Rumor: Philadelphia wanted a 1st rounder, or specific prospect to take Joseph from Ottawa

[Sun God Nika]

Current cap space to sign Pinto: 0.807
Trade Brannstrom for future considerations: +2.000 (2.807)
Waive Joseph: +1.150 (3.957)
Sign Bailey to replace Joseph: -0.750 (3.207)
Call-up Kleven to replace Brannstrom: -0.917 (2.290)
Sign Pinto: -2.275 (0.015)

View attachment 747132

If Philly doesn't want to be reasonable - the Sens aren't entirely screwed. Brannstrom shouldn't be hard to move if that's what it comes to.

Really just depends if Dorion would rather lose Brannstrom, or whatever it costs to move Joseph.

Here's a list of some guys coming off their ELC who had similar production to Pinto, and what they signed for in today's money. IM) the Sens should be able to sign him for 1yr if the number starts with 2.

	Drafted	g	P	P/GP	Signed (2023 money)
Shane Pinto	32nd Overall	20	35	0.43
Niclas Bergfors	23rd Overall	21	44	0.54	$1,269,200 x 1yrs
Mark Jankowski	21st Overall	17	25	0.35	$1,761,850 x 2yrs
Jason Pominville	55th Overall	18	30	0.53	$1,962,250 x 3yrs
R.J. Umberger	16th Overall	20	38	0.52	$2,179,350 x 2yrs
Connor Brown	156th Overall	20	36	0.44	$2,338,000 x 3yrs
Denis Gurianov	12th Overall	20	29	0.45	$2,613,550 x 2yrs
Chris Kreider	19th Overall	17	37	0.56	$2,997,650 x 2yrs
Brad Marchand	71st Overall	21	41	0.53	$3,248,150 x 2yrs

league min is 775k now.

 

[ottawah]

I know I'm in the minority, but I'd take take Joseph with a 2025 and prospect Stephen Halliday.

I think Joseph is underrated now because of his contract and his 4 goals last year.

Guy has speed for days, can score, pk, play a physical game and be a pest at times. Easily worth getting paid to take him imo.

If you can get more, so be it.

I'd not argue he is competent defensively, but overall the offense last year was very indicative of his career. Take out a small sampling size with Ottawa and his PPG over his career is .37/.19/.34/.31/.32 (first year to last). What you saw last year is pretty much what to expect moving forward.

His usage and effectiveness is on par with the likes of Motte, Gambrell, Brown and Kelly. i.e. league minimum players. They are a dime a dozen. Not his fault he got overpaid, parlaying a career streak over 11 game to that contract. But with the NHL game right now where speed and skill is on near equal footing with contract value, bad contracts are a luxury few teams can afford. And in all fairness, every team likely has one or two they want a do-over on.

Barring some catastrophic injury by a higher paid sens player in the next few games, there does not seem to be an option at this point than to pay the price to trade Joseph. I firmly believe we need Pinto in there to have the best chance to make the playoffs.

 

[RayMartyniukTotems]

Ottawa isn't going to trade Joseph

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

I'd not argue he is competent defensively, but overall the offense last year was very indicative of his career. Take out a small sampling size with Ottawa and his PPG over his career is .37/.19/.34/.31/.32 (first year to last). What you saw last year is pretty much what to expect moving forward.

His usage and effectiveness is on par with the likes of Motte, Gambrell, Brown and Kelly. i.e. league minimum players. They are a dime a dozen. Not his fault he got overpaid, parlaying a career streak over 11 game to that contract. But with the NHL game right now where speed and skill is on near equal footing with contract value, bad contracts are a luxury few teams can afford. And in all fairness, every team likely has one or two they want a do-over on.

Barring some catastrophic injury by a higher paid sens player in the next few games, there does not seem to be an option at this point than to pay the price to trade Joseph. I firmly believe we need Pinto in there to have the best chance to make the playoffs.

Ottawa is a deeper team than Montreal.

Maybe not right off the bat, but after the deadline, or if they're still injury prone as f***, Joseph could be getting regular pp time in Montreal with players likely traded, while in Ottawa he wouldn't even sniff the pp unless Ottawa is in some serious injury trouble.

Habs could inflate his value this year and some of next year and potentially move him for a net gain like a 3rd, or 4th and something

 

[KevinRedkey]

league min is 775k now.

Ok - I edited the small variance. Thanks for pointing it out.

 

[HuGort]

If Habs can get a first I would do it. But nothing less. We have enough bad contracts now

 

[misplacedsensfan]

Ottawa doesn’t need to make a move. I bet a 1 y 1.6 m offer is on the table for pinto. They can then run with 20 man roster. Someone will eventually go on LTIR then they can go with a 22 man roster. They play mostly at home until the middle of December and Belleville is not far away if we need an emergency call up.

If Pinto doesn’t accept that contract they can plug Greig in that 3rd line C spot. It should be a pretty good line with Kubalik and Joseph on the wings. Pinto will eventually see he has no leverage right now and it may only reduce his future earnings by missing time.

 

[TBF1972]

I didn't quote you... I wasn't even talking to you I responded to another poster about it being Thomson and Boucher. What are you talking about?..... Speaking of reading comprehension... Yikes.


Yes it does. As long as they get Pinto on a one year deal at 1.8 or less. You should probably listen to the 32 thoughts podcast where actual professionals are talking about it.

You're likely listening to too many posters that are sens haters and are wishful thinking this situation into something it's not.

wishful thinking is the key word.

if pinto was willing to sign a 1yr x 1.8m contract those transactions were all done. so it is more a long the lines the sens focing pinto to accept such an offer. at the end pinto might sign that contract. but it could impact future contract talks.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

wishful thinking is the key word.

if pinto was willing to sign a 1yr x 1.8m contract those transactions were all done. so it is more a long the lines the sens focing pinto to accept such an offer. at the end pinto might sign that contract. but it could impact future contract talks.

It's possible that we are trying to make enough room to sign him to a multi-year deal. In a perfect world - say, if we didn't have any dead cap - that's almost certainly where Ottawa would be trying to push things. Are we willing to part with a 1st & Joseph in order to make that happen? My guess is no. But I wouldnt assume that just because a 1yr deal under/around $2mil isn't done, that it isn't something that both sides would eventually agree to.

 

[Junohockeyfan]

Ottawa is a deeper team than Montreal.

Maybe not right off the bat, but after the deadline, or if they're still injury prone as f***, Joseph could be getting regular pp time in Montreal with players likely traded, while in Ottawa he wouldn't even sniff the pp unless Ottawa is in some serious injury trouble.

Habs could inflate his value this year and some of next year and potentially move him for a net gain like a 3rd, or 4th and something

What are you paying the Habs to take him? 1st?

 

[SpezDispenser]

I think he'll end up taking a 1.6ish one year contact, then steve staios and dorion will assure him of a multi year with a slight bump to make up for it to be signed jan 1st.

Joseph is very important to Ottawa. He has speed to burn and keeps these so-called power penalty kills good and honest. Brannstrom is excellent depth.

 

[bert]

wishful thinking is the key word.

if pinto was willing to sign a 1yr x 1.8m contract those transactions were all done. so it is more a long the lines the sens focing pinto to accept such an offer. at the end pinto might sign that contract. but it could impact future contract talks.

It's market value. Literally what frost is making this year who outscored Pinto substantially. You dont know whats been offered what he acceepted or hasnt. It gets him to arb rights too.

Wishful thinking is all the b.s about the sens having to trade multiple assets to dump a useful player. Same usual suspects.

Offering 1.8 million on a one year deal would have no 'future impacts' you're moving the goal posts and making up fake scenarios to try and save your argument.

What are you paying the Habs to take him? 1st?

Absolutely not.

I'd not argue he is competent defensively, but overall the offense last year was very indicative of his career. Take out a small sampling size with Ottawa and his PPG over his career is .37/.19/.34/.31/.32 (first year to last). What you saw last year is pretty much what to expect moving forward.

His usage and effectiveness is on par with the likes of Motte, Gambrell, Brown and Kelly. i.e. league minimum players. They are a dime a dozen. Not his fault he got overpaid, parlaying a career streak over 11 game to that contract. But with the NHL game right now where speed and skill is on near equal footing with contract value, bad contracts are a luxury few teams can afford. And in all fairness, every team likely has one or two they want a do-over on.

Barring some catastrophic injury by a higher paid sens player in the next few games, there does not seem to be an option at this point than to pay the price to trade Joseph. I firmly believe we need Pinto in there to have the best chance to make the playoffs.

He's a way better player than Motte, Brown and kelly, Gambrell etc. Try again. That argument is awful. Another reach

 

[BargainBinSpecial]

If Habs can get a first I would do it. But nothing less. We have enough bad contracts now

HuGo cleaned a lot of the mess. It's mostly the fact that he added some 6 M$ to the payroll to do it. Either than Armia, Gallagher, Anderson, Allen and Price, the other contracts are fair value. Wideman is sent down. Anderson can still play on the top 6 and Pearson can go on LTIR for a yr. The Habs can theoretically take on Joseph with a first, by placing Price on LTIR.

 

[CanuckistanFlyerfan]

Come on, Ottawa can afford to send the Flyers a draft pick or two.....I'm pretty sure Chuck Fletcher gave every team in the league draft picks for basically nothing during his 5 year reign of terror in Philly!

 

[bert]

Come on, Ottawa can afford to send the Flyers a draft pick or two.....I'm pretty sure Chuck Fletcher gave every team in the league draft picks for basically nothing during his 5 year reign of terror in Philly!

Except the sens. Time to do us a favor. What about Branntsrom for a 3rd rounder?

 

[CanuckistanFlyerfan]

Except the sens. Time to do us a favor. What about Branntsrom for a 3rd rounder?

Chuckie doesn't live here anymore.

 

[captainpaxil]

I was hearing Boucher and Greg because of familiar connections. The flyers are absolutely an old boys club like that

 

[xVolchenkov]

I was hearing Boucher and Greg because of familiar connections. The flyers are absolutely an old boys club like that

0 chance Ottawa gives up Greig to dump Joseph. Come on man.

 

[pooch]

Except the sens. Time to do us a favor. What about Branntsrom for a 3rd rounder?

Well....he did let Giroux walk.

 

[swiftwin]

What are you paying the Habs to take him? 1st?

Future considerations. Take it or leave it.

 

[Junohockeyfan]

Future considerations. Take it or leave it.

Leave it. No interest unless a 1st is coming with him.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I was hearing Boucher and Greg because of familiar connections. The flyers are absolutely an old boys club like that

No you weren't hearing that

 

[Maurice of Orange]

Danny Briere doing some heavy scouting of the Senators organization this weekend as he attended the Flyers-Sens game in Ottawa and Briere was also in attendance today (Sunday) up in Allentown as the Belleville Senators were in the Lehigh Valley to play the Phantoms.

Kleven looks to be of interest but not sure if Dorian would part with Ottawa’s touted defensive prospect.

 

[xVolchenkov]

Danny Briere doing some heavy scouting of the Senators organization this weekend as he attended the Flyers-Sens game in Ottawa and Briere was also in attendance today (Sunday) up in Allentown as the Belleville Senators were in the Lehigh Valley to play the Phantoms.

Kleven looks to be of interest but not sure if Dorian would part with Ottawa’s touted defensive prospect.

Not going to happen. Pierre Dorian LOVES Kleven.

 

[KevinRedkey]

Danny Briere doing some heavy scouting of the Senators organization this weekend as he attended the Flyers-Sens game in Ottawa and Briere was also in attendance today (Sunday) up in Allentown as the Belleville Senators were in the Lehigh Valley to play the Phantoms.

Kleven looks to be of interest but not sure if Dorian would part with Ottawa’s touted defensive prospect.

I really hope not, and i doubt it since Dorion apparently likes him. Though - it was reported Dorion also liked Sokolov too much to trade him to Arizona last year, and he just got waived - so we'll see I guess.

Hoping it's someone more like Jarventie. He has top-6 upside but is a little more boom-or-bust. Not a great fit for the Sens but could be a solid gamble for the Flyers.