Predators Hockey Discussion 22-23

[Porter Stoutheart]

There is just something that tells me Poile is going to ride Hynes out. I don't know why but I just think if he was going to do it he already would have. He will probably have his excuses lined up.

Well, I think he will through this regular season anyway. Because (in his view) even if you bring in a new guy now, it's not even a fair ask for that new guy to make the playoffs, since we're kind of too far out for that to be a real barometer of how the new guy performs. A coach needs time to get to know his team and put things in place. Usually. (Not always).

Although to me, that overlooks the value added from having the new coach go through that learning curve NOW, in a "lost season", and the potential positive development impact that could have for some of our younger players. But Poile does not seem to be on that wavelength these days.

I still hold out hope that he WILL change coaches in the off-season, though. Missing the playoffs should NOT be an acceptable outcome, I don't care how many "excuses" they choose to stack up.

 

[101st_fan]

This "lost season" has us 1 point behind the Blues with two games in hand and 6 points behind the Flames with three games in hand ... all with 49 games left in the season after tonight. We're not sitting 20+ points back without games in hand like the Hawks or Jackets.

 

[nine_inch_fang]

Jeannot needs to go to the sports psychologist. He has the yips when it comes to receiving passes and it's killing his ability to get transitions with speed.

 

[Bringer of Jollity]

Jeannot needs to go to the sports psychologist. He has the yips when it comes to receiving passes and it's killing his ability to get transitions with speed.

I like Jeannot a lot but I think we should trade him while teams still see him as a potential 20g/40p power forward type. He's capable of a lot more than he's producing this year, but I'd be highly surprised if he ever matches last year's numbers. If we can get the right 1st/good prospect+2nd or something we should pull the trigger.

 

[triggrman]

Honestly I’d trade Fabbro and Sissons first. Fabbro is obviously the odd man out of the top 4, and he’s getting a raise which we can’t afford. Id let 2 of Jankowski, Smith and Sissons go to we have too many of those guys and not enough skill. I use Jeannot and Trenin as a 4th line grinder line I bring up Evangelista and Tomasino and run 3 skill lines

 

[herzausstein]

This "lost season" has us 1 point behind the Blues with two games in hand and 6 points behind the Flames with three games in hand ... all with 49 games left in the season after tonight. We're not sitting 20+ points back without games in hand like the Hawks or Jackets.

Id put more faith in the team catching back up if we weren't 2-5-3 in the last 10 games. Small chance we drop to bottom 5 but at the rate we are going down, we could end up right outside of that. We are tied with arizona and montreal with 1 game in hand. Dropping behind them would put us 27th in the nhl. Then theres a rough shot sharks and flyers pass us theyve got 10 of the last 20 points available vs us having 8 of last 20.

Of course, the team could go on an epic win streak and end up in the playoff picture. Theyve shown no ability to do that this season so i dont have my hoped high for it.

 

[101st_fan]

Id put more faith in the team catching back up if we weren't 2-5-3 in the last 10 games. Small chance we drop to bottom 5 but at the rate we are going down, we could end up right outside of that. We are tied with arizona and montreal with 1 game in hand. Dropping behind them would put us 27th in the nhl. Then theres a rough shot sharks and flyers pass us theyve got 10 of the last 20 points available vs us having 8 of last 20.

Of course, the team could go on an epic win streak and end up in the playoff picture. Theyve shown no ability to do that this season so i dont have my hoped high for it.

This is the same team that was 6-3-1 before losing three blueliners to injury in December.

 

[Scoresberg]

The only hope for this team turning this season around is Saros going full-Vezina. There's no other way.

 

[101st_fan]

The only hope for this team turning this season around is Saros going full-Vezina. There's no other way.

The only way the team makes a run for the division is if Saros goes full Vezina and Josi goes full Norris ... getting back in the hunt for Div #3 / wild card simply requires a little secondary scoring and discipline. We're coming up just short in one goal games and that's with minimal scoring outside of our $8million dollar players plus Nino ... and most of them have slipped to a goal pace that is 5-10 goals below where we truly need them.

Two months without a goal from Jeannot hurts. No 5on5 goals all season from Granlund hurts. Only three goals each from Trenin and Sissons.

 

[Predsanddead24]

Id put more faith in the team catching back up if we weren't 2-5-3 in the last 10 games. Small chance we drop to bottom 5 but at the rate we are going down, we could end up right outside of that. We are tied with arizona and montreal with 1 game in hand. Dropping behind them would put us 27th in the nhl. Then theres a rough shot sharks and flyers pass us theyve got 10 of the last 20 points available vs us having 8 of last 20.

Of course, the team could go on an epic win streak and end up in the playoff picture. Theyve shown no ability to do that this season so i dont have my hoped high for it.

It definitely seems like the brief hot streak was the anomaly and not the mediocre to poor play we’ve seen the rest of the season. Sure we’re not the worst team in the league but we’re rapidly approaching the point where we’d need an insanely good stretch of play to finish anywhere other than WC2. Which is particularly disappointing when we made moves in the offseason to improve and have taken a step back.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

It definitely seems like the brief hot streak was the anomaly and not the mediocre to poor play we’ve seen the rest of the season. Sure we’re not the worst team in the league but we’re rapidly approaching the point where we’d need an insanely good stretch of play to finish anywhere other than WC2. Which is particularly disappointing when we made moves in the offseason to improve and have taken a step back.

This is the same magnitude of "step back" that ultimately got Laviolette fired. Our last 6 years, overall standings position:
1
8
16 <--- Lavy fired at 19-15-7 record, Hynes comes in 16-11-1 and out in the Covid qualifier
13
16
24 <--- today 14-14-5

The rapid descent to "middle of the pack" got Lavy fired. Was the new coach supposed to turn things around in some fashion? It didn't happen, instead the team just hovered "middle of the pack" for a couple years, and then took another dip to "also-ran". While spending to the Cap now. I don't know what about this situation is satisfactory to Poile.

 

[Armourboy]

This is the same magnitude of "step back" that ultimately got Laviolette fired. Our last 6 years, overall standings position:
1
8
16 <--- Lavy fired at 19-15-7 record, Hynes comes in 16-11-1 and out in the Covid qualifier
13
16
24 <--- today 14-14-5

The rapid descent to "middle of the pack" got Lavy fired. Was the new coach supposed to turn things around in some fashion? It didn't happen, instead the team just hovered "middle of the pack" for a couple years, and then took another dip to "also-ran". While spending to the Cap now. I don't know what about this situation is satisfactory to Poile.

Well and of you think things are different and it's not the coach then that means you need to move out some of the core guys to retool.

It's either one or the other or both which means if you keep sitting on your hands it's not going to get better.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

Well and of you think things are different and it's not the coach then that means you need to move out some of the core guys to retool.

It's either one or the other or both which means if you keep sitting on your hands it's not going to get better.

And I think Poile has gone pretty far in remaking the roster in the last 3 years as it is. He practically houdini'ed himself out of the Subban and Ellis contracts just in the nick of time. He bought out Turris, he let go Arvy, Jarnkrok, Smith, Bonino, Watson, bid fond adieu to Pekka... a lot has changed already in just 3 seasons, and it's not like Forsberg or Josi are ever going anywhere. I don't think it would make sense to liquidate the entire 2nd tier behind them again so soon, that'd just be admitting an even bigger level of failure than just picking the wrong coach?

I doubt he wants to leave a mess for his son, if that's the succession plan. But as usual, it's really impossible to even guess what they might be thinking wrt this season.

 

[ShagDaddy]

For those of you who are becoming big fans of Glass like I am, here’s a good article.

Cody Glass's new role suggests good things to come for Preds

One of the few bright spots for Nashville this year.

atozsports.com

 

[Byrddog]

Yeah trading guys like jeannot, fabbro, trenin, carrier, etc can be done but what does it accomplish? Maybe 2M in cap if you replace carrier/fabbro/jeanot with gross/Afanasyev next season. It just doesnt gain us much capspace and the team is likely worse off. Coaching change is probably the absolute easiest path to take.

This is still however the most likely route taken. Honestly Fabbro has not taken big steps forward and if he returns something valuable a guy that has potential as a real top six talent meaning 70 point guy a few years down the road would be a good move no picks Poiles record precludes any hope of drafting offense so it is senseless to fool ourselves.
As to coaching change if it is done before the off season I bet Poile goes after Andrew Brunette. N the off season he will make a run at Trotz who after more in-depth reading signs with someone else and Poile gets left with his shorts down. Ideally any coach he hires needs to be a guy that can develop a team and looking at the names out there now or those that will be fired at the end of the season no one stands out to be that guy. Some will want to bring a AHL guy in but considering the need here there will be a very small number. Maybe one of the asst coaches from Jersey who have seen Lindy Ruff turn that team around with young guys? A article from November from NHL live identifies the issue of both player and Hynes being a issue in Nashville pointing out that both issues have to be addressed and predicted it would be a long process. Pointing out that Nashville had never experienced a true rebuild and the impact on the fan base would be negitive for some time. They also pointed out that Nashville would still have good attendance due to the venue and people liking to make the trip as visitors . Honestly it read like they got there info from this board since all the topics that have been talked about here for some time.

We n previous posts someone suggested to trade Saros. If Askrov is the future here Thur time is now to trade Saros because his numbers are just going to drop with the poor scoring of the team. In the end his advanced stats are still ok but losses are piling up . Goalie value is not all that great in the league unless a GM can pull off a trade like Tampa did when they moved Ben Bishop.

 

[AintLifeGrand]

I’m confident that Parssinen will be one of them anyway. Well, barring some unexpected injury issues. He probably doesn’t have the flashy skills to qualify as everybody’s idea of a “true #1” center. But he’s so smart and capable already at a young age that I can’t imagine him not holding one of those spots.

The rest… who knows. Glass is showing some signs of being able to stick but I don’t think of him as a slam dunk yet. Novak has some chance but he’s older and not sure if he has much upside to get even better. Either of Johansen or Sissons could still be in the picture if they age gracefully and are willing to be more “affordable veterans” vs their current premium salaries.

I doubt Svechkov or another already-drafted prospect would be ready yet? Maybe a slim chance if Tomasino got the strength they want him to he could switch back but I wouldn’t expect that.

So probably there is another UFA signing coming too once the Cap goes up and Johansen’s salary comes off the books.

-Novak has consistently produced since last year. he deserves a top 9 role - I think he could still develop into a top 6 guy

-glass starting to stick- cautiously optimistic about him

- Parssinenn is our future #1 center- He needs to center the 3rd line with trenin on LW and Evangelista/ Tomasino st RW

 

[AintLifeGrand]

This is the same team that was 6-3-1 before losing three blueliners to injury in December.

give it up dude- we suck this season- enjoy the race to the bottom

 

[Scoresberg]

I like Jeannot a lot but I think we should trade him while teams still see him as a potential 20g/40p power forward type. He's capable of a lot more than he's producing this year, but I'd be highly surprised if he ever matches last year's numbers. If we can get the right 1st/good prospect+2nd or something we should pull the trigger.

Agreed, He's probably close to the most valuable piece we have right now.

The return has to be stupid, though. Think Hagel-like from last season.

 

[triggrman]

I don’t trust Poile with pick we’d get in return

 

[Scoresberg]

I don’t trust Poile with pick we’d get in return

I think Poile would prefer prospects over picks in a deal like that - as he has done in the past. Maybe a 1st + A prospect should do the trick?

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

I certainly wouldn't trade Jeannot for just a single late 1st round pick (or equivalent prospect) anyway. Even if he's not going to blossom into the scorer we dreamed of, just being a heavy 10-goal guy doing what he's doing is worth more than most of our 1st rounders in the past several years have panned out to be. We have nothing to show for Tolvanen, and may be headed in the same direction with Fabbro. Kemell and Svechkov have some question marks attached to them. I am cautiously optimistic about Askarov and Tomasino. But anyway, unless we're talking top-10 picks, it's somewhat rare to get a more valuable player than what Jeannot is right now as a 3rd liner with his physicality.

Mainly I would just have to factor in his contract ask. If he's shooting for something that aligns more with last season's production, then that opens my mind more to the idea of trading him. Locking him up at $5M or some outlandish number would definitely run the risk of making him into a whipping boy. Whereas if he was locked up to something more team-friendly then that tips things significantly in the direction of keeping him.

Also, I'm still assuming we won't be able to keep Trenin long term. Once he turns UFA after next season, would he want to stay? Doubtful. Which also makes keeping Jeannot all the more important.

 

[AintLifeGrand]

Jeannot had a magical run but he's on the wrong side of 20 now and his value will never be higher.....trade him

 

[Scoresberg]

Jeannot had a magical run but he's on the wrong side of 20 now and his value will never be higher.....trade him

Wrong side of 20.. so over 20? You do know that there's only a handful of teenagers playing in the league?

I certainly wouldn't trade Jeannot for just a single late 1st round pick (or equivalent prospect) anyway. Even if he's not going to blossom into the scorer we dreamed of, just being a heavy 10-goal guy doing what he's doing is worth more than most of our 1st rounders in the past several years have panned out to be. We have nothing to show for Tolvanen, and may be headed in the same direction with Fabbro. Kemell and Svechkov have some question marks attached to them. I am cautiously optimistic about Askarov and Tomasino. But anyway, unless we're talking top-10 picks, it's somewhat rare to get a more valuable player than what Jeannot is right now as a 3rd liner with his physicality.

Mainly I would just have to factor in his contract ask. If he's shooting for something that aligns more with last season's production, then that opens my mind more to the idea of trading him. Locking him up at $5M or some outlandish number would definitely run the risk of making him into a whipping boy. Whereas if he was locked up to something more team-friendly then that tips things significantly in the direction of keeping him.

Also, I'm still assuming we won't be able to keep Trenin long term. Once he turns UFA after next season, would he want to stay? Doubtful. Which also makes keeping Jeannot all the more important.

Fine, trade Trenin then. He'd get a haul as well, as he's locked in at $1.7 mil next year also after which he's a UFA.

 

[Bringer of Jollity]

-Novak has consistently produced since last year. he deserves a top 9 role - I think he could still develop into a top 6 guy

-glass starting to stick- cautiously optimistic about him

- Parssinenn is our future #1 center- He needs to center the 3rd line with trenin on LW and Evangelista/ Tomasino st RW

Let's pump the brakes a bit here.

 

[herzausstein]

This is still however the most likely route taken. Honestly Fabbro has not taken big steps forward and if he returns something valuable a guy that has potential as a real top six talent meaning 70 point guy a few years down the road would be a good move no picks Poiles record precludes any hope of drafting offense so it is senseless to fool ourselves.
As to coaching change if it is done before the off season I bet Poile goes after Andrew Brunette. N the off season he will make a run at Trotz who after more in-depth reading signs with someone else and Poile gets left with his shorts down. Ideally any coach he hires needs to be a guy that can develop a team and looking at the names out there now or those that will be fired at the end of the season no one stands out to be that guy. Some will want to bring a AHL guy in but considering the need here there will be a very small number. Maybe one of the asst coaches from Jersey who have seen Lindy Ruff turn that team around with young guys? A article from November from NHL live identifies the issue of both player and Hynes being a issue in Nashville pointing out that both issues have to be addressed and predicted it would be a long process. Pointing out that Nashville had never experienced a true rebuild and the impact on the fan base would be negitive for some time. They also pointed out that Nashville would still have good attendance due to the venue and people liking to make the trip as visitors . Honestly it read like they got there info from this board since all the topics that have been talked about here for some time.

We n previous posts someone suggested to trade Saros. If Askrov is the future here Thur time is now to trade Saros because his numbers are just going to drop with the poor scoring of the team. In the end his advanced stats are still ok but losses are piling up . Goalie value is not all that great in the league unless a GM can pull off a trade like Tampa did when they moved Ben Bishop.

Id be ok with trading saros. Saros still has a pretty good GAA and SV%. Hes just outside the top 10 (minimum 20 games played) in sv%. Nashville is 6th worst team in shots against per game and 3rd worst team in goals for per game. So hes doing pretty well considering he gets shelled consistently and has no goal support. I bet a team like columbus would give alot to have that kind of goaltending. Wed probably have to take elvis back but thatd only increase the return. Elvis minds the net until Askarov usurps him.