Rasmus Sandin Discussion Thread

[Nineteen67]

Dude, Sandin is our #7.

Rielly-Brodie
Muzzin-Liljegren
Gio-Holl
Sandin

Okay, I know that most people don't like Justin Holl, but you're going to have to explain to me why a GM is going to overpay our #7 as their mastermind move. What leverage does Sandin have? Oh no, he goes somewhere else and we have to spend the cap space on someone else who can provide 16 points in 51 games from the 3rd pairing PP spot.

If Sandin wanted leverage he should have played better. If his only leverage is the hype from three years ago, that's not leverage. That's fan hype, which is not what drives contract signings. And when it does, we bitch about it endlessly for the next five years.

He is one of the seven they have and he’ll need to play if he’s on the team.

 

[rocketman588]

If Sandin's gameplan is to delay signing until perhaps an offersheet is presented, then Leafs would do better to trade him to get something better than the 2nd round pick from that "one team".

Right now Leafs have more options compared to if they wait only to see Sandin get an offersheet, he signs it and leafs have no other way but to take the 2nd and move on.

Other teams obviously will know this and play some hardball; but even then you can up the ante with 2 to 3 teams competing for Sandin in a trade to get a bit more out.

I don't blame Sandin btw....

Rielly, Muzzin, Gio has taken the left side

then whether you like it or not as fara s Dubas/Keefe are here on the right side the ranking is:

- Brodie, Holl, Liljegren/Sandin

For him it seems like it's more of an opportunity thing then a money thing tbh

 

[LeafGrief]

He is one of the seven they have and he’ll need to play if he’s on the team.

If “one of the seven” is the best you can do, I’m really not worried about an offersheet. His on ice results are easily replaceable and while his upside isn’t, we’re not in the business of overpaying for potential.

 

[stickty111]

Got to love Bunkis saying Leafs ruined the Sandin situation. He's acting like Sandin should be handed everything.

 

[kb]

Got to love Bunkis saying Leafs ruined the Sandin situation. He's acting like Sandin should be handed everything.

It's Sandin who is messing up the Sandin situation.

He hasn't earned a thing compared to Lily.

 

[ryno23]

Sandin hasn't proven anything to merit him being untouchable. Is he a nice player sure, but there are a dozen of Sandin's out there.

Put it this way. If the Leafs had a chance to trade him straight up for any of these players forget the cap for a minute would Dubas say no?

Makar, Fox, McAvoy, Q Hughes, R.Andersson, Seider,Werenski, Provorov, Chychrun,Chabot, Heiskenen, Hanafin

Just a doze or so under 25 D if those teams came calling you would offer up Sandin in a heartbeat.

Sandin is not untouchable by any means and if Dubas can improve the club and he has to go so be it.

 

[Nineteen67]

If “one of the seven” is the best you can do, I’m really not worried about an offersheet. His on ice results are easily replaceable and while his upside isn’t, we’re not in the business of overpaying for potential.

Who do they replace him with, and at what the cost? As it stands now, even with Sandin they are still short 1 D, imo, so why not take a shot at the Leafs.

 

[stickty111]

It's Sandin who is messing up the Sandin situation.

He hasn't earned a thing compared to Lily.

Pretty much. Seravelli said this whole thing has been overblown, and he hasn't sensed tension between the sides and pretty much hurt Bunkis's narrative. Just said Sandin wants clarity on his future which is fair.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Majority of fans have been putting Sandin in the top 4 of our lineup for years now. They weren't interested in him earning anything. Now all of a sudden, we're annoyed he wants top 4 without earning it.

We've seem the same with Robertson. For 3 years a lot of fans have had him on the left of Matthews or Tavares. Also happened with Knies last year.

We can't now want them to earn it.

 

[justashadowof]

So we had the Liljegren offer sheet, now Sandin. Who's next to get totally 100% offersheeted once Sandin signs for 2x1.5? What if other GMs conspire to take advantage of our "cap hell" and offer sheet all our players at the same time? It's a real threat and you and the talking heads gotta take it super seriously.

I hope you're right primarily because we get to keep Sandin but it would be nice to once again illustrate how many rumours of these sort are false.

 

[LeafGrief]

Who do they replace him with, and at what the cost? As it stands now, even with Sandin they are still short 1 D, imo, so why not take a shot at the Leafs.

Literally anyone, at 1.5m or less. Dubas is a pretty good dumpster diver and has been shrewd at picking up depth pieces like Giordano, Lyubushkin, and Bogosian on cheap deals. We would only need 16 points, PP2, and 3rd pairing minutes for 51 games replaced, there are a whole lot of players who can do that and it comes cheap. We're talking about the #7 here, a replacement here is as easy as it gets.

And to be honest, you're having one of those "Leafs are the centre of the universe" moments. We just went out in the first round again and don't even have a goalie for next year, who's got our #7D at the top of their hit list? And then on top of that, GM's barely have enough cap space as it stands, they're not lining up for a chance to commit 3m to a 3rd pairing PP specialist who doesn't think he can even beat out Justin Holl for minutes. There are RFA's with Sandin's upside every single year and they never get offer sheeted.

 

[LeafGrief]

Majority of fans have been putting Sandin in the top 4 of our lineup for years now. They weren't interested in him earning anything. Now all of a sudden, we're annoyed he wants top 4 without earning it.

We've seem the same with Robertson. For 3 years a lot of fans have had him on the left of Matthews or Tavares. Also happened with Knies last year.

We can't now want them to earn it.

Being wrong before does not mean you have to stay wrong for the sake of consistency. It's called learning. Opinions are supposed to change.

We were always supposed to want prospects to earn it, but due to roster holes people are always pencilling them in and hoping that they blossom early to a) be superstars and b) fill the roster spots. The Leafs finally have a good blueline, so Sandin has to earn it. If we were stacked at LW, we'd have been telling Robertson to earn it as well.

 

[Apex Predator]

The Leafs are going to need Sandin in the top 4 at some point this season and even next year. I would be really worried about trading him and having Muzzin be our top 4 guy. If he gets hurt or breaks down we don’t really have anyone that can step into the top 4 now and for future. We could be looking to acquire a Top 4 defenseman again.

 

[hotpaws]

Sandin seems like he just doesn't want to get jerked in and out of lineup like Dermott did , can't blame him for being concerned about that possibility .

 

[LeafSteel]

I don't understand the whole "Dermott was jerked around" narrative. The guy's development was stalled and he did not continue to develop the way he needed to.

The Leafs desperately needed him to continue to develop, and was given every opportunity to do it. He just didn't, and found himself passed over on the depth chart. Leafs still did right by him by trading him so that he would have a chance to play, something he hadn't earned here.

Why do the Leafs come across as untrustworthy in this scenario? I place it firmly on Dermott's inability to seize the opportunity and earn his spot.

As for Sandin, I hope he recognizes the huge opportunity he has here, and is prepared to bide his time a bit. Moving him would be very short-sighted, with both Muzzin and Giordano not being long-term solutions. If Sandin takes a 2 year deal, he will likely find himself in a great situation.

Moving him would be disappointing, but I think it would be done if forced by the player and his agent, and I would expect a significant piece back if he is moved.

 

[Thornbury]

The Leafs are so fragile on D that they could be eliminated from contention in two weeks.

Contention for what? We currently have under contract 6 quality NHL defenceman- Reilly, Brodie, Lilligren, Gio, Holl and Muzzin. I am pretty sure they won't be the starting six come October, but it would hardly be a disaster if they are.

 

[ULF_55]

Contention for what? We currently have under contract 6 quality NHL defenceman- Reilly, Brodie, Lilligren, Gio, Holl and Muzzin. I am pretty sure they won't be the starting six come October, but it would hardly be a disaster if they are.

And Sandin is the youngest of them all.

Really, the only young player in that group is the right handed Liljegren, and if he were a LW defender he'd be out of the line-up as well.

If Leafs and Sandin can't come to an agreement they'll pick up some other player to sit on the sidelines.

 

[Nineteen67]

Contention for what? We currently have under contract 6 quality NHL defenceman- Reilly, Brodie, Lilligren, Gio, Holl and Muzzin. I am pretty sure they won't be the starting six come October, but it would hardly be a disaster if they are.

If they don’t upgrade that group, I dont see a long playoff run.

 

[ULF_55]

If they don’t upgrade that group, I dont see a long playoff run.

I don't see them upgrading that group.

I could see them supplement it, but not upgrade it, unless Sandin switches to the RD and beats out Holl.

Their problem in the playoffs wasn't defense, it was offense.

 

[LeafEgo]

Yes, and if our #7 is so ripe for an offer sheet, I guess the D is in great shape after all.

They do love to speak out of both sides of their mouths!

"Our D is weak!!" followed by
"Someone is going to offersheet our #7!!!"

An offer sheet for Sandin would be a play at his potential, not for his impact today. So both could be true.

Although I don't think our D is weak.

 

[Nineteen67]

Literally anyone, at 1.5m or less. Dubas is a pretty good dumpster diver and has been shrewd at picking up depth pieces like Giordano, Lyubushkin, and Bogosian on cheap deals. We would only need 16 points, PP2, and 3rd pairing minutes for 51 games replaced, there are a whole lot of players who can do that and it comes cheap. We're talking about the #7 here, a replacement here is as easy as it gets.

And to be honest, you're having one of those "Leafs are the centre of the universe" moments. We just went out in the first round again and don't even have a goalie for next year, who's got our #7D at the top of their hit list? And then on top of that, GM's barely have enough cap space as it stands, they're not lining up for a chance to commit 3m to a 3rd pairing PP specialist who doesn't think he can even beat out Justin Holl for minutes. There are RFA's with Sandin's upside every single year and they never get offer sheeted.

If they want to ice a team they don’t have to do much.

Im coming at it from the standpoint of winning a round or two or three.
Yes, they need a goalie, they need a top line winger and few bottom 6 forwards. But they also need to upgrade the D.

 

[LeafEgo]

If “one of the seven” is the best you can do, I’m really not worried about an offersheet. His on ice results are easily replaceable and while his upside isn’t, we’re not in the business of overpaying for potential.

Agreed. It would have been nice to have traded him earlier though, but maybe they tried and folks really weren't that interested and it made sense to just keep him as 4th LD for the playoff run.

 

[ULF_55]

Just an update for people not aware of why Sandin did not play more:

FoxSports
Activated from LTIRSandin (knee) was activated from long-term injured reserve Thursday, per CapFriendly.

Impact Sandin missed the last 20 games of the regular season and the first two in the playoffs. The defenseman will now be eligible to rejoin the lineup as soon as Friday's Game 3 versus the Lightning. Barring injuries on the Maple Leafs' blue line, it's unclear if Sandin will get much playing time in the postseason. If he does, Timothy Liljegren is most likely to exit the lineup.

MAY 5•ROTOWIRE

 

[ToneDog]

And Sandin is the youngest of them all.

Really, the only young player in that group is the right handed Liljegren, and if he were a LW defender he'd be out of the line-up as well.

If Leafs and Sandin can't come to an agreement they'll pick up some other player to sit on the sidelines.

We need somebody that is difficult to play against on the right side. Holl should/will be the odd man out.

 

[Stephen]

For him it seems like it's more of an opportunity thing then a money thing tbh

If reports are true, it sounds like more of a diva thing than a money or opportunity thing. Who is this kid calling shots like this with less than 100 games of experience and frankly not much to show for? What’s next, Roberson demands the captaincy?

Sandin is the youngest, smallest and one of the most unproven defensemen in the group on a blueline that needs to get bigger, harder to play against. Maybe it isn’t so bad we move on from this guy.