Prospect Info: Prospect Info and Discussion VIII - Future Canes and other Jurcos

[spockBokk]

Great Priskie article:

 

[cptjeff]

Has he ever attended training camp? I looked at the last 3 years roster on the Canes website unless I just missed him, he's not been on the roster for any of those seasons.

I know he's come to some prospect camps, but those aren't really televised so I can't comment on how he's looked, nor would I read too much into it.

To be fair to myself, I was remembering him from prospect camp (they do livestream it, and the big red-white scrimmage at the end is always worth watching, even if it's not NHL intensity play- I even took a few notes) and threw in training camp to cover my ass. Guess that backfired.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Thanks for posting that Priskie article. Interesting that some of his comments parallel Cotton's (in terms of not rushing development and developing at his own pace).

“I think they do a phenomenal job here of developing players, not just defensemen,” said Priskie. “That was a big thing for me. I’ve never tried to rush development, I truly believe that you develop on your own pace. I seem to be kind of a late bloomer as some people call it, I’ve never tried to rush anything. Being able to come here and really learn the pro game and develop and not just be able to play but to learn to dominate and be a great player, that’s what I strive for.”

Also that how Carolina plays, with D jumping up into the play, appealed to him.

“I love how aggressive they allow their defensemen to be, to jump up in the rush and try to create offense,” said Priskie. “Throughout camp I talked a lot with Dougie Hamilton and Jaccob Slavin and they showed me a couple things while I was playing, and then just being able to watch them and the way they conduct themselves every day as true pros is something I’m trying to emulate now here as I start my pro career.”

And lastly, I think this explains why he chose to sign here vs. HF's views of "why did he sign there when the path to the NHL is so much harder" and "Carolina must have guaranteed him an NHL spot", etc... I know a lot of this is just him saying the right things, but I like this kid even more with the attitude he's displaying.

 

[spockBokk]

Thanks for posting that Priskie article. Interesting that some of his comments parallel Cotton's (in terms of not rushing development and developing at his own pace).

“I think they do a phenomenal job here of developing players, not just defensemen,” said Priskie. “That was a big thing for me. I’ve never tried to rush development, I truly believe that you develop on your own pace. I seem to be kind of a late bloomer as some people call it, I’ve never tried to rush anything. Being able to come here and really learn the pro game and develop and not just be able to play but to learn to dominate and be a great player, that’s what I strive for.”

Also that how Carolina plays, with D jumping up into the play, appealed to him.

“I love how aggressive they allow their defensemen to be, to jump up in the rush and try to create offense,” said Priskie. “Throughout camp I talked a lot with Dougie Hamilton and Jaccob Slavin and they showed me a couple things while I was playing, and then just being able to watch them and the way they conduct themselves every day as true pros is something I’m trying to emulate now here as I start my pro career.”

And lastly, I think this explains why he chose to sign here vs. HF's views of "why did he sign there when the path to the NHL is so much harder" and "Carolina must have guaranteed him an NHL spot", etc... I know a lot of this is just him saying the right things, but I like this kid even more with the attitude he's displaying.

Yep, if he pans out and is ready for 3rd pair duty next year, I like the following D corps:

Slavin-Hamilton
Gardiner-Pesce
Edmundson-Priskie

Forsling/Fluery/Mckeown as the 7th D

Edmundson will probably cost more than TVR would, but I really like the balance of that top 6 and with Hamilton now killing penalties, you don't really need a guy like TVR as much (since you have Edmundson)...

 

[tarheelhockey]

I know he's come to some prospect camps, but those aren't really televised so I can't comment on how he's looked, nor would I read too much into it.

I wouldn't make definitive conclusions based on prospect camp, but seeing them practice and play together gives us a decent idea of what tier they belong to. As recently as a couple of months ago, Cotton has always blended into a crowd of long-shot prospects, and didn't even come close to a guy like Gauthier who is hanging on to his NHL shot by the skin of his teeth.

There's always the chance that he breaks out as a late bloomer, it's not impossible. But by all appearances his upside is Jeremy Welsh-ish. He'd have to improve a lot in the next few months for it to seem worth signing him.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I wouldn't make definitive conclusions based on prospect camp, but seeing them practice and play together gives us a decent idea of what tier they belong to. As recently as a couple of months ago, Cotton has always blended into a crowd of long-shot prospects, and didn't even come close to a guy like Gauthier who is hanging on to his NHL shot by the skin of his teeth.

There's always the chance that he breaks out as a late bloomer, it's not impossible. But by all appearances his upside is Jeremy Welsh-ish. He'd have to improve a lot in the next few months for it to seem worth signing him.

If he has a strong season at BC, I'll be surprised if Carolina won't "try" to sign him. Even if he's just an AHL player in the end. He's a late round pick so that's fine.

 

[A Star is Burns]

It seems ideal to try to field a competent AHL team, so I think he'd have to go a long way in the wrong direction for him not to be worth Carolina signing if they can.

 

[bleedgreen]

I wouldn't make definitive conclusions based on prospect camp, but seeing them practice and play together gives us a decent idea of what tier they belong to. As recently as a couple of months ago, Cotton has always blended into a crowd of long-shot prospects, and didn't even come close to a guy like Gauthier who is hanging on to his NHL shot by the skin of his teeth.

There's always the chance that he breaks out as a late bloomer, it's not impossible. But by all appearances his upside is Jeremy Welsh-ish. He'd have to improve a lot in the next few months for it to seem worth signing him.

Priskie has one true NHL a tribute, his shot. He’s a bit Babchuk-esque. Big body that doesn’t transition to backwards smoothly, isn’t very strong moving backwards and isn’t very quick once he’s headed that way.

He can be dangerous jumping in the play though. Sees the ice well when he’s doing it too.

I agree, he has to come a long way quick. He’s already past the age you generally consider a prospect. You wouldn’t think he’d have a lot of growth left. Love to be wrong.

 

[tarheelhockey]

It seems ideal to try to field a competent AHL team, so I think he'd have to go a long way in the wrong direction for him not to be worth Carolina signing if they can.

I don't think he's got quite that much of an inside track, that a contract would be considered "his to lose" to that degree. In terms of age/projection/pedigree, he compares unfavorably to nearly all of our signed players. He's already older than anyone we have under contract for next year, and moving into the category of competing against guys like Gibbons and McCormick who parlay NHL experience into getting another shot. Cotton's case for an ELC is going to really depend on his having a big senior year, otherwise there will be some new draftee or seasoned veteran coming along to take the spot.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Priskie has one true NHL a tribute, his shot. He’s a bit Babchuk-esque. Big body that doesn’t transition to backwards smoothly, isn’t very strong moving backwards and isn’t very quick once he’s headed that way.

He can be dangerous jumping in the play though. Sees the ice well when he’s doing it too.

I agree, he has to come a long way quick. He’s already past the age you generally consider a prospect. You wouldn’t think he’d have a lot of growth left. Love to be wrong.

LOL, are we making identical arguments about Priskie and Cotton?

 

[bleedgreen]

LOL, are we making identical arguments about Priskie and Cotton?

Pretty much!

I tried to think of which one I think has more of a chance and I just can’t.

 

[emptyNedder]

Slavin-Hamilton
Gardiner-Pesce
Edmundson-Priskie

Edmundson has been good so far, but I think keeping TVR makes more sense. The next wave of D prospects are on the left side except for Priskie.

Slavin-Hamilton
Gardiner-Pesce
Bean/Sellgren/Fleury-TVR

 

[Jamie Craig]

"I love how aggressive they allow their defensemen to be, to jump up in the rush and try to create offense,” said Priskie.

Reminds me of Sara Civ's latest article where Pesce said Brindy lets them play more than any coach ever has: Observations from the Hurricanes' record start: Andrei...

Brind'Amour alone is having such an impact on free agents.

 

[bleedgreen]

I’m not trying to pick a fight about this, I’m just curious. Why is it seen as a good thing that a coach lets them have so much freedom?

 

[Jamie Craig]

I’m not trying to pick a fight about this, I’m just curious. Why is it seen as a good thing that a coach lets them have so much freedom?

Obviously that wouldn't be a good thing if they weren't arguably the best blue line in the NHL, but you already see how Dougie plays when confident compared to how he was playing when he wasn't RBA's guy. As long as they aren't making mistakes, which they really aren't right now, why not let one of the most offensively talented blue lines in the league jump in the rush until it stops working? Just from my own experience playing, I know I would always choke up when I felt like the coach was trying to micromanage. I'm no Jaccob Slavin but I don't know how you could look at the team right now and think freedom isn't a good thing.

Also not trying to fight, it's an interesting argument and would like to hear devil's advocate.

 

[bleedgreen]

Obviously that wouldn't be a good thing if they weren't arguably the best blue line in the NHL, but you already see how Dougie plays when confident compared to how he was playing when he wasn't RBA's guy. As long as they aren't making mistakes, which they really aren't right now, why not let one of the most offensively talented blue lines in the league jump in the rush until it stops working?

Peters wanted them in on every play too. Pretty sure Muller did as well but Pesce wasn’t around for that. I don’t think he means jumping in when he refers to freedom. Peters system was hyper aggressive for the D. Doesn’t make sense that the thing that’s been changed and freeing is the ability to jump up. Other than maybe Mo (?) all the coaches wanted really active D when we had the personnel to do it.

That’s not new.

 

[Jamie Craig]

Peters wanted them in on every play too. Pretty sure Muller did as well but Pesce wasn’t around for that. I don’t think he means jumping in when he refers to freedom. Peters system was hyper aggressive for the D. Doesn’t make sense that the thing that’s been changed and freeing is the ability to jump up. Other than maybe Mo (?) all the coaches wanted really active D when we had the personnel to do it.

Just because that's what they said or preached doesn't mean it's what they *really* acted like as coaches behind closed doors, you know? It seems pretty clear something's clicking that wasn't before. Whether it's actual new freedom or the illusion of more freedom, does it really matter?

 

[bleedgreen]

Just because that's what they said or preached doesn't mean it's what they *really* acted like as coaches behind closed doors, you know? It seems pretty clear something's clicking that wasn't before. Whether it's actual new freedom or the illusion of more freedom, does it really matter?

No of course not, I’m just curious about this. At the time Liles was traded Fluto Shinzawa wrote a very in-depth article about the canes after interviewing him about Peters and the system we played. He was surprisingly fascinated by it and thought it was really ahead of its time. Liles talked in depth about how aggressive it was and that it really favored skating defenseman, obviously Liles loved the system. It was made for guys like him, as he/Slavin/Pesce thrived in it despite the teams overall lack of success. Hanifin was made for it as well but obviously he had a lot to learn all around, he had to develop his hockey brain to really make it work. That’s why I don’t think Pesce is referring to offensive green lights. He always had one. It must mean something else. Maybe the whole feel of the room or approach to the team. We have very little structure now vs Peters system definitely having more shape. That’s undoubtedly freeing though not always a great idea.

I’ve tried to find the article but the Boston Globe is a pay site and I can’t get anywhere in their archives.

 

[Jamie Craig]

No of course not, I’m just curious about this. At the time Liles was traded Fluto Shinzawa wrote a very in-depth article about the canes after interviewing him about Peters and the system we played. He was surprisingly fascinated by it and thought it was really ahead of its time. Liles talked in depth about how aggressive it was and that it really favored skating defenseman, obviously Liles loved the system. It was made for guys like him, as he/Slavin/Pesce thrived in it despite the teams overall lack of success. Hanifin was made for it as well but obviously he had a lot to learn all around, he had to develop his hockey brain to really make it work. That’s why I don’t think Pesce is referring to offensive green lights. He always had one. It must mean something else. Maybe the whole feel of the room or approach to the team. We have very little structure now vs Peters system definitely having more shape. That’s undoubtedly freeing though not always a great idea.

I’ve tried to find the article but the Boston Globe is a pay site and I can’t get anywhere in their archives.

I would love to read that. It's a shame to think there are many more articles like that we just won't be able to read again until online journalism figures out an archive system

 

[tarheelhockey]

No of course not, I’m just curious about this. At the time Liles was traded Fluto Shinzawa wrote a very in-depth article about the canes after interviewing him about Peters and the system we played. He was surprisingly fascinated by it and thought it was really ahead of its time. Liles talked in depth about how aggressive it was and that it really favored skating defenseman, obviously Liles loved the system. It was made for guys like him, as he/Slavin/Pesce thrived in it despite the teams overall lack of success. Hanifin was made for it as well but obviously he had a lot to learn all around, he had to develop his hockey brain to really make it work. That’s why I don’t think Pesce is referring to offensive green lights. He always had one. It must mean something else. Maybe the whole feel of the room or approach to the team. We have very little structure now vs Peters system definitely having more shape. That’s undoubtedly freeing though not always a great idea.

I’ve tried to find the article but the Boston Globe is a pay site and I can’t get anywhere in their archives.

I can’t speak to that article, but I’ll say this: Peters always struck me as a very smart coach. I think he encountered some really difficult circumstances here, and it naturally looks worse when the team gets revamped and turns around as soon as he leaves. But I think he actually did have a good concept for the roster we were supposed to have and didn’t actually have until very recently.

 

[Navin R Slavin]

I’m not trying to pick a fight about this, I’m just curious. Why is it seen as a good thing that a coach lets them have so much freedom?

Because they're winning.

 

[bleedgreen]

I can’t speak to that article, but I’ll say this: Peters always struck me as a very smart coach. I think he encountered some really difficult circumstances here, and it naturally looks worse when the team gets revamped and turns around as soon as he leaves. But I think he actually did have a good concept for the roster we were supposed to have and didn’t actually have until very recently.

You have to have the right guys for your system no matter what it is. It’s great that we have an owner on the same page as everyone else. We’ve done a good job so far giving Rod a team that plays the way he wants to.

 

[bleedgreen]

I would love to read that. It's a shame to think there are many more articles like that we just won't be able to read again until online journalism figures out an archive system

It was a great article, I would read Fluto’s article every Sunday. The globe has historically always had a huge hockey article by their top writer on Sundays that was generally a state of affairs across the league kind of thing. Fluto was a big fan of the Canes and Peters, he pumped his tires quite a bit but that article was really the best one. I can’t remember if I found a way to share it back then, I know I talked about it. Not often especially before the changes that we got in detail good ink in another market. I’ll keep looking.

 

[SaskCanesFan]

It was a great article, I would read Fluto’s article every Sunday. The globe has historically always had a huge hockey article by their top writer on Sundays that was generally a state of affairs across the league kind of thing. Fluto was a big fan of the Canes and Peters, he pumped his tires quite a bit but that article was really the best one. I can’t remember if I found a way to share it back then, I know I talked about it. Not often especially before the changes that we got in detail good ink in another market. I’ll keep looking.

I'm 98% sure I remember the article you're talking about here, you must have shared it at the time. Went incredibly in depth about the Canes D system, the gaps coaches wanted, zone defence and switching off players. One of the most impressive hockey articles I've read

 

[geehaad]

I'm convinced Bill Peters wasn't successful here because he's a dick.