Proposal: Proposals Thread: Everything But The TV, Couch and Kitchen Sink Are For Sale!

[Soundwave]

I think we need to be careful with our winger depth, it's starting to look a lot thinner than a lot of people think.

Eberle may have holes in his game, but he also consistently has brought goal scoring to the Oilers, he is tied with Hall again this year.

Yakupov is a huge question mark.

On D we have players like Nurse, Klefbom, Schultz, and Marincin to develop, you maybe be adding Ekblad to that too.

Moving Eberle out might be foolish honestly in the long term, your winger depth may become Taylor Hall, David Perron, and uh ... *crickets* if Yakupov really doesn't pan out.

How terrible do our 2nd/3rd lines look right now? We really have terrible depth, we don't have the offence to spare that people think we do.

 

[Moose Coleman]

So you guys do realize that 4 1sts wasn't appealing which is why the Preds matched. Realizing the Preds were poised to match, the Flyers tried to negotiate a deal to convince the Preds not to match (where they'd see a couple of the firsts returned in exchange for players). Nothing was ever confirmed, but speculation had Read+Couturier for two of the picks back, but that clearly didn't get it done. So my question is why would the price suddenly be lower when they've already paid 25% of a 14 year deal in the first 2 years?

Well in one scenario, the Preds were hellbent on keeping him. If they've changed their mind for financial reasons and want to get rid of him, that alters the dynamic considerably and puts them in the place of having to accept the best offer they can get. Basically, they don't have the hammer anymore.

Everyone wants to use the Pronger deal(s) as some template, but that's just absurd. Both times the team acquiring Pronger clearly won the trade.

What about the third time? Or the fourth?

Weber is younger than Pronger was at the time, is his teams captain, and has already cost a lot to keep. The two situations have nothing in common.

Pronger was 29 or 30 when the Oilers got him and was the team captain. He was traded from St. Louis because they couldn't afford to keep him.

Weber is 28, team captain and the team (allegedly) can't afford to keep him.

Yup, totally different.

It's also funny that people want to use past deals as the standard regardless of the result. Believe it or not, GM's do smarten up, and a perfect example is the trade deadline. If you were to use the Penner trade from a previous deadline, Vanek should have returned 4 1sts. He didn't.

Which actually supports my argument.

If you use logic, you'll see there is no reason for the Preds to trade Weber. None.

I can think of about 94 million reasons. 95 when you consider the fact his contract runs till he's 40 and if he doesn't play that long, his will be stuck with a decent chunk of dead space on their ca which matters a lot less to Edmonton than it does to a team south of the Mason Dixon line.

 

[Paralyzer008]

I think we need to be careful with our winger depth, it's starting to look a lot thinner than a lot of people think.

Eberle may have holes in his game, but he also consistently has brought goal scoring to the Oilers, he is tied with Hall again this year.

Yakupov is a huge question mark.

On D we have players like Nurse, Klefbom, Schultz, and Marincin to develop, you maybe be adding Ekblad to that too.

Moving Eberle out might be foolish honestly in the long term, your winger depth may become Taylor Hall, David Perron, and uh ... *crickets* if Yakupov really doesn't pan out.

How terrible do our 2nd/3rd lines look right now? We really have terrible depth, we don't have the offence to spare that people think we do.

Yep you're totally right.

That's why I'd be scared of moving Eberle or Yak unless you get the absolute proper return. Our fanbase overvalues the draft picks sometimes, but those are what have to move, because we don't ruin our current depth from it.

Hopefully over the course of the summer, MacT drafts some skilled forwards and builds a new 3rd line so that we have more depth to use.

 

[Soundwave]

Yep you're totally right.

That's why I'd be scared of moving Eberle or Yak unless you get the absolute proper return. Our fanbase overvalues the draft picks sometimes, but those are what have to move, because we don't ruin our current depth from it.

Hopefully over the course of the summer, MacT drafts some skilled forwards and builds a new 3rd line so that we have more depth to use.

I don't think we can really even afford to move the pick unless we are winning such a trade hands down either, lol.

We badly need a d-man like Ekblad or a 1B center in the worst way and the draft honestly looks like the best place to add such a piece.

Our depth is so horrible all around.

 

[Paralyzer008]

I don't think we can really even afford to move the pick unless we are winning such a trade hands down either, lol.

We badly need a d-man like Ekblad or a 1B center in the worst way and the draft honestly looks like the best place to add such a piece.

Our depth is so horrible all around.

Well, I think the temptation of the draft makes us want to hold onto that pick because oh look, shiny new D-man named Ekblad, shiny new No.2 C named Reinhart or Bennett or Draisaitl, we need those now! We can plug those holes!

We need those holes plugged in now though, we can't afford to just sit and wait for another 18 year old to develop. What if, two years from now, Ekblad is following Adam Larsson's development curve or one of the C's is following Drouin's curve or Yak's curve or even Gagner's curve as an example. Then what happens? We still won't be a winning team and fans will be irate. I think the pressure on whatever 18 year old we draft might be increased as well because we want them to fill in the roster holes.

We need the holes filled by proven NHL talent, and the picks are a good way to get that proven talent. Also it'd be nice to do well in UFA with our 3rd line at least. The big problem with trading the picks is the No.2 C spot seems hard to fill outside of Stastny or trade.

 

[Moose Coleman]

What if, two years from now, Ekblad is following Adam Larsson's development curve or one of the C's is following Drouin's curve or Yak's curve or even Gagner's curve as an example. Then what happens? We still won't be a winning team and fans will be irate. I think the pressure on whatever 18 year old we draft might be increased as well because we want them to fill in the roster holes.

What if they don't and you've traded away the next Duchene or Pronger because you're rushing to appease an impatient fanbase?

Cuts both ways.

 

[Mcnofool6110]

The depth is so bad on this team.

You trade Gagner? #2C is Gordon, Lander, Arco or Hall out of position

You trade Eberle/Yakupov? #2RW is ... my god, actually no one. Perron's a LW and nearly all of our prospects are listed on the left side. I guess you swap him over and play Pitlick/Moroz/Chase/Khaira or something.

You trade J. Schultz, what, play 5 rookies and Ference on the team next year?
------------
I just had a thought that Chase was going to start on the third line next year. I don't know why, and I don't think that's a good thing. I just had that thought.

 

[Paralyzer008]

What if they don't and you've traded away the next Duchene or Pronger because you're rushing to appease an impatient fanbase?

Cuts both ways.

It does, and both ways have successful examples.

Toronto traded their pick for immediate help, being Phil Kessel. Phil Kessel is far and away the best player (who's not a goalie) on the Leafs.

The LA Kings, after another tough season, held onto their pick and selected Drew Doughty, who is now their franchise D-man.

I think at the end of the day, it sometimes falls upon "how good is your scouting and developmental abilities".....and we know the Oilers scouting is average at best.

Another big difference is we'd be trying to get a D-man for the pick, not Kessel. The player we'd get might be older than Kessel, which also dices the situation.

 

[Joey Moss]

The depth is so bad on this team.

You trade Gagner? #2C is Gordon, Lander, Arco or Hall out of position

You trade Eberle/Yakupov? #2RW is ... my god, actually no one. Perron's a LW and nearly all of our prospects are listed on the left side. I guess you swap him over and play Pitlick/Moroz/Chase/Khaira or something.

You trade J. Schultz, what, play 5 rookies and Ference on the team next year?
------------
I just had a thought that Chase was going to start on the third line next year. I don't know why, and I don't think that's a good thing. I just had that thought.

There is something called trades and signings.

 

[McDNicks17]

It does, and both ways have successful examples.

Toronto traded their pick for immediate help, being Phil Kessel. Phil Kessel is far and away the best player (who's not a goalie) on the Leafs.

The LA Kings, after another tough season, held onto their pick and selected Drew Doughty, who is now their franchise D-man.

I think at the end of the day, it sometimes falls upon "how good is your scouting and developmental abilities".....and we know the Oilers scouting is average at best.

Another big difference is we'd be trying to get a D-man for the pick, not Kessel. The player we'd get might be older than Kessel, which also dices the situation.

There's hundreds more examples of the latter working out.

Kessel is the only example of a top 5 pick being traded for a roster player that has worked out this century.

The other examples are Fedotenko for 4th(Pitkanen), Chara+2nd(Spezza) for Yashin and Weekes for 5th(Torres).

Before that the Isles got Luongo for the twilight years of Wendel Clark.


Not too promising.

 

[McGlassbangers]

So... Arthur Staple said on OilersNow that Sam Gagner for Josh Bailey swap could be a possibility in summer.

 

[Paralyzer008]

There's hundreds more examples of the latter working out.

Kessel is the only example of a top 5 pick being traded for a roster player that has worked out this century.

The other examples are Fedotenko for 4th(Pitkanen), Chara+2nd(Spezza) for Yashin and Weekes for 5th(Torres).

Before that the Isles got Luongo for the twilight years of Wendel Clark.


Not too promising.

Good point, but the Oilers are a case where it could work nicely, just because we already have a ton of young draft picks on our team and coming up.

So... Arthur Staple said on OilersNow that Sam Gagner for Josh Bailey swap could be a possibility in summer.

Gross, no thanks

 

[McDrailers]

So... Arthur Staple said on OilersNow that Sam Gagner for Josh Bailey swap could be a possibility in summer.

Depends on what Bailey we get from NYI. The energized full blast 100% Bailey is much much better then Sam Gagner.

oh, well. Nevermind. (I checked capgeek). Pass for 3.3 mill for a guy that's VERY streaky. I stick with the demon we know

 

[Joey Moss]

So... Arthur Staple said on OilersNow that Sam Gagner for Josh Bailey swap could be a possibility in summer.

Hall did play with Bailey in Windsor in his rookie year but IDK about this one..

 

[BoldNewLettuce]

So... Arthur Staple said on OilersNow that Sam Gagner for Josh Bailey swap could be a possibility in summer.

maybe a draft day deal 2nd and gagner for 4th, sundstrom/2nd and bailey

assuming ekblad is gone at 2 and nyi wants reinhart and oilers want draisaitl/bennett

 

[Joey Moss]

maybe a draft day deal 2nd and gagner for 4th, sundstrom/2nd and bailey

assuming ekblad is gone at 2 and nyi wants reinhart and oilers want draisaitl/bennett

Why would the Oilers give up the better player and pick for someone named Sundstrom or a 2nd?

 

[McDNicks17]

So... Arthur Staple said on OilersNow that Sam Gagner for Josh Bailey swap could be a possibility in summer.

4 more years at $3.3M for a guy worse than Gagner.

Ugly.

 

[BoldNewLettuce]

Why would the Oilers give up the better player and pick for someone named Sundstrom or a 2nd?

i assume because they get a 2nd or someone named Sundstrom (a 2nd) and then take the guy they would take anyways.....

Is Bailey not a 3rd liner?
If he can play that role....checking....then I don't care how much "worse" he is....

gagner is a -28 and lives in Calgary

 

[Mcnotloilersfan]

I know I'll take heat for this, but if we take Ekblad with our 1st, I would consider moving Yakupov to Isles for their pick. One of Draisaitl, Ritchie Dal Colle will probably be a much better fit for our team down the road.

 

[Paralyzer008]

I proposed this on the Canucks board. Thoughts?

Edler for Gagner (reduced to 4M) and our 1st in 2015.

Let's say you did that, and you moved our 1st in 2014 to Buffalo for Ehrhoff at a reduced 2M + Grigorenko + their STL 1st + a 2nd

The D becomes

Edler-Petry
Ehrhoff-Ference
Marincin-J.Schultz
Klefbom

All we did was remove Gagner from the active roster, kept all of the kids. Our top 4 now has half of the Canucks cup final top 4 (lolz) but that's very workable.

 

[Sloth Slothersons*]

I proposed this on the Canucks board. Thoughts?

Edler for Gagner (reduced to 4M) and our 1st in 2015.

Let's say you did that, and you moved our 1st in 2014 to Buffalo for Ehrhoff at a reduced 2M + Grigorenko + their STL 1st + a 2nd

The D becomes

Edler-Petry
Ehrhoff-Ference
Marincin-J.Schultz
Klefbom

All we did was remove Gagner from the active roster, kept all of the kids. Our top 4 now has half of the Canucks cup final top 4 (lolz) but that's very workable.

Moving our 1st in 2015 is very risky unless we know we are getting much better.

And that 2nd trade is ridiculous.

 

[OilerFan4Life]

I think Grabner makes more sense for both sides.

He's owed 9 million the next 2 seasons with a caphit of 3 million....with Cheapo Wang still running the team isn't it more beneficial to pay Gagner 10 million over the next 2 seasons with a caphit of 4.8 million?

Grabner would add much needed to our forward group.

 

[Paralyzer008]

Moving our 1st in 2015 is very risky unless we know we are getting much better.

And that 2nd trade is ridiculous.

Playing Ekblad on our D and expecting immediate results is just as ridiculous.

Now lets say Buffalo picks Ekblad, and we get to choose between Reinhart and Bennett. Or even 3rd, so Bennett and Draisaitl. We get from Buffalo:

A No.2 D-man paid only 2M
A potential top six center with immense size
A first round prospect
A second round prospect, we don't have a 2nd rounder right now.

I think that's plenty.

 

[Homesick]

I'm pretty leery of any guy who logs the kind of minutes he does with Shea Weber. You don't give up Eberle for Josi unless you know the latter can actually drive the bus.

Yea, Like Suter and Hamius. Josi is a great young defenseman

 

[Homesick]

I proposed this on the Canucks board. Thoughts?

Edler for Gagner (reduced to 4M) and our 1st in 2015.

Let's say you did that, and you moved our 1st in 2014 to Buffalo for Ehrhoff at a reduced 2M + Grigorenko + their STL 1st + a 2nd

The D becomes

Edler-Petry
Ehrhoff-Ference
Marincin-J.Schultz
Klefbom

All we did was remove Gagner from the active roster, kept all of the kids. Our top 4 now has half of the Canucks cup final top 4 (lolz) but that's very workable.

Edler hasn't played like a top four defenseman since signing his fat contract. So many guys just mail it in after that