fact that they also traded away their 1sts in '00 and '02 during that range, which would actually bring the overall average of their first selection during that span to somewhere in the late teens).

 

[HonestGabe]

http://www.journaldemontreal.com/2017/06/12/de-laction-en-coulisses

Translate to English. Renaud Lavoie hearing rumors of possible Girardi buyout.

However, the teams have an additional power because they have until Thursday noon to place a player who holds a non-movement clause in order to redeem it.
Several rumors are circulating: for example, the Rangers could buy Dan Girardi's contract that has a non-movement clause, which would make him an independent player without compensation from the first of July.

 

[HonestGabe]

It says there are rumors that we could buy him out, which has been the speculation for a while now. The only thing we know about the Staal/G situations is that Gorton hasn't asked either to waive their NMC for the expansion draft yet.

Oh well. Something to talk about on this slow day. Can only hope it's true.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

http://www.journaldemontreal.com/2017/06/12/de-laction-en-coulisses

Translate to English. Renaud Lavoie hearing Girardi buyout.

According to my translation, he's saying that it's "one of the rumors circulating", and is throwing that out there as just one example of all of the things that could change the mix over the volatile two weeks coming up.

That's hardly the same as Lavoie saying that his sources are telling him that Girardi WILL be bought out...

 

[HonestGabe]

According to my translation, he's saying that it's "one of the rumors circulating", and is throwing that out there as just one example of all of the things that could change the mix over the volatile two weeks coming up.

That's hardly the same as Lavoie saying that his sources are telling him that Girardi WILL be bought out...

Edited right after posting. Jumped the gun myself and ran it through a translator to find it was just an example.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

There's no denying it's easier to win a Cup when you have a top-5 pick to build around.

I don't deny it. Just saying that getting those generational players by being bad is not easy at all and involves an incredible amount of luck.

 

[Bluenote13]

We are not prognisitcators, but EVERYONE here wanted someone besides Jessiman. I remember beating the drum for Getzlaf as we was being compared to a young Holik.

Getzlaf and Parise were the main guys we talked up.

I was almost sure they were gonna take Parise when our pick came up.

 

[Irishguy42]

Lavoie put out a piece a day or two ago saying there were rumors of Girardi being bought out.

 

[Ghost of jas]

Getzlaf and Parise were the main guys we talked up.

I was almost sure they were gonna take Parise when our pick came up.

I can see taking a Jessiman over Parise in a pre-lockout world. But, when a center like Getzlaf is on the board, I have to take the center. I know looking back, the Rangers were interested in Carter, and reportedly turned down swapping picks with Calgary because the a Flames wanted Lundmark to make the swap. Still, take Getzlaf, and then pass on Montoya, and not take Korpikoski at 19, and maybe Henke gets a Cup along the way.

I was happy that Sather finally saw the light in the spring of 2004, but, even then, so many mistakes were made. The best prospect they got back was Betts. They passed up a better deal for Nedved with Nashville. (Poile offered two 2nd rounders, but Sather did his boys in Edmonton a favor.). He kept Messier off the table, and turned down a deal for either Jagr or Holik (I forget which one, but I think Colorado was the target.). They chose Balej over Plekanec. And, the draft in 2004 sucked. They were lucky Dubinsky and Callahan turned out to be quality NHLers. Just awful.

 

[True Blue]

Getzlaf and Parise were the main guys we talked up.

I was almost sure they were gonna take Parise when our pick came up.

It is rather sad and funny that everyone else from that first round has played in the NHL.....except Jessiman. One had to REALLY try to eff that first round up. And of course, Sather did. Add to that the fact that Eriksson, Weber, Bergeron & Backes were taken in round 2.....arrrrgggghhhhh. Am still irked by that draft.

Am going to start to depress myself. The year before that, Sather's first selection was Lee friggin' Falardeau. Who was not even good enough for the AHL. The year after? The Rangers has 4 second round picks. Sather struck gold with Dubinsky but absolutely whiffed in every way possible.

Tells you something of why the franchise was in the shape that it was in. The only better thing than whiffing at each opportunity would be going 4 consecutive years without a first round pick. Oh, wait. Well, at least we did not witness another jessiman being drafted.

 

[Ghost of jas]

Lavoie put out a piece a day or two ago saying there were rumors of Girardi being bought out.

I still think Staal is the more likely buyout, and that Girardi would be easier to move on July 1.

 

[bobbop]

I can always tell from the comments here who was not a dues paying fan the last time the Rangers went 6-7 years without being in the playoffs.

 

[silverfish]

Yeah, but you don't get the opportunity to grab

'04: Ovechkin, Malkin
'05: Crosby
'06: Toews, Backstrom, Kessel
'07: Kane
'08: Stamkos, Doughty, Pietrangelo
'09: Tavares, Hedman, Duchene
'10: Hall, Seguin, Johansen
'11: Landeskog, Huberdeau
'12: Galchenyuk
'13: MacKinnon, Barkov, Drouin, Jones
'14: Ekblad, Draisaitl
'15: McDavid, Eichel, Marner
'16: Matthews, Laine

If you don't pick in the top 5.

Are there great players to be found elsewhere? Of course. But your odds are much better in the top five, and the vast majority of the greats in the game today (especially the forwards) were picked in that range.

Again, I believe that with smart asset management, you don't need to pick top 5 for multiple years in a row in order to be successful, but I just don't see that 6-out-of-8 years averaging around the 9th pick as all that special an opportunity (in particular given the fact that they also traded away their 1sts in '00 and '02 during that range, which would actually bring the overall average of their first selection during that span to somewhere in the late teens).

You're literally preaching to the choir right now. I think draft picks outside the top-5 or top-10 are the most overrated assets in the world. I'm the guy who wants to trade the 21OA to alleviate G or Staal without blinking, remember?

I'm just pointing out that having 6 out of 8 draft years picking no lower than 12th, you should be able to find some talent. I'm not trying to argue with you that the 12th pick is better than a top-5 pick, that'd be dumb.

My points, in no particular order:

Tanking guarantees nothing
Draft picks are overrated
The Rangers should've been able to find competent core pieces in the first round in drafts from 98 through 05, and they didn't.

 

[Ail]

I can always tell from the comments here who was not a dues paying fan the last time the Rangers went 6-7 years without being in the playoffs.

I can always tell from comments like this the posters who think watching the Rangers miss the playoffs 6-7 years actually means something.

 

[True Blue]

I was happy that Sather finally saw the light in the spring of 2004, but, even then, so many mistakes were made.

There were many other useful players that could have been drafted that year. Especially with 4 chances in the second round.

 

[Ghost of jas]

There were many other useful players that could have been drafted that year. Especially with 4 chances in the second round.

Maloney fell in love with Korpikoski's workout. The Devils take Zajac and the Caps take Green.

The Montoya pick always pissed me off, since I hate taking goalies that high.

And, I loved David Booth in that draft, and the Rangers pass on him for Olver and Byers. Well done, scouting staff. Maloney was a part of the problem, too.

 

[GAGLine]

Its the Rangers. Staal and G aren't going anywhere

Whether or not they are asked to waive for the ED, it has little bearing on whether or not they will be on the team come October.

The only reason they would be asked to waive for the ED is if we have someone else we want to protect. Right now, we don't.

 

[Tawnos]

There were many other useful players that could have been drafted that year. Especially with 4 chances in the second round.

I don't think I've ever completely gotten over the shock of taking a goalie at 6.

But it's just another example of how the organization is still somewhat cursed after the 1994 win. They took Montoya because they knew Blackburn wasn't going to make it after the freak injury. Cherneski several years earlier. The 2005 lottery. Cherepanov. Ugh.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Whether or not they are asked to waive for the ED, it has little bearing on whether or not they will be on the team come October.

The only reason they would be asked to waive for the ED is if we have someone else we want to protect. Right now, we don't.

Well, technically, Vegas can pick Smith since we can't protect him. Sure, he only has days left on his contract but it's within the rules of the expansion draft.

 

[Bluenote13]

There were many other useful players that could have been drafted that year. Especially with 4 chances in the second round.

Olver was Walt Kyle's boy, I said before the draft that it was a gimme that he was one of the picks, but the first of those 4 !?? Horrible, and we knew it then. I was a Goligoski fan that year, he was Minnesota's Mr. Hockey, we passed him up 4 times in that round. I only liked the Dubinsky and Graham picks. And the 3rd rounder Bahensky was a longshot, should have gone to our Swedish scout at that point, Edler and Franzen were the next Swedes off the board in the 3rd. Coulda woulda shoulda....

 

[Thirty One]

The Montoya pick obviously didn't produce, but what realistic alternatives were there at that spot? I guess Stafford, but meh.

 

[Bluenote13]

Maloney fell in love with Korpikoski's workout. The Devils take Zajac and the Caps take Green.

The Montoya pick always pissed me off, since I hate taking goalies that high.

And, I loved David Booth in that draft, and the Rangers pass on him for Olver and Byers. Well done, scouting staff. Maloney was a part of the problem, too.

I have no problems with the Korpi pick, he was great in the WJ tourney and they would have went with Chucko if not Korpi. He's had a pretty good career as a bottom liner, he just wasn't a go to guy like you want to pick with a high draft slot.