RD Simon Edvinsson - Grand Rapids Griffins., AHL (2021, 6th, DET)

Stony Curtis

Registered User
Sep 21, 2018
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You can be a good player but have bad hockey IQ - look at Darnell Nurse, or Dion Phaneuf. They are/were excellent players, but they also can be frustrating to watch because of a track record of questionable decisions.

One good game won’t change the fact that Edvinsson has questionable decision making, he can work on it, yes but it should be noted improving one’s decision making is very difficult to improve upon.

I love it when you point out a flaw in a prospect’s game, in which it’s something that prospect need to work on going forward, and that prospect’s fan base come flying in defending him as if you’re saying that prospect is bad.

Some people…
More than anything else, I think this is just nerds nerding out. If you make a claim to nerds about anything, that claim just might he taken apart and analyzed. In this case, there really is no there there. There's nothing to analyze. A general claim regarding his IQ, but no substance. No actual quotes or references to scouting reports...nothing at all. Just an opinion. Which is great, but many of us come here to have substantive discussions and dig a little deeper. I've never met a nerd who didn't welcome rebuttals.
 

GermanSpitfire

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Jul 20, 2020
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More than anything else, I think this is just nerds nerding out. If you make a claim to nerds about anything, that claim just might he taken apart and analyzed. In this case, there really is no there there. There's nothing to analyze. A general claim regarding his IQ, but no substance. No actual quotes or references to scouting reports...nothing at all. Just an opinion. Which is great, but many of us come here to have substantive discussions and dig a little deeper. I've never met a nerd who didn't welcome rebuttals.
Nice to meet you, nerd.
 
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HisNoodliness

Good things come to those who wait
Jun 29, 2014
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More than anything else, I think this is just nerds nerding out. If you make a claim to nerds about anything, that claim just might he taken apart and analyzed. In this case, there really is no there there. There's nothing to analyze. A general claim regarding his IQ, but no substance. No actual quotes or references to scouting reports...nothing at all. Just an opinion. Which is great, but many of us come here to have substantive discussions and dig a little deeper. I've never met a nerd who didn't welcome rebuttals.
Honestly, let's talk about his game in this regard to get the ball rolling. Maybe someone will give some insight into their low IQ notion.

Defensively I think his IQ is off the charts. In his draft year I had a problem with him getting caught in "No Man's Land" defensively when he wanted to pressure a forward, but not go out of position to do so and ended up insufficiently committing to either option. He's gotten a lot better about this as he's gotten more agressive defensively unless he truly would end up in a bad position. His positioning in the D zone has generally improved since his draft year. Beyond that, his reads, gaps, and ability to steer forwards to the corner all indicate a high understanding of how to play D and anticipate opponents.

Offensively, it's more of a mixed bag. I've mostly attributed any offensive struggles to consistently playing up leagues and developing a tendency to play it safe offensively for fear of losing ice time. If he has the chance to pick up speed, he's great at leading a rush. He can make high end breakout stretch passes, and does a great job of maintaining possession. His shot is a little weak and he's gunshy using it, especially shooting to score instead of for rebounds/tips. He doesn't consistently display highly creative passes to players that aren't obviously open. Instead, he makes safer passes most of the time. Sometimes they're too obvious though and get picked off.

Still, his ability to move into space and manage the gap offensively shows that he can apply his reads and feet offensively as well as defensively. If he engages with enemies he knows when to simply guard the puck with his body, and when to try something with his hands to get a break.

Personally I think Edvinsson has every quality I'd want in a prospect to become at least a good top 4 D. If I was going to say what will hold him back, it's that he's just very good at everything instead of being truly elite in anyone area (size I suppose), and he needs to be more brave asserting himself.
 

My3Sons

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Honestly, let's talk about his game in this regard to get the ball rolling. Maybe someone will give some insight into their low IQ notion.

Defensively I think his IQ is off the charts. In his draft year I had a problem with him getting caught in "No Man's Land" defensively when he wanted to pressure a forward, but not go out of position to do so and ended up insufficiently committing to either option. He's gotten a lot better about this as he's gotten more agressive defensively unless he truly would end up in a bad position. His positioning in the D zone has generally improved since his draft year. Beyond that, his reads, gaps, and ability to steer forwards to the corner all indicate a high understanding of how to play D and anticipate opponents.

Offensively, it's more of a mixed bag. I've mostly attributed any offensive struggles to consistently playing up leagues and developing a tendency to play it safe offensively for fear of losing ice time. If he has the chance to pick up speed, he's great at leading a rush. He can make high end breakout stretch passes, and does a great job of maintaining possession. His shot is a little weak and he's gunshy using it, especially shooting to score instead of for rebounds/tips. He doesn't consistently display highly creative passes to players that aren't obviously open. Instead, he makes safer passes most of the time. Sometimes they're too obvious though and get picked off.

Still, his ability to move into space and manage the gap offensively shows that he can apply his reads and feet offensively as well as defensively. If he engages with enemies he knows when to simply guard the puck with his body, and when to try something with his hands to get a break.

Personally I think Edvinsson has every quality I'd want in a prospect to become at least a good top 4 D. If I was going to say what will hold him back, it's that he's just very good at everything instead of being truly elite in anyone area (size I suppose), and he needs to be more brave asserting himself.
That’s a pretty balanced evaluation. He’s a young player and it would be surpsiing if he didn’t have aspects of the gane to work on at this point. I’m sure he will try to polish up his offensive skills and learn to add a physical element to his defense. I expect he rounds up to an excellent player even if he’s never a top scoring defender. It’s not like Heiskanen scores a ton and he’s a player every team would love to have.
 
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Stony Curtis

Registered User
Sep 21, 2018
1,207
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Honestly, let's talk about his game in this regard to get the ball rolling. Maybe someone will give some insight into their low IQ notion.

Defensively I think his IQ is off the charts. In his draft year I had a problem with him getting caught in "No Man's Land" defensively when he wanted to pressure a forward, but not go out of position to do so and ended up insufficiently committing to either option. He's gotten a lot better about this as he's gotten more agressive defensively unless he truly would end up in a bad position. His positioning in the D zone has generally improved since his draft year. Beyond that, his reads, gaps, and ability to steer forwards to the corner all indicate a high understanding of how to play D and anticipate opponents.

Offensively, it's more of a mixed bag. I've mostly attributed any offensive struggles to consistently playing up leagues and developing a tendency to play it safe offensively for fear of losing ice time. If he has the chance to pick up speed, he's great at leading a rush. He can make high end breakout stretch passes, and does a great job of maintaining possession. His shot is a little weak and he's gunshy using it, especially shooting to score instead of for rebounds/tips. He doesn't consistently display highly creative passes to players that aren't obviously open. Instead, he makes safer passes most of the time. Sometimes they're too obvious though and get picked off.

Still, his ability to move into space and manage the gap offensively shows that he can apply his reads and feet offensively as well as defensively. If he engages with enemies he knows when to simply guard the puck with his body, and when to try something with his hands to get a break.

Personally I think Edvinsson has every quality I'd want in a prospect to become at least a good top 4 D. If I was going to say what will hold him back, it's that he's just very good at everything instead of being truly elite in anyone area (size I suppose), and he needs to be more brave asserting himself.
That's a great assessment. Two yrs ago (admittedly in limited viewings), the one thing I noticed was how often he'd carry the puck really deep into the O zone. Like, a lot. He's not doing that much now, if at all. Way more responsible defensively.
 

Frolov 6'3

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Jun 7, 2003
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You can be a good player but have bad hockey IQ - look at Darnell Nurse, or Dion Phaneuf. They are/were excellent players, but they also can be frustrating to watch because of a track record of questionable decisions.

One good game won’t change the fact that Edvinsson has questionable decision making, he can work on it, yes but it should be noted improving one’s decision making is very difficult to improve upon.

I love it when you point out a flaw in a prospect’s game, in which it’s something that prospect need to work on going forward, and that prospect’s fan base come flying in defending him as if you’re saying that prospect is bad.

Some people…
I have seen Dustin Brown for years but that’s not what I am saying. This player has not even hit NHL surface yet and you have given him a label already. His hockey IQ will always limit him, according to you.

Whether he is playing great or not, it could always have been better. There is a possibility that he might be good because his hockey sense is “a little” better than what you are thinking.
 
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Hen Kolland

Registered User
Feb 22, 2018
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Sooo… the scouts and experts?

You are free to bring the receipts from qualified opinions. No bloggers please.

Maybe something like the Black Book tickles you the right way.

"Which leads us to his transitional hockey sense, and his collapsing sense. When a prospect first gets called up from the J20 circuit to the SHL or Allsvenskan, there can be a big adjustment period for adapting to the pace of play, which can largely be attributed to the speed of the game. In Simon’s case, that adjustment period was short lived, which speaks volumes to certain areas of his hockey sense that are both applicable in transitional activation play and puck retrievals.

When pressure is applied to Simon on the forecheck or when he’s getting closed on outside of the defensive zone, the speed at which he thinks the game can lead to some very impressive and at times dynamic plays. We’ve watched him make well timed and well executed passes in high pressure situations, where he’s given limited time to think on the fly. His collapsing sense and skill set, allows him to evade the F1 forechecking options, even at the SHL level.

Part of this is the result of Edvinsson’s poise with the puck. He carries a high panic threshold, which reduces his turnover rates under pressure, when given limited time and space. The other aspect of his sense for the game that we attribute to his puck moving ability lies within his deception. He’s good at using advanced look offs, body fakes, and deceptive pivots to keep forechecker guessing. His speed of his mind, the speed of his hands, and the speed at which he can escape tight areas, combined with his length, gives him a versatile and multi-faceted puck moving skillset."

Or this comment:

"Most importantly, Edvinsson’s vision and spatial recognition, when combined with his mental processing, allow him to assess transitional risk properly on most sequences. It’s all about his ability to assess the numbers game, and see if there’s a supporting option for him so that he can jump into the rush freely without getting burned. He recognizes when a heavy forecheck has been applied against him, and can take full advantage of his mobility to jump into the rush. That said, his teams’ defensive structure, allows for an aggressive collapsing defensive system in the neutral zone. What this means, is that occasionally Simon would collapse at the wrong times and get burned during transitional play. To Summarize, with the puck already on his stick, his risk assessments were positive, but his off the puck defensive risk assessments were inconsistent."

"inconsistent" does not carry the same meaning as "low intelligence"
 

nbwingsfan

Registered User
Dec 13, 2009
22,290
16,476
You are free to bring the receipts from qualified opinions. No bloggers please.

Maybe something like the Black Book tickles you the right way.

"Which leads us to his transitional hockey sense, and his collapsing sense. When a prospect first gets called up from the J20 circuit to the SHL or Allsvenskan, there can be a big adjustment period for adapting to the pace of play, which can largely be attributed to the speed of the game. In Simon’s case, that adjustment period was short lived, which speaks volumes to certain areas of his hockey sense that are both applicable in transitional activation play and puck retrievals.

When pressure is applied to Simon on the forecheck or when he’s getting closed on outside of the defensive zone, the speed at which he thinks the game can lead to some very impressive and at times dynamic plays. We’ve watched him make well timed and well executed passes in high pressure situations, where he’s given limited time to think on the fly. His collapsing sense and skill set, allows him to evade the F1 forechecking options, even at the SHL level.

Part of this is the result of Edvinsson’s poise with the puck. He carries a high panic threshold, which reduces his turnover rates under pressure, when given limited time and space. The other aspect of his sense for the game that we attribute to his puck moving ability lies within his deception. He’s good at using advanced look offs, body fakes, and deceptive pivots to keep forechecker guessing. His speed of his mind, the speed of his hands, and the speed at which he can escape tight areas, combined with his length, gives him a versatile and multi-faceted puck moving skillset."

Or this comment:

"Most importantly, Edvinsson’s vision and spatial recognition, when combined with his mental processing, allow him to assess transitional risk properly on most sequences. It’s all about his ability to assess the numbers game, and see if there’s a supporting option for him so that he can jump into the rush freely without getting burned. He recognizes when a heavy forecheck has been applied against him, and can take full advantage of his mobility to jump into the rush. That said, his teams’ defensive structure, allows for an aggressive collapsing defensive system in the neutral zone. What this means, is that occasionally Simon would collapse at the wrong times and get burned during transitional play. To Summarize, with the puck already on his stick, his risk assessments were positive, but his off the puck defensive risk assessments were inconsistent."

"inconsistent" does not carry the same meaning as "low intelligence"
Inconsistent is kind of exactly what they means and shows a lack of awareness in those situations but whatever you say man.
 

Hen Kolland

Registered User
Feb 22, 2018
9,566
8,497
Inconsistent is kind of exactly what they means and shows a lack of awareness in those situations but whatever you say man.

"The adjustment period was short lived, which speaks volumes to certain areas of his hockey sense"

"The speed at which he thinks the game can lead to some very impressive and at times dynamic plays. We’ve watched him make well timed and well executed passes in high pressure situations, where he’s given limited time to think on the fly."

"He’s good at using advanced look offs, body fakes, and deceptive pivots to keep forechecker guessing. His speed of his mind, the speed of his hands, and the speed at which he can escape tight areas, combined with his length, gives him a versatile and multi-faceted puck moving skillset."

"Most importantly, Edvinsson’s vision and spatial recognition, when combined with his mental processing, allow him to assess transitional risk properly on most sequences."


Oh yeah, they were totally talking about how he's dumb as a doorknob. No, inconsistent in this context implies that he's learning the limits of what he is capable of. His game requires reps and refinement, not "Hockey for Dummies".
 
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OgeeOgelthorpe

Riccis per 60 record holder
Feb 29, 2020
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Didn't crack Detroit's opening night roster. I thought he was a Calder favorite so this is pretty shocking in my books.

Not really. Even Mo Seider didn't play for Detroit until his D+3 season. Edvinsson will probably be on the team at some point throughout the year. He can work on cleaning up his mistakes in the AHL.
 

newfy

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Jul 28, 2010
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Didn't crack Detroit's opening night roster. I thought he was a Calder favorite so this is pretty shocking in my books.

I thought he would make the team but not be a calder favourite. Lalonde has said it just came down to him getting more icetime in the AHL than in the NHL. I'll be surprised if he doesnt see some time in the league this year though
 
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SenzZen

RIP, GOAT
Jan 31, 2011
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Didn't crack Detroit's opening night roster. I thought he was a Calder favorite so this is pretty shocking in my books.
This improves his Calder chances, if anything.

Albeit putting them off a year- but a franchise shouldn’t be taking a player based on their likelihood of being the best rookie in their class.
 

Oddbob

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Jan 21, 2016
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I think GR is the right spot right now for him. The skill level is 100% there as he makes nice plays and reads the play well defensively, but he makes too many mistakes and is inconsistent with his good plays. Lots of ice in GR is a good thing for getting reps at the NA game. Offensively, sometimes he tries to force things that aren't there, so he needs to read the play a little better offensively, although his skill level with the puck is very apparent. He also seems to have a problem overskating the puck at times, which is weird for someone with very obvious good puck moving skills, although it could be nervousness as a youngster not sure. Also, won't hurt to put on some more muscle as he is very skinny for the NHL game in my opinion.
 

haulinbass

Registered User
Mar 6, 2014
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I think GR is the right spot right now for him. The skill level is 100% there as he makes nice plays and reads the play well defensively, but he makes too many mistakes and is inconsistent with his good plays. Lots of ice in GR is a good thing for getting reps at the NA game. Offensively, sometimes he tries to force things that aren't there, so he needs to read the play a little better offensively, although his skill level with the puck is very apparent. He also seems to have a problem overskating the puck at times, which is weird for someone with very obvious good puck moving skills, although it could be nervousness as a youngster not sure. Also, won't hurt to put on some more muscle as he is very skinny for the NHL game in my opinion.

Exactly this. He was able to show us his talent is immense even against NHL players. Just needs a little bit of time to iron things out in NA.
 
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