Pittsburgh Sports Media Gibberish - Part IX

[pengwins1587]

I've wanted jagr in Pittsburgh ever since he came back from Russia so I would love this to happen. Flip Kunitz and borts to the Ducks for lovejoy and a prospect + mid round pick. Use the pick and a 3rd next year to get jagr.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Listening to Madden...Kunitz is gone. I don't know if this Jagr stuff is BS or not, but I'd bet money Kunitz is not in camp this fall.

There's a full court press of "I've heard that Chris Kunitz doesn't like babies."

This isn't Madden talking out of his ass; it's the Pens' PR apparatus talking through him. Turn the casual fan against 14 so it doesn't look like you've traded him out of nowhere to the guy who thinks Adams is a critical part of the Pens PK.

Pirates did this when they didn't want to sign Burnett, Pens did the same thing with Neal, as well, prior to his trade.

Which isn't to say I object, particularly.

My only counter to that is why are they keeping Kunitz on the first line then?

Doesn't add up to me.

 

[JackFr]

My only counter to that is why are they keeping Kunitz on the first line then?

Doesn't add up to me.

Drumming up his value by pretending he's still a great top six forward?

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

My only counter to that is why are they keeping Kunitz on the first line then?

Doesn't add up to me.

Because with the injuries the next best option has been Nick Spaling??

 

[BobCole]

Am I missing something? Isn't Madden a blowhard with little to no credibility at all? Why are we all of the sudden taking his word seriously when it happens to reflect what we want to hear?

 

[billybudd]

My only counter to that is why are they keeping Kunitz on the first line then?

Doesn't add up to me.

With Dupuis out for the year and Hornqvist/Comeau hurt, there hasn't been anyone capable of knocking him down a few lines. Prior to that, they were probably giving him the benefit of the doubt.

I love Bobby Farnham, but that's not saying I want him on the first line, lol. I guess there's Downie, but he's in the doghouse for other reasons.

 

[penguins2946*]

My only counter to that is why are they keeping Kunitz on the first line then?

Doesn't add up to me.

Nothing tanks your value more than being demoted to the 3rd or 4th line. They want him gone, but they don't want to just dump him.

 

[Speaking Moistly]

I wonder if this is why Johnston seems insistent on Kunitz playing on the top line....make him look better for a potential trade?

I think they've been pretty desperate to get Kunitz going. He started with Crosby, got put with Malkin, got demoted to the third line and now they're back to Kunitz with Crosby. Maybe they put him back with Crosby to attempt to boost his value, idk. Hasn't Kunitz been off of PP1 a few times recently? If Kunitz didn't suck the top 6 would be looking pretty sweet with PCH, KMB (suck it, Sutter).

Maybe it's been a battle of egos with him or maybe he's done and they're not accepting that. Kunitz has looked lazy as hell on top of old, though.

 

[IcedCapp]

there's a lot of logic to what Billy is saying, but I just can't see this team trading Kunitz, let alone being eager to do it and manipulating the media to do it (though, in general, I have no trouble believing this team abuses the media at will)

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Drumming up his value by pretending he's still a great top six forward?

Because with the injuries the next best option has been Nick Spaling??

With Dupuis out for the year and Hornqvist/Comeau hurt, there hasn't been anyone capable of knocking him down a few lines. Prior to that, they were probably giving him the benefit of the doubt.

I love Bobby Farnham, but that's not saying I want him on the first line, lol. I guess there's Downie, but he's in the doghouse for other reasons.

Nothing tanks your value more than being demoted to the 3rd or 4th line. They want him gone, but they don't want to just dump him.

I think Crosby wanted him there, basically.

Seeing Kunitz traded is like seeing Adams taken out of the lineup.

Just can't see it. Some things on this team are a constant.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Nah... can't really see it. It makes more than a little sense but I just don't see the team pulling the trigger. At least not this year.

The Jagr thing is just a laugh. I feel like he throws that one at the wall every six months or so to stir things up. And yes... I see that the "right people" are talking about it now. Whoopie.

 

[billybudd]

there's a lot of logic to what Billy is saying, but I just can't see this team trading Kunitz, let alone being eager to do it and manipulating the media to do it (though, in general, I have no trouble believing this team abuses the media at will)

It's not so much what Madden's saying that makes me think he's out the door, but the reasons he's giving.

If Madden said the Pens should think about trading Kunitz because he's declining, I'd dismiss it.

But he's saying stuff like "unhappy in Pittsburgh," "may have requested a trade," "wants to play in a market with less media coverage," "too attached to the old coach" and citing "team sources."

He got an info dump. And what was in that dump?

Emotional justifications for a customer base to hold a grudge, not reasoned arguments for asset management. These "leaks" are an appeal to our lizard brains to flip a switch that makes CK an outsider.

Done this way, there's cheering when the trigger gets pulled, instead of teary press conferences like the one where Holmgren traded Richards.

The Jagr stuff...who knows...but I'd bet money 14 isn't here next camp. Not my life savings, but not nothing, either.

 

[BobCole]

I think some of you give Madden and the organization too much credit. The odds of anybody at the Pens org giving Madden talking points to influence public perception of Kunitz seem very low to me.

 

[ProgOg]

Dreger did/does the same for the Leafs. Based on Madden's relationship with Lemieux, it's probably not as unlikely as it seems.

 

[Sideline]

I think some of you give Madden and the organization too much credit. The odds of anybody at the Pens org giving Madden talking points to influence public perception of Kunitz seem very low to me.

The odds of an agent leaking info to Madden to pressure JR seem reasonably good to me. Hell, the odds that one of the 12 assistant GMs would leak something to Madden to light a fire under Kunitz's ass seem better than even to me, too.

 

[billybudd]

I think some of you give Madden and the organization too much credit. The odds of anybody at the Pens org giving Madden talking points to influence public perception of Kunitz seem very low to me.

They did exactly that last year with Neal.

"I've been told by the Penguins that Neal asked for a trade"

Who the Hell do you think told him that?

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Heh... "wants to play in a market with less media coverage."

I get that the Penguins are always in NHL news. But if that's true, I'm not so sure Kunitz knows how good he has it in that regard. The Pittsburgh media are easily-manipulated pushovers who routinely go to bat for the team/players. Often despite good evidence to the contrary.

What billy is saying is correct. I have no doubt the team uses guys like Madden to craft narratives. In this particular instance I want to believe that's the case but I just can't.

Though, I mean... as more or less the only viable trade chip without any movement clauses in his contract? And along with the fact that anyone with eyeballs and a brain can see he is declining? JR and co. don't have as much loyalty to him, personally, as the last gaggle of stupid did...

 

[Night Shift]

Just because it's Madden and it likely doesn't happen, doesn't mean the Pens aren't inquiring about Jagr and trying to make it happen.

I mentioned the idea of Kunitz for Jagr last week in the Roster move thread and got laughed at. This works because the cap space of Jagr and Kunitz are almost identical. Their stats are identical too and Kunitz is playing with better linemates! We can't just add Jagr for nothing if you guys thought he was too old to be worth nothing. We can't add Jagr without moving someone else as a cap dump.

The silver lining to this idea that people are not seeing is we are tied to Kunitz for 3 years and Jagr is an UFA next year. So we don't sign Jagr next year but that cap space can be used for someone else. Why do people insist on retaining an old Kunitz (who probably needs a change of scenery anyway) and not have this cap space next offseason to try to improve the team?

Kunitz is Shero's guy. It's time to move forward with the roster.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I doubt it would be a 1 for 1 Kunitz/Jagr deal.

Hypothetically.

 

[billybudd]

Heh... "wants to play in a market with less media coverage."

I get that the Penguins are always in NHL news. But if that's true, I'm not so sure Kunitz knows how good he has it in that regard. The Pittsburgh media are easily-manipulated pushovers who routinely go to bat for the team/players. Often despite good evidence to the contrary.

What billy is saying is correct. I have no doubt the team uses guys like Madden to craft narratives. In this particular instance I want to believe that's the case but I just can't.

That's the thing--it doesn't matter if Kunitz actually thinks that. That the Penguins put that out there is what tells me he's gone. It could be a complete lie and it still tells me he's gone.

Neal swears on a stack of bibles he never asked for a trade, but someone with the Pens still leaked to Madden and Savran that he had.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I know what you mean. I was mostly just poking fun at that line of thinking.

Pittsburgh media is about as player and team friendly as it gets. They're a pack of friggin' shills.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

That's the thing--it doesn't matter if Kunitz actually thinks that. That the Penguins put that out there is what tells me he's gone. It could be a complete lie and it still tells me he's gone.

Neal swears on a stack of bibles he never asked for a trade, but someone with the Pens still leaked to Madden and Savran that he had.

The Neal asked for a trade narrative never made any sense to me. I doubt he asked for one and he claimed he didn't. They should have just let it be known that the org felt he had to be moved for locker room harmony and kept it at that.

Kunitz saying he wants to go to a city with less media scrutiny is like Kessel wanting to go to a city that has more of a media presence than Toronto.

I guess Florida and maybe Carolina come to mind, but it seems pretty absurd.

 

[KIRK]

Another Madden rumor.

Pens might trade Kunitz then trade for Jagr.

Apparently Malkin has already been asked about Jagr and would want to play with him, Malkin also seems to love playing with Spailing.


I call BS again, Madden just said a little while ago Martin for Williams was likely to happen.

Look, I posted this in the salary cap thread:

Early this month, right after the replacement for DK at the Trib posted his article talking about getting Malkin a winger, he had a little five minute interview with some whatever site. I forget the site and can't find the link, and even if I could find it, I wouldn't link it here, because the guy is human filth. Here's what he said:

1. Malkin needs better than his current wingers. He took a shot at Bennett and then said Malkin likes playing with Spaling.

2. He said the Pens would be interested in Jagr and specifically used the exact same words that Malkin had been consulted.

This is Malkin citing what he either heard from ***** or had repeated to him by *****.

Don't get me wrong: Malkin and Jagr together makes a lot of sense. When you look at what you could get, the cost, and the potential impact with Malkin, Jagr makes A LOT of sense as a top, non long term target.

And, that thing about Kunitz. On this team, the best place for him is 3LW. At 3.75M, that's a luxury on a team that needs cap space to address other needs.

Listening to Madden...Kunitz is gone. I don't know if this Jagr stuff is BS or not, but I'd bet money Kunitz is not in camp this fall.

There's a full court press of "I've heard that Chris Kunitz doesn't like babies."

This isn't Madden talking out of his ass; it's the Pens' PR apparatus talking through him. Turn the casual fan against 14 so it doesn't look like you've traded him out of nowhere to the guy who thinks Adams is a critical part of the Pens PK.

Pirates did this when they didn't want to sign Burnett, Pens did the same thing with Neal, as well, prior to his trade.

Which isn't to say I object, particularly.

With respect to Kunitz not being happy or waning, he's not the first to the table on that one. That started about 10 weeks ago.

 

[Rocket of Russia]

Listening to Madden...Kunitz is gone. I don't know if this Jagr stuff is BS or not, but I'd bet money Kunitz is not in camp this fall.

There's a full court press of "I've heard that Chris Kunitz doesn't like babies."

This isn't Madden talking out of his ass; it's the Pens' PR apparatus talking through him. Turn the casual fan against 14 so it doesn't look like you've traded him out of nowhere to the guy who thinks Adams is a critical part of the Pens PK.

Pirates did this when they didn't want to sign Burnett, Pens did the same thing with Neal, as well, prior to his trade.

Which isn't to say I object, particularly.

If this is the case (which I don't particularly feel strongly about one way or another) it is alarming that they would care more about softening the PR blow of trading a player vs. getting the maximum return - something that isn't given to guys that are "problems" in the locker room or are "unhappy."

 

[AjaxTelamon]

If this is the case (which I don't particularly feel strongly about one way or another) it is alarming that they would care more about softening the PR blow of trading a player vs. getting the maximum return - something that isn't given to guys that are "problems" in the locker room or are "unhappy."

It's not just about general goodwill towards the team, it's about selling tickets and jerseys and beer. You don't think the team, with Morehouse, isn't concerned about keeping their attendance numbers up? Classic political move to get the media working for you. I'm fine with it.