Prospect Info: Phantoms (AHL), Reading Royals (ECHL), NCAA, Jrs., Int'l, etc. [The Fall 2022 Edition]

[Curufinwe]

Watched most of the LV game . 3 of our 4 goals were on the PP but 5 vs 5 we were out played . Charlette just takes stupid penalties .

Bellows was looking good, I assume.

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

A couple questions for u for guys I'm intrigued by....

How has Attard been doing??? Will there be a full time NHL future for him eventually?

Also same for Emil Andrae... How's his season in Europe so far for those that have seen him... I've just been hockeydb'ing both

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

A couple questions for u for guys I'm intrigued by....

How has Attard been doing??? Will there be a full time NHL future for him eventually?

Also same for Emil Andrae... How's his season in Europe so far for those that have seen him... I've just been hockeydb'ing both

Considering how much we stunned development of players like Provorov and Ghost I would venture to say nope. Only one doing well was Sanheim because they wrongly considered Gudas to be bottom pairing scrub and Sanheim has benefitted from having at least solid partner. Also there was period where he carried Provorov while playing on his off side which made it eventually clear he was out best dman overall.

Myers had more skill and talent than both Attard and Andrae, yet he wasn't able to overcome flyers lack of development system and establish himself as everyday NHL player either.

 

[deadhead]

It had nothing to do with development, Myers couldn't cut it in Nashville or TB, that's two years of coaching by "superior" franchises.

Attard will be fine, his problem was he was used as a "rover" in college and needs to focus on the fundamentals of playing defense. He is a solid skater with a howitzer shot.

Andrae is back in the SHL, but on a bad team, so stats won't tell the story, we need @Appleyard to fill us in.

 

[Appleyard]

It had nothing to do with development, Myers couldn't cut it in Nashville or TB, that's two years of coaching by "superior" franchises.

Attard will be fine, his problem was he was used as a "rover" in college and needs to focus on the fundamentals of playing defense. He is a solid skater with a howitzer shot.

Andrae is back in the SHL, but on a bad team, so stats won't tell the story, we need @Appleyard to fill us in.

Andrae has been immense really... and tbh 0.64 P/GP at 20 years old on D is pretty awesome... even better when consider that yeh, on a bad team.

 

[Beef Invictus]

It had nothing to do with development, Myers couldn't cut it in Nashville or TB, that's two years of coaching by "superior" franchises.

Attard will be fine, his problem was he was used as a "rover" in college and needs to focus on the fundamentals of playing defense. He is a solid skater with a howitzer shot.

Andrae is back in the SHL, but on a bad team, so stats won't tell the story, we need @Appleyard to fill us in.

It has been repeatedly pointed out that the Flyers' insistence on developing irrelevant traits while ignoring vital ones, for years, sets a player back for years. It's years of lost skill building. You don't fix that in a few practices. It may not even be fixable.

Development matters. Derailing prospects as the Flyers love to do is deeply damaging. All that time spent aimlessly lobbing pucks under Gordon was damaging.

The Flyers are trying to develop players to play in an era that doesn't exist anymore. And it's not limited to prospects. It's their focus for all players. It's why players regress here.

 

[wasup]

Bellows was looking good, I assume.

When I watch the Phantoms prospects the stat sheet means very little to me . I want to see someone who is pushing the pace and one who takes command of the ice . Lots of guys can produce at the AHL level but can't cut it at the NHL level and speed of the game is biggest reason .

Actually Bellows looked decent his lack of speed at the NHL is not noticeable at all down there , also noticed Attard doing some good things and Forester looked ok at times but blended to much . York and Desnoyers were not noticeable at all even though Desnoyers scored a pp goal .

Where is AA he has not played the last couple games ?

 

[Curufinwe]

He’s waiting for his NHL contract

 

[BringBackHakstol]

Flyers bubble wrapping him as their secret weapon

 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

It had nothing to do with development, Myers couldn't cut it in Nashville or TB, that's two years of coaching by "superior" franchises.

Attard will be fine, his problem was he was used as a "rover" in college and needs to focus on the fundamentals of playing defense. He is a solid skater with a howitzer shot.

Andrae is back in the SHL, but on a bad team, so stats won't tell the story, we need @Appleyard to fill us in.

It has everything to do with development. What did Myers learn in Lehigh Valley while he was there? He learned how to play pond hockey. Then he gets called up and what does Hakstol do? Hakstol continues the awesome development path of nonskill development and stick to not rushing the puck or carrying it past the blue line. Vigneault comes in and completely ruins Myers by basically forcing him to dump the puck and skate back, but then rush when there's a chance a play can be made, only for Myers to be hung out to dry when it basically results in a turn over.

And it's funny you don't mention what John Hynes said about Myers in Nashville. The issue with Myers is that there was zero skill development that was done with him. They basically had to teach Myers the basics all over again because all of that was neglected in Philadelphia.

Philadelphia is a black hole for development. How many people have been saying that and we're seeing the development path in Philadelphia. The 'development' path has ruined Provorov, is on the way to ruining Sanheim, has did a number on Frost, Allison, Patrick (let's not kid ourselves, the 2nd overall picked was rushed into the lineup to justify the draft spot and they developed him poorly), Laczynski, plus now we get to worry about whether or not Tuomaala ever comes to form. Big whip he's tearing up a nothing burger league in Finland. Look at the Flyers 'process' that they did to him. If it's taking him nearly a year to get over the awesome treatment and development path he received by the Flyers, imagine what Foerster, Wisdom, Lyksell, Gauthier, etc....are all going to experience.

Sorry, but Philadelphia is a black hole with regards to development. It's where prospects and goalies go to die, which funny enough, we're witnessing this franchise also decimate Carter Hart. \

The whole thing stinks and there's no justifying how they do things. And the fact you're calling out one player where there are tons over the past five to 10 years who have been ruined by Flyers development speaks in volumes.

 

[Beef Invictus]

It has everything to do with development. What did Myers learn in Lehigh Valley while he was there? He learned how to play pond hockey. Then he gets called up and what does Hakstol do? Hakstol continues the awesome development path of nonskill development and stick to not rushing the puck or carrying it past the blue line. Vigneault comes in and completely ruins Myers by basically forcing him to dump the puck and skate back, but then rush when there's a chance a play can be made, only for Myers to be hung out to dry when it basically results in a turn over.

And it's funny you don't mention what John Hynes said about Myers in Nashville. The issue with Myers is that there was zero skill development that was done with him. They basically had to teach Myers the basics all over again because all of that was neglected in Philadelphia.

Philadelphia is a black hole for development. How many people have been saying that and we're seeing the development path in Philadelphia. The 'development' path has ruined Provorov, is on the way to ruining Sanheim, has did a number on Frost, Allison, Patrick (let's not kid ourselves, the 2nd overall picked was rushed into the lineup to justify the draft spot and they developed him poorly), Laczynski, plus now we get to worry about whether or not Tuomaala ever comes to form. Big whip he's tearing up a nothing burger league in Finland. Look at the Flyers 'process' that they did to him. If it's taking him nearly a year to get over the awesome treatment and development path he received by the Flyers, imagine what Foerster, Wisdom, Lyksell, Gauthier, etc....are all going to experience.

Sorry, but Philadelphia is a black hole with regards to development. It's where prospects and goalies go to die, which funny enough, we're witnessing this franchise also decimate Carter Hart. \

The whole thing stinks and there's no justifying how they do things. And the fact you're calling out one player where there are tons over the past five to 10 years who have been ruined by Flyers development speaks in volumes.

He used to love pointing at Vorobyev, but he's gone silent on that front because it sure seems like he's gotten back on track. It took years for it to happen.

 

[mr4tno]

When I watch the Phantoms prospects the stat sheet means very little to me . I want to see someone who is pushing the pace and one who takes command of the ice . Lots of guys can produce at the AHL level but can't cut it at the NHL level and speed of the game is biggest reason .

Actually Bellows looked decent his lack of speed at the NHL is not noticeable at all down there , also noticed Attard doing some good things and Forester looked ok at times but blended to much . York and Desnoyers were not noticeable at all even though Desnoyers scored a pp goal .

Where is AA he has not played the last couple games ?

Hopefully he is back in Russia

 

[deadhead]

And it's funny you don't mention what John Hynes said about Myers in Nashville. The issue with Myers is that there was zero skill development that was done with him. They basically had to teach Myers the basics all over again because all of that was neglected in Philadelphia.

Funny, they spent a whole year teaching him then dumped him.
TB took on his cap hit then dumped him.
Maybe he's just a slow learner?

 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

Funny, they spent a whole year teaching him then dumped him.
TB took on his cap hit then dumped him.
Maybe he's just a slow learner?

I wouldn't call it being dumped. Nashville upgraded from Myers to McDonagh. That's a no brainer. A Stanley Cup winning defenseman that plays roughly 22 minutes per night and plays in difficult situations? Yeah, I think most sane people are making that move. And before you go off about McDonagh being 33, most defensemen play well into their late 30s/early 40s and are still effective.

As for Tampa Bay, this is the best franchise in the business when it comes to player development. The fact they couldn't fix him should let you know just how bad the Flyers screwed him up. It's not like Myers is a guy who's dumb or anything like that. This is a guy who was completely ruined by the 'development' process or lack of a process or no knowledge of what development is.

 

[deadhead]

I wouldn't call it being dumped. Nashville upgraded from Myers to McDonagh. That's a no brainer. A Stanley Cup winning defenseman that plays roughly 22 minutes per night and plays in difficult situations? Yeah, I think most sane people are making that move. And before you go off about McDonagh being 33, most defensemen play well into their late 30s/early 40s and are still effective.

As for Tampa Bay, this is the best franchise in the business when it comes to player development. The fact they couldn't fix him should let you know just how bad the Flyers screwed him up. It's not like Myers is a guy who's dumb or anything like that. This is a guy who was completely ruined by the 'development' process or lack of a process or no knowledge of what development is.

How do you know he was "ruined?" That's just the party line.

You'd think if the FLyers were ruining prospects, smarter organizations would be able to fix them, we've seen plenty of players go to new teams and shine - what Flyers have done so?

 

[Beef Invictus]

How do you know he was "ruined?" That's just the party line.

You'd think if the FLyers were ruining prospects, smarter organizations would be able to fix them, we've seen plenty of players go to new teams and shine - what Flyers have done so?

You would be hard pressed to find any other organization that actively damages their prospects and steers them in the exact opposite direction of what breeds success in the NHL more than the Flyers. That's the point. The Flyers do so much damage that getting over it is hard. It takes years of relearning how to play the game, and few players have the ability to come back from that.

It isn't a coincidence that an important common denominator for successful players is them deciding to just ignore the team and do what seems best to them.

 

[deadhead]

That's your unsubstantiated opinion, you offer no supporting evidence, so I can't take you seriously.

 

[04hockey]

You would be hard pressed to find any other organization that actively damages their prospects and steers them in the exact opposite direction of what breeds success in the NHL more than the Flyers. That's the point. The Flyers do so much damage that getting over it is hard. It takes years of relearning how to play the game, and few players have the ability to come back from that.

It isn't a coincidence that an important common denominator for successful players is them deciding to just ignore the team and do what seems best to them.

HUH ??
It's a f***ing game - "years to relearning how to play the game"
again
H-U-H ??
I'm calling the Cops AND Human resources

 

[Beef Invictus]

HUH ??
It's a f***ing game - "years to relearning how to play the game"
again
H-U-H ??
I'm calling the Cops AND Human resources

Did you know there's more to the game than knowing how to skate, handle a puck, and shoot? Thinking processes. Brain stuff. Stuff that needs to happen so fast it's instinct.

 

[Beef Invictus]

That's your unsubstantiated opinion, you offer no supporting evidence, so I can't take you seriously.

You've been given numerous examples over the years. You ignore them or find convoluted reasons to write them off so you can absolve the team of blame.

I'm not going to go through the effort of listing the examples and first-hand confirmations every time I post because you'll just ignore any aspect of reality inconvenient to the narrative you wish to be true.

 

[04hockey]

"Thinking processes. Brain stuff. Stuff that needs to happen so fast it's instinct."

yeah.....it comes NATURALLY.....a player either has it or doesn't

period .....now YOU'VE learned sumpin'

 

[Beef Invictus]

"Thinking processes. Brain stuff. Stuff that needs to happen so fast it's instinct."

yeah.....it comes NATURALLY.....a player either has it or doesn't

period .....now YOU'VE learned sumpin'

Except a lot of it doesn't. If you spend years focusing on ignoring certain plays in favor of dumping pucks, that becomes your instinct. That becomes "natural." On top of the atrophying of physical skills because the Flyers neglect those too.

 

[deadhead]

You've been given numerous examples over the years. You ignore them or find convoluted reasons to write them off so you can absolve the team of blame.

I'm not going to go through the effort of listing the examples and first-hand confirmations every time I post because you'll just ignore any aspect of reality inconvenient to the narrative you wish to be true.

All those "examples" were bullshit.

Every team "dumps" pucks, except for the few players who are talented enough to skate or pass it into the O-zone, it's a matter of degree, 40% of entries or 60% of entries.

Every team throws the pucks around the boards to exit the D-zone, again, a matter of degree, and again, that depends on talent. The pass up the middle is more dangerous and can quickly lead to goals for the other team if you don't see the ice and you're not an accurate passer.

If you want to play an aggressive offensive scheme, you need talented players with vision, speed, quickness and the eye to hand coordination to make tape to tape passes and beat goalies from 20'. If you don't have those players, the best strategy is dump and chase and get players to the front of the net to set screens and tip shots. If you don't have the speed to forecheck, the best strategy is the conservative "Hakshell" approach where you keep games close and hope you can score on an opponent's mistake.

If you play an aggressive offensive scheme without the players who can make it work, you're going to consistently turn over the puck in the neutral zone and get blown out of games on a regular basis.

 

[Beef Invictus]

All those "examples" were bullshit.

Every team "dumps" pucks, except for the few players who are talented enough to skate or pass it into the O-zone, it's a matter of degree, 40% of entries or 60% of entries.

Every team throws the pucks around the boards to exit the D-zone, again, a matter of degree, and again, that depends on talent. The pass up the middle is more dangerous and can quickly lead to goals for the other team if you don't see the ice and you're not an accurate passer.

If you want to play an aggressive offensive scheme, you need talented players with vision, speed, quickness and the eye to hand coordination to make tape to tape passes and beat goalies from 20'. If you don't have those players, the best strategy is dump and chase and get players to the front of the net to set screens and tip shots. If you don't have the speed to forecheck, the best strategy is the conservative "Hakshell" approach where you keep games close and hope you can score on an opponent's mistake.

If you play an aggressive offensive scheme without the players who can make it work, you're going to consistently turn over the puck in the neutral zone and get blown out of games on a regular basis.

Thanks for proving me right.

As for the rest of your post, numerous other teams manage to run far more aggressive, modern offenses without the talent and they're way more successful than the Flyers.

By the way, if the Flyers don't have the talent to even run a league-average offense, that means Fletcher has failed miserably and has definitely made more than one mistake.

 

[deadhead]

Thanks for proving me right.

As for the rest of your post, numerous other teams manage to run far more aggressive, modern offenses without the talent and they're way more successful than the Flyers.

By the way, if the Flyers don't have the talent to even run a league-average offense, that means Fletcher has failed miserably and has definitely made more than one mistake.

Like whom? You make blanket statements all the time without support.