Poll: If you had to decide now: Would you extend Kyle Dubas or let him walk ?

[hotpaws]

1) your first comment sound as though you’re claiming those things happened during this season, which is untrue:
- he didn’t lose the net
- he wasn’t relegated to backup
- his injury was an ankle injury, not a mystery

2) Mrazek and Murray are not particularly similar. I’ll give you both are injury prone though. I’m not going to act like Murray is the guy I wanted us to go after, but you haven’t made a strong argument at all that it was poor asset management. Especially once again, when we gave up precisely nothing for him. In fact, we gained 2 picks

it was obvious my first comment was about when we acquired them which was in the offseason

it will be obvious even to you it was poor asset mgmt when we have to pay more to dump him this summer than we were paid to acquire him , no one's taking 6m in actual cash for a 3rd and 7th

and yes Sammy had taken over before Murray's latest mystery injury and yes it's a mystery since he went out for the warmup , took a shot high then pulled the chute and called it a night with an ''ankle'' injury lol

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

1) your first comment sound as though you’re claiming those things happened during this season, which is untrue:
- he didn’t lose the net
- he wasn’t relegated to backup
- his injury was an ankle injury, not a mystery

2) Mrazek and Murray are not particularly similar. I’ll give you both are injury prone though. I’m not going to act like Murray is the guy I wanted us to go after, but you haven’t made a strong argument at all that it was poor asset management. Especially once again, when we gave up precisely nothing for him. In fact, we gained 2 picks

He has absolutely lost the net

 

[banks]

Dubas has made mistakes, and I don't like the whiz kid persona he seems to exude. And it's a results business, so I'm not even bothered when people say they want him fired. But everyone has to admit that organization is better and deeper now than they've been in a long time. The good decisions have outweighed the bad.

Bad:
Big 4 got overpaid
Some of the deadline buys were mistakes
Backup goalie position was a problem for too long

Good:
Quickly fixes most mistakes (Ritchie, Mrazek)
Seems to draft well, even without top picks
Brings in talent from more than just UFAs
Treats players well, and is well liked
Kept the organizational depth a priority

I don't think he's been perfect, and I'm not a fanboy. But I really don't know who people think would be better. The only big issue is that not enough players have been willing to take discounts, and then COVID flattened the cap. I like the team as it is now, and hope they can go deep this season so we don't have to see it dismantled.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

The fact that this poll overwhelming supports Dubas despite his legacy of playoff failure indicates one of two things, both of them bad:
1) This poll is actually representative of the views of the aggregate group of Leafs' fans and thus is indicative that they will accept losing and mediocrity which is why the Leafs haven't won a playoff round in 20 years or a Cup in 55 years.

OR

2) This poll is only representative of the views of this forum and is not indicative or in line with the views of the greater group of Leafs' fans... which means that realist Leafs' fans have been driven off this forum because they are fed up with being attacked for disagreeing with the Dubas echo chamber.

Pick your poison.

 

[Sypher04]

it was obvious my first comment was about when we acquired them which was in the offseason

it will be obvious even to you it was poor asset mgmt when we have to pay more to dump him this summer than we were paid to acquire him , no one's taking 6m in actual cash for a 3rd and 7th

and yes Sammy had taken over before Murray's latest mystery injury and yes it's a mystery since he went out for the warmup , took a shot high then pulled the chute and called it a night with an ''ankle'' injury lol

If it was obvious I would not have replied how I did. “he lost the net and was regulated to b/u before his latest mystery injury” is in no way obvious that it’s regarding last year. If you actually think it is, I would suggest communications classes. I’m willing to bet 90% of people read that the same way I did.

IF we have to move him in the off-season I will agree with the premise it was poor asset management but that hasn’t happened, so you can’t use a hypothetical future to call it poor asset management now.

You rejecting the explanation doesn’t make it a mystery. We’ve been told on multiple occasions that he re-aggravated an ankle injury. Also, the precise moment he left the ice doesn’t necessarily indicate when or how the injury was sustained in warmup. The dude is made of glass; no injury should surprise.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Extend him if we win the cup.
Fire him if we have inadequate playoff success.
"Let him walk" is too kind.

 

[hotpaws]

The fact that this poll overwhelming supports Dubas despite his legacy of playoff failure indicates one of two things, both of them bad:
1) This poll is actually representative of the views of the aggregate group of Leafs' fans and thus is indicative that they will accept losing and mediocrity which is why the Leafs haven't won a playoff round in 20 years or a Cup in 55 years.

OR

2) This poll is only representative of the views of this forum and is not indicative or in line with the views of the greater group of Leafs' fans... which means that realist Leafs' fans have been driven off this forum because they are fed up with being attacked for disagreeing with the Dubas echo chamber.

Pick your poison.

i think it's more like a large number just want to believe he's doing a good job because they can't face the probability that he's wasted years of the best young core this team had assembled in decades

 

[ACC1224]

The fact that this poll overwhelming supports Dubas despite his legacy of playoff failure indicates one of two things, both of them bad:
1) This poll is actually representative of the views of the aggregate group of Leafs' fans and thus is indicative that they will accept losing and mediocrity which is why the Leafs haven't won a playoff round in 20 years or a Cup in 55 years.

OR

2) This poll is only representative of the views of this forum and is not indicative or in line with the views of the greater group of Leafs' fans... which means that realist Leafs' fans have been driven off this forum because they are fed up with being attacked for disagreeing with the Dubas echo chamber.

Pick your poison.

I'm in neither of those groups.
I'm of the Old School belief that a GM should never be on his last year. If the Team wanted to take the 'wait and see' approach they should have given him the token one year(severance) extension.

 

[hotpaws]

If it was obvious I would not have replied how I did. “he lost the net and was regulated to b/u before his latest mystery injury” is in no way obvious that it’s regarding last year. If you actually think it is, I would suggest communications classes. I’m willing to bet 90% of people read that the same way I did.

IF we have to move him in the off-season I will agree with the premise it was poor asset management but that hasn’t happened, so you can’t use a hypothetical future to call it poor asset management now.

You rejecting the explanation doesn’t make it a mystery. We’ve been told on multiple occasions that he re-aggravated an ankle injury. Also, the precise moment he left the ice doesn’t necessarily indicate when or how the injury was sustained in warmup. The dude is made of glass; no injury should surprise.

yup Murray continuing to pull himself out of warmups here and in Ottawa is all because he getting injured or re aggravating an existing injury , lol

and the old kick the can down the road on the poor asset mgmt then spin some other excuse to justify Dubas acquiring Murray , that's been done to death on here . lol

 

[57 Years No Cup]

I'm in neither of those groups.
I'm of the Old School belief that a GM should never be on his last year. If the Team wanted to take the 'wait and see' approach they should have given him the token one year(severance) extension.

Well he is on his last year and as for as we know he hasn't been extended, therefore that horse has already left the barn.... so why would they extend him now?

 

[ACC1224]

Well he is on his last year and as for as we know he hasn't been extended, therefore that horse has already left the barn.... so why would they extend him now?

They won't extend him until the season is over.

Thread doesn't ask what the Leafs would do, it asks what 'you' would do.

 

[Sypher04]

He has absolutely lost the net

No, he didn’t. From return from Christmas to his last game before injury, Dec 27th - Jan 17th

27 - Sammy (.882)
29 - Murray (.810)
31 - Murray (.929)
03 - Sammy (.844)
05 - Murray (.808)
07 - Sammy (.957)
08 - Murray (.944)
11 - Murray (.970)
12 - Sammy (.864)
14 - Murray (.882)
17 - Murray/Sammy (.500/1.000)

This shows two inconsistent goaltenders splitting the games, with a slight skew towards Murray playing over Samsonov

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

No, he didn’t. From return from Christmas to his last game before injury, Dec 27th - Jan 17th

27 - Sammy (.882)
29 - Murray (.810)
31 - Murray (.929)
03 - Sammy (.844)
05 - Murray (.808)
07 - Sammy (.957)
08 - Murray (.944)
11 - Murray (.970)
12 - Sammy (.864)
14 - Murray (.882)
17 - Murray/Sammy (.500/1.000)

This shows two inconsistent goaltenders splitting the games, with a skew towards Murray playing over Samsonov

and now he's lost the net

 

[Sypher04]

and now he's lost the net

That wasn’t the argument. I’d agree with skewing starts more towards samsonov now, but Murray will play close to a split when healthy. This is still a tandem

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

That wasn’t the argument

yes it was, you saidx he never lost the net, I said he's absolutely lost the net, because he has.

 

[hotpaws]

I'm in neither of those groups.
I'm of the Old School belief that a GM should never be on his last year. If the Team wanted to take the 'wait and see' approach they should have given him the token one year(severance) extension.

on one hand i read being a lame duck is a distraction to the team but on the other hand i read it doesn't matter if he hsad more term because he still could be fired at any time especially by a rich team like the Leafs

imo it doesn't make a difference if he has term or not if those above him have let it be known they won't tolerate if the team keeps spinning it's wheels

 

[Sypher04]

and the old kick the can down the road on the poor asset mgmt then spin some other excuse to justify Dubas acquiring Murray , that's been done to death on here . lol

I won’t answer for the tactics and agendas of other people. Or the counter, but equally transparent agendas of people like yourself on the other side.

I state my opinion. Right now, you cannot call something poor asset management based on a hypothetical scenario that may or may not play out. If it does, I’ll be right there to say we wasted assets with you

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

The fact that this poll overwhelming supports Dubas despite his legacy of playoff failure indicates one of two things, both of them bad:
1) This poll is actually representative of the views of the aggregate group of Leafs' fans and thus is indicative that they will accept losing and mediocrity which is why the Leafs haven't won a playoff round in 20 years or a Cup in 55 years.

OR

2) This poll is only representative of the views of this forum and is not indicative or in line with the views of the greater group of Leafs' fans... which means that realist Leafs' fans have been driven off this forum because they are fed up with being attacked for disagreeing with the Dubas echo chamber.

Pick your poison.

That you can only come up with two options might say more about you than anything else?

 

[Sypher04]

yes it was, you saidx he never lost the net, I said he's absolutely lost the net, because he has.

The context of the discussion you entered is important. My comment was in reply to hotpaws’ assertion (that looked as though it was related to this season) that Murray had lost his net PRIOR to his latest so-called mystery injury. He did not.

It’s at least arguable he has now, but even that remains to be seen until we see how Keefe uses him as he returns this week

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

yes it was, you saidx he never lost the net, I said he's absolutely lost the net, because he has.

You need to understand verb tense.

 

[kb]

Samsonov hasn't shown enough consistency to say definitely that he's stolen the net. Which means that Murray hasn't lost the net - he's just recovering and things will play out down the stretch..

The Leafs should be thankful they have both, plus Woll and his .929 sv % as #3. Brain Elliot was blown up for a converted touchdown for Tampa in their 7-2 loss last night.

 

[hotpaws]

I won’t answer for the tactics and agendas of other people. Or the counter, but equally transparent agendas of people like yourself on the other side.

I state my opinion. Right now, you cannot call something poor asset management based on a hypothetical scenario that may or may not play out. If it does, I’ll be right there to say we wasted assets with you

right now how can anyone not call Murray poor asset mgmt due to his season to date ? and cap space is an asset to us before you try to spin we got paid to take him like some bottom feeder just looking to stack picks

and anyone who's at all familiar with your posting history can easily tell what your ''agenda'' is

 

[meefer]

I'll fire him after one of our stars - who he has supported with everything he has - steps up and dominates a series, and we still lose.

 

[Sypher04]

right now how can anyone not call Murray poor asset mgmt due to his season to date ? and cap space is an asset to us before you try to spin we got paid to take him like some bottom feeder just looking to stack picks

and anyone who's at all familiar with your posting history can easily tell what your ''agenda'' is

once again clearly proving that you have no clue whatsoever as to my actual posting history.

Dubas got caught with his pants down, and yes while cap space is an asset, having it and no goaltender is also not good. I mean, we got really lucky Samsonov ended up available. There was seemingly little else out there and yeah Murray was far from a lock to play a lot this year.

 

[Cleetus]

Samsonov hasn't shown enough consistency to say definitely that he's stolen the net. Which means that Murray hasn't lost the net - he's just recovering and things will play out down the stretch..

The Leafs should be thankful they have both, plus Woll and his .929 sv % as #3. Brain Elliot was blown up for a converted touchdown for Tampa in their 7-2 loss last night.

Little Monday Comedy for you this morning kb!