Phoenix LXXX: Is there another way out?

[GF]

And how can the BOG agree to have a team get maximum revenue sharing for 5 years gauratee? That's money other troubled franchise can't have.

How is this messs made whole, as Bettman promised, when the buyer is 130m$ short? And the worst is that the NHL is financing the sale with no interests AND from the NHL revenue sharing fund?????!!!

Hello?? Is there a pilot on board? This is ludicrous.

 

[Killion]

The Jamison deal went south because Greg only came up with $7M of equity. Now RSE and Gosbee have a little more equity, but it's not going to work.

$7M? Thats it thats all?! I hadnt heard that figure before, but ya, if essentially this deal is similar to the one reported by Forbes, no chance, no hope. Thats incredible. That over a year thats all he was able to secure... and I agree, without Glendale doubling down on the AMF, forget it. I'd be shocked that the BOG's would even approve it even if Glendale complied.

What is the penalty from NBC to the NHL if they leave Phoenix? Is it more or less than what they are losing annually by staying (I would guess less)? Would the new Canadian TV deal make up that difference if the Coyotes are moved to Quebec City?

We were all wondering about this 2yrs ago as well when Atlanta was sold to Winnipeg, that perhaps a penalty or discount would be incurred. I believe then as is likely the case now that its moot. The Winter Classics', the league now suggesting there will be more of those likely "make-up" for that loss & Phoenix, as both markets BBM's were/are abysmal as they sit, historically, NBC when first signing on paying more for the "potential" than the past or present. They get their ratings from the Rust Belt, Mid-West, during the Playoffs.

No press conferences scheduled for today eh?
hmm, very uneventful.

Supposedly meetings scheduled for next week between RSE & Glendale. If so, then todays May 31st date as being important, that the league will or would quite possibly make a late afternoon announcement that "we tried, just no way, opening talks to relocation" seems less likely to occur. On Tuesday they also said they'd "have no further comment, now up to Renaissance & Glendale". Bears keeping an eye on though. They just might send out a release to that affect, perhaps not quite so definitive, more "time is running out, we have to now consider all options", ramping up pressure on Glendale while simultaneously covering themselves as per their statement in BK Court that it was logistically impossible to move a team after May 31st.

 

[cbcwpg]

^^^----

Well, Bettman has always been quoted as saying there is no deadline, so I guess the CoG is going to test that to see if it's true.

If there is no announcement today, then the CoG is one step closer to delaying relocation.

 

[Whileee]

It occurs to me that the contours of this deal, and the fact that the NHL seems to be open to this approach, gives off a strong whiff of desperation on the part of the NHL.

I have a hunch that the NHL is snookered on this. For some reason, they don't seem to think that they have a palatable relocation alternative, so they are willing to allow just about any solution in Glendale.

For once, it would seem that Glendale has all the leverage with the NHL. Perhaps they should be thinking along the lines of taking the best deal they can get, either from the RSE group or another bidder for the arena management contract. If they get a good bid from another group, they could just tell the NHL that they have an arena manager and if the NHL wants the Coyotes to play in the Jobing.com, they'll have to work out an arrangement with them. If RSE is willing to manage the Jobing.com under favorable parameters for the COG, they would consider it.

If the NHL doesn't have another option for next year, there's nothing much to lose for the COG, and they have some ground to make up for the financial carnage that the NHL has inflicted on them in the previous couple of years.

 

[Nordskull]

Now, to add some timeframe juice in the discussion.

I kept a tweet featuring Tindall, june 7th 2012

Remember, its not recent, its june 2012

Lisa Halverstadt‏@LisaHalverstadt

#Glendale City Attorney Craig Tindall told me the city is facing a deadline from the NHL: Get a deal done soon or #Coyotes may move.

So I suppose they have time left to make some sort of deal with CoG, if the said CoG is still on first line.

 

[nelina]

^^^----

Well, Bettman has always been quoted as saying there is no deadline, so I guess the CoG is going to test that to see if it's true.

If there is no announcement today, then the CoG is one step closer to delaying relocation.

Maybe no fixed date deadline but Daly said ''expeditiously''. Pretty sure we'll get something to eat by the end of the day.

 

[Killion]

Why Seattle's Hansen is not buying the team himself?

He has absolutely no interest whatsoever in owning an NHL franchise himself, no indication that he'd even entertain a minority stake, but would welcome a franchise as a paying tenant as it would trigger a clause in the arena financing mechanisms with an $80M injection from the public trough. Without an NHL franchisee managing the building & controlling all revenue streams, right up the creek. Don Levin has expressed serious interest, but even he was working a parallel track in Bellevue, looking to build an NHL specific building that unfortunately didnt pan out. When asked why he didnt just simply enjoin efforts with Hansen, he claimed he hadnt been approached, didnt approach them, was willing to discuss it, act as a "consultant", whatever that meant.

I was listening to a show last week, maybe Hockey Central. And they were talking about how the Portland WinterHawks made the Memorial Cup and were owned by a billionaire. Some media member asked him if with his money he'd ever like to own an NHL team and he said yes, he loved to. Someone then asked him if he'd like to own an NHL team in Portland and he bluntly said "no".

Ya, Bill Gallacher. Calgary based oil magnate. Was looking at the Coyotes, Dallas, elsewhere reputedly. Owns the Winter Hawks who play out of the Memorial Gardens in Portland and usually a few games a year in the Rose Garden. The only way that market works is if Paul Allen is fully engaged as an owner. He employs several ex-NHL franchise executives so its possible they might have some influence on him in breaking his thus far resistance to entertaining the notion. Thats just Gallacher spouting off, as "no" it wouldnt work for him, again like Seattle or anywhere else where the NHL franchise doesnt control the building, impracticable.

I'm still convinced that the NHL "Loan" is an earmarked figure of 5 years worth of the Coyotes Revenue Sharing allocation/IGF. Be it advanced or in installments. They won't be paying it back. Again, my opinion.

Would just have to be I'd think. How else could Gary Bettman sell it to the BOG's? And that in & of itself is troubling. What kind of confidence does that show in RSE, the market, appearing a clear shot straight out of town in 4-5yrs regardless. The whole thing, the entire deal just reeks.

 

[Nordskull]

Timeframe on the RFP's decision

http://www.glendaleaz.com/purchasing/documents/RFPTentativeTimeline052413.pdf

 

[Killion]

I have a hunch that the NHL is snookered on this. For some reason, they don't seem to think that they have a palatable relocation alternative, so they are willing to allow just about any solution in Glendale.

Ya, certainly does smack of desperation Whileee. But how could this be? That they dont have a "palatable relocation alternative"? Thats just patently false, so obviously something somewhere's gone down or is going down thats forced them into a corner. Just no idea what that might be. On every level Quebec is a more than attractive market. Its just not adding up. Ive speculated it might have something to do with the Molsons, Desmarais & Bell, but honestly, though not entirely far fetched, I doubt their digging their heels in with blow back, nor can I imagine PKP would be playing absolute hardball with Bettman. I mean, is the entire play with RSE merely the leagues exit strategy or what? Impossible not to build conspiracy theories based on whats transpired, whats going on. Its just crazy.

 

[Ugmo]

Ya, certainly does smack of desperation Whileee. But how could this be? That they dont have a "palatable relocation alternative"? Thats just patently false, so obviously something somewhere's gone down or is going down thats forced them into a corner. Just no idea what that might be. On every level Quebec is a more than attractive market. Its just not adding up. Ive speculated it might have something to do with the Molsons, Desmarais & Bell, but honestly, though not entirely far fetched, I doubt their digging their heels in with blow back, nor can I imagine PKP would be playing absolute hardball with Bettman. I mean, is the entire play with RSE merely the leagues exit strategy or what? Impossible not to build conspiracy theories based on whats transpired, whats going on. Its just crazy.

Maybe Bettman doesn't consider QC to be palatable? Not that that would make sense.

I wonder if the plan all along has been expansion to QC and Seattle when the arenas are on line. Thus GB doesn't want to relocate to QC yet because that would take an expansion market out of the running.

 

[nelina]

Pastor's comments on terms of RSE deal:

Darin Pastor, the California businessman, whose first offer for the team was rejected by the NHL, was offering to pay up to $277 million for the Coyotes and was asking for no more than $8 million from the City of Glendale to run Jobing.com Arena.
He was surprised at the reported terms for the purchase of the team.
“As I understand through the media, the league has chosen RSE’s proposal,†Pastor wrote via email. “After reviewing what has been reported about this proposal, I believe my offer supplies superior benefits for all parties concerned.â€

 

[Ugmo]

Pastor's comments on terms of RSE deal:

Darin Pastor, the California businessman, whose first offer for the team was rejected by the NHL, was offering to pay up to $277 million for the Coyotes and was asking for no more than $8 million from the City of Glendale to run Jobing.com Arena.
He was surprised at the reported terms for the purchase of the team.
“As I understand through the media, the league has chosen RSE’s proposal,†Pastor wrote via email. “After reviewing what has been reported about this proposal, I believe my offer supplies superior benefits for all parties concerned.â€

I'm not a conspiracy guy, but it really makes you wonder if the NHL has set up a deal that is designed to fail.

 

[Slashers98]

I'm not a conspiracy guy, but it really makes you wonder if the NHL has set up a deal that is designed to fail.

That's also my theory Ugmo. Bettman is not that dumb to develop such a shady deal thinking it would work.

 

[CGG]

I'm not a conspiracy guy, but it really makes you wonder if the NHL has set up a deal that is designed to fail.

In fairness, if Pastor was willing to pay up to $277 million for the freakin' Phoenix Coyotes and take no more than $8 million a year in AMF, that deal was set up to fail miserably as well.

 

[Acesolid]

Pastor's comments on terms of RSE deal:

Darin Pastor, the California businessman, whose first offer for the team was rejected by the NHL, was offering to pay up to $277 million for the Coyotes and was asking for no more than $8 million from the City of Glendale to run Jobing.com Arena.
He was surprised at the reported terms for the purchase of the team.
“As I understand through the media, the league has chosen RSE’s proposal,†Pastor wrote via email. “After reviewing what has been reported about this proposal, I believe my offer supplies superior benefits for all parties concerned.â€

You know what's the weirdest thing?, If the reported Renaissance ''deal'' is true, he's pretty much right!

Also, everyone raising the alarm that the team will not relocate and the nhl hates qc/pkp, don't.

There is still the break before the finals that could serve to decide on relocation. It's far from over!

 

[madhi19]

Maybe Bettman doesn't consider QC to be palatable? Not that that would make sense.

I wonder if the plan all along has been expansion to QC and Seattle when the arenas are on line. Thus GB doesn't want to relocate to QC yet because that would take an expansion market out of the running.

I come back to the theory that it Atlanta all over again. They got another fire burning somewhere else and if the Yotes get sold to RSE they relocate the other problem child or the other way around.

 

[King_Stannis]

How is this messs made whole, as Bettman promised, when the buyer is 130m$ short? And the worst is that the NHL is financing the sale with no interests AND from the NHL revenue sharing fund?????!!!...

I'm pretty sure from a tax perspective the NHL will have to impute interest income even if they don't "charge" any to RSE. The government is smart enough to know the power of "interest free loans" and how they can be abused in a multitude of ways, so they will make them impute interest income which will have to have federal corporate income tax paid on it.

 

[cbcwpg]

Pastor's comments on terms of RSE deal:

Darin Pastor, the California businessman, whose first offer for the team was rejected by the NHL, was offering to pay up to $277 million for the Coyotes and was asking for no more than $8 million from the City of Glendale to run Jobing.com Arena.
He was surprised at the reported terms for the purchase of the team.
“As I understand through the media, the league has chosen RSE’s proposal,” Pastor wrote via email. “After reviewing what has been reported about this proposal, I believe my offer supplies superior benefits for all parties concerned.”

Exactly what I expected Pastor to say, but Pastor's problem is that he shouldn't be telling us this and not in a public forum. He should be telling Bettman this. But with the NHL classifying him person-non-Grata, I guess a public forum let's him get some steam off. Won't help his cause at all.

 

[nelina]

I'm not a conspiracy guy, but it really makes you wonder if the NHL has set up a deal that is designed to fail.

My feeling too. The call from CoG to explore other options to run the arena was the point of no return for GB.

 

[Nordskull]

Exactly what I expected Pastor to say, but Pastor's problem is that he shouldn't be telling us this and not in a public forum. He should be telling Bettman this. But with the NHL classifying him person-non-Grata, I guess a public forum let's him get some steam off. Won't help his cause at all.

Well, yes, but still, everybody is talking about him .... FOR FREE..

I "beleve" ;-) he never wanted the team. He want visibility for him and his society. Who would begin with advertising titles like "Darin Pastor plans buy the NHL Phoenix Coyotes" on wide digital screens in Las Vegas and Time Square?

Pure non sense.

 

[madhi19]

*Hockey Central At Noon revealed that RSE does not have an out close to flip the team after five years. What the NHL will be doing is take it back and pay them $40 million. Are these fools just renting a team for a million a year? loll This is so dysfunctional I don't really know where to start.

*Take it with more than a grain of salt.

 

[CasualFan]

If they get a good bid from another group, they could just tell the NHL that they have an arena manager and if the NHL wants the Coyotes to play in the Jobing.com, they'll have to work out an arrangement with them.

It appears from the budget, financial policies, and statements from Bowers, that's precisely what the city is preparing to do.

For now, Glendale finance officials are comfortable with the $6 million-a-year figure, said interim City Manager Dick Bowers. "Our estimate, based on audited statements and reviews, we believe that's in the neighborhood of what it would take."​

Bowers comfort with the $6MM is one of the key components of this matter. As the acting City Manager within the manager-council governance structure, the NHLs ability to advance a lease concept is dependent upon convincing Bowers that it's an equitable proposition for the city.

That is quite a difference from the Beasley administration that was willing to blatantly misrepresent the economic impact of the team then provide a massive operational subsidy based on a fallacious forecasts by Thomas L. Now, Gary and Bill might actually to have to come up with something that benefits the city. Or I guess they could have another conniption about how "silly" the RFP process is. I mean, the nerve of this new city administration. How dare they solicit options for their facility that might actually be profitable.

 

[King_Stannis]

It appears from the budget, financial policies, and statements from Bowers, that's precisely what the city is preparing to do.

For now, Glendale finance officials are comfortable with the $6 million-a-year figure, said interim City Manager Dick Bowers. "Our estimate, based on audited statements and reviews, we believe that's in the neighborhood of what it would take."​

Bowers comfort with the $6MM is one of the key components of this matter. As the acting City Manager within the manager-council governance structure, the NHLs ability to advance a lease concept is dependent upon convincing Bowers that it's an equitable proposition for the city.

That is quite a difference from the Beasley administration that was willing to blatantly misrepresent the economic impact of the team then provide a massive operational subsidy based on a fallacious forecasts by Thomas L. Now, Gary and Bill might actually to have to come up with something that benefits the city. Or I guess they could have another conniption about how "silly" the RFP process is. I mean, the nerve of this new city administration. How dare they solicit options for their facility that might actually be profitable.

Don't feel too bad for CoG. Instead of $50 million in the hole they could have received that amount from Balsillie. They didn't even consider siding with him for a second. Instead they helped out their friends in the NHL... Who quickly showed them that no good deed goes unpunished.

 

[Ugmo]

In fairness, if Pastor was willing to pay up to $277 million for the freakin' Phoenix Coyotes and take no more than $8 million a year in AMF, that deal was set up to fail miserably as well.

Well it would eventually have failed for him, but at least he could possibly have gotten the deal done in the first place.

Exactly what I expected Pastor to say, but Pastor's problem is that he shouldn't be telling us this and not in a public forum. He should be telling Bettman this. But with the NHL classifying him person-non-Grata, I guess a public forum let's him get some steam off. Won't help his cause at all.

If you take this most recently announced deal at face value, it reeks of desperation. And if the NHL is that desperate, they can't afford to be not calling back a guy who supposedly offered 277 million and a remotely plausible arena management fee.

 

[Killion]

*Hockey Central At Noon revealed that RSE does not have an out close to flip the team after five years. What the NHL will be doing is take it back and pay them $40 million. Are these fools just renting a team for a million a year? loll This is so dysfunctional I don't really know where to start.

*Take it with more than a grain of salt.

Ya, a salt block. If its even remotely true & it does make sense in blocking a flip off-market, insuring league control, then their truly desperate. This is getting crazier by the day.