Rumor: Philadelphia wanted a 1st rounder, or specific prospect to take Joseph from Ottawa

[GeeoffBrown]

How is such a mediocre team this tight to the cap?

I think the main thing is they have a lot of dead cap space from buy outs/salary retention

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Sens fans will never learn not to jump the gun. So many instances in the last few years.

I'll give you props if this opinion of Joseph/Philly is true 30 games from now.

There are lots of us who have been saying we shouldn’t trade Joseph all summer.

 

[wankstifier]

His s% is nearly 30%, but even when he cools down, I don't understand why a team would have to pay to get rid of him.

 

[dirtydanglez]

His s% is nearly 30%, but even when he cools down, I don't understand why a team would have to pay to get rid of him.

other teams have leverage over the sens right now. if another team desperately needs a forward, or ottawa clears space another way, or pinto caves, etc then that leverage goes away and joseph has more value.

 

[SpezDispenser]

other teams have leverage over the sens right now. if another team desperately needs a forward, or ottawa clears space another way, or pinto caves, etc then that leverage goes away and joseph has more value.

I think philly leveraged themselves out of a good player and a 2nd round pick.

There are lots of us who have been saying we shouldn’t trade Joseph all summer.

Absolutely.

 

[dirtydanglez]

I think philly leveraged themselves out of a good player and a 2nd round pick.

that's possible and remains to be seen but that's still cap space philly can use on another player for the next 2 years. if they really want a 2nd round pick i think they could get one taking a cap dump or eating salary at the deadline.

 

[SpezDispenser]

that's possible and remains to be seen but that's still cap space philly can use on another player for the next 2 years. if they really want a 2nd round pick i think they could get one taking a cap dump or eating salary at the deadline.

This would have been the one. A cap dump who is quite good plus a 2nd. It's too late now though, I would guess they'll try to move Kubalik and use Greig as his replacement.

 

[dirtydanglez]

This would have been the one. A cap dump who is quite good plus a 2nd. It's too late now though, I would guess they'll try to move Kubalik and use Greig as his replacement.

i dont think it's too late for philly. they have $3m that isn't tied up another 2 seasons and if they really want draft picks there will be other contracts to eat. with so many teams tight against the cap there will be a lot of demand for cap space at the trade deadline.

joseph is a decent player but doesn't change much for philly.

 

[SpezDispenser]

i dont think it's too late for philly. they have $3m that isn't tied up another 2 seasons and if they really want draft picks there will be other contracts to eat. with so many teams tight against the cap there will be a lot of demand for cap space at the trade deadline.

joseph is a decent player but doesn't change much for philly.

It's not that, it's that he's a cap dump and a good player. The rare double whammy.

 

[dirtydanglez]

It's not that, it's that he's a cap dump and a good player. The rare double whammy.

its convenient to get both at once but they can still eat salary this deadline and get some picks and still use that $3m in the offseason on a player they like.

at the end of the day this trade doesn't change much for philly. they are still likely a bottom feeder and adding joseph probably gets them a worse draft pick. it's not like they can flip joseph either since they still face most of the same problems as the sens currently do.

 

[Golden_Jet]

i dont think it's too late for philly. they have $3m that isn't tied up another 2 seasons and if they really want draft picks there will be other contracts to eat. with so many teams tight against the cap there will be a lot of demand for cap space at the trade deadline.

joseph is a decent player but doesn't change much for philly.

Philly got a sixth round pick for retaining 3.5 million a year for 3 years of Kevin Hayes.

 

[dirtydanglez]

Philly got a sixth round pick for retaining 3.5 million a year for 3 years of Kevin Hayes.

they weren't the middle man. they were trying to dump their own negative asset.

 

[Golden_Jet]

they weren't the middle man. they were trying to dump their own negative asset.

Ya the Blues gave a sixth rounder for a team retaining 10.5 million.
Ottawa won’t need to sweeten then with a first or second.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Ya the Blues gave a sixth rounder for a team retaining 10.5 million.
Ottawa won’t need to sweeten then with a first or second.

Eh, that doesnt really factor in. Blues gave a 6th for Hayes at $3.5m (or whatever it was). It only tracks if you think Joseph is an equally desirable player as Hayes, and even then cap space was a lot less sparse when that trade went down

 

[dirtydanglez]

Ya the Blues gave a sixth rounder for a team retaining 10.5 million.
Ottawa won’t need to sweeten then with a first or second.

different scenario all together. philly retained to offload their own negative asset which is different than playing the middle man with cap space. also this trade happened in the offseason where prices are usually the lowest. its different at the deadline when the value of cap space is at the highest.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Eh, that doesnt really factor in. Blues gave a 6th for Hayes at $3.5m (or whatever it was). It only tracks if you think Joseph is an equally desirable player as Hayes, and even then cap space was a lot less sparse when that trade went down

3.57 > 2.95 ,
only tracks as you say if you think a sixth was fair.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

3.57 > 2.95 ,
only tracks as you say if you think a sixth was fair.

The argument is Hayes>Joseph (or more valuable, especially considering circumstance)

 

[Golden_Jet]

The argument is Hayes>Joseph (or more valuable, especially considering circumstance)

You still need to pay Hayes another 3.5 million. Regardless.
The whole point was, Ottawa won’t need to sweeten with a first or second, it would be less.

 

[Deas]

How is such a mediocre team this tight to the cap?

Their long term cap situation is tremendous. They're up against the cap because their young star core has gotten their main deals already without bridges. With the cap rising and their rentals plus buy outs being gone as cap hits after this year already they'll have a chance to get even better depth around their relatively big core in the coming years.

Very short term they should've signed Pinto before Kubalik, but I'm sure it's worked out eventually.

 

[Curufinwe]

I think the main thing is they have a lot of dead cap space from buy outs/salary retention

I think that maybe they could have waited and squeezed Tarasenko down some more.

 

[TkachukNorris79]

Sens fans will never learn not to jump the gun. So many instances in the last few years.

I'll give you props if this opinion of Joseph/Philly is true 30 games from now.

I agree with this for the most part, except this isn't really the case for Joseph. I'm happy that he's a p/g guy right now, but it isn't really all about production. The issue with this team last year was not putting pucks in other teams' nets, but rather keeping it out of their own.

Sure we lost DeBrincat but his offence is easily replaced by Norris if he can stay healthy, and if not, Tarasenko should be able to hit 27ish goals.

You could tell me that Kubalik will score 20 more points than Joseph and I'd still take Joseph for this team at this moment.

But yeah us sens fans always show up for "On Pace" szn

 

[Rebels57]

It's not that, it's that he's a cap dump and a good player. The rare double whammy.

He doesn't move the needle for the Flyers at all. They have a whole roster of players in the Joseph tier. They have no need to add another one while doing another team a favor unless their price is met.

 

[SpezDispenser]

He doesn't move the needle for the Flyers at all. They have a whole roster of players in the Joseph tier. They have no need to add another one while doing another team a favor unless their price is met.

I don't really know why he wouldn't move the needle for the Flyers, he's a good forward and he would have come with a 2nd rounder.

But, I couldn't care less at this point, because there's now way Ottawa moves him, let alone with a 1st attached.

 

[Nakawick]

A 1st rounder? Lol, Ottawa tells Philly go take a long walk off a short pier.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

I agree with this for the most part, except this isn't really the case for Joseph. I'm happy that he's a p/g guy right now, but it isn't really all about production. The issue with this team last year was not putting pucks in other teams' nets, but rather keeping it out of their own.

Sure we lost DeBrincat but his offence is easily replaced by Norris if he can stay healthy, and if not, Tarasenko should be able to hit 27ish goals.

You could tell me that Kubalik will score 20 more points than Joseph and I'd still take Joseph for this team at this moment.

But yeah us sens fans always show up for "On Pace" szn

I like Joseph too. I love Pinto. I am not really sure what the solution is, moving Kubalik now feels kind of bad.