Peter Holland

[The Winter Soldier]

Yeah, I just don't think that Bozak is any better defensively, that line has looked fine IMO in their own zone with Kadri, and getting more offensive zone time, best defensive is a good offense

Bozah is +5, PK regular, plus out there late with Kule, and Mcclement says otherwise.

While the Kadri line was only even against Chicago in a 7-3 win, -2 against St. Louis, -1 against LA, -2 against Boston. Stats and eyes say you are wrong bud.

 

[ALEXJD93]

Kessel and JVR need someone to get them the puck in the neutral zone, they don't need anyone joining them on 3 on 1 rushes. What makes Bozak so good on that line, is he has no illusions of being on their level offensively, this is why that line scored 4 goals head to head against Pittsburg's Crosby's line and was +9 collectively. Strong offensive presence with Bozak as their defensive conscience.

Thats complete nonsense, name another team that use's their first line center for defensive reasons when had has no offensive upside....

 

[Mikeyg]

Website had it right guy, you had them wrong, and back to my original point, 70% is more relevant, win the 5v5 battle you win the game, also I could probably pull it up to show you how Kadri is better on the PP with Kessel than Bozak is as well?

I like how you actually believe that 30% is statistically irrelevant, you are simply WRONG.

 

[ALEXJD93]

I like how you actually believe that 30% is statistically irrelevant, you are simply WRONG.

Strawman, never said it wasn't, said 70% is more relevant

 

[ALEXJD93]

Bozah is +5, PK regular, plus out there late with Kule, and Mcclement says otherwise.

While the Kadri line was only even against Chicago in a 7-3 win, -2 against St. Louis, -1 against LA, -2 against Boston. Stats and eyes say you are wrong bud.

+/- is a hogwash stat, I like how people who are most against stats, cite the worst stat

ignorance is bliss for these guys

Bozak career with leafs is MINUS 45 anyways, only year he's been a plus, stat means nothing anyways, wouldn't cite it unless you did

 

[Lobstertainment]

I like how you actually believe that 30% is statistically irrelevant, you are simply WRONG.

more relevant =/= irrelevant.

He's right, if your team is better 5 on 5 you'll probably also succeed at 5 on 4.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Thats complete nonsense, name another team that use's their first line center for defensive reasons when had has no offensive upside....

Name another first line center that is only 6th in salary on a team? You don't seem to understand the Leafs are built on their wings.

 

[Mikeyg]

P-values are often coupled to a significance or alpha (α) level, which is also set ahead of time, usually at 0.05 (5%).[5] Thus, if a p-value was found to be less than 0.05, then the result would be considered statistically significant and the null hypothesis would be rejected.

Stop trying to say that 30% is not significant, because it IS

 

[Mikeyg]

Strawman, never said it wasn't, said 70% is more relevant

LOL there is NO SUCH THING as more relevant or less relevant in statistics hahahahahah its either statistically significant or its not, stop trying to disprove things

 

[Lobstertainment]

Is this trolling?

 

[The Winter Soldier]

+/- is a hogwash stat, I like how people who are most against stats, cite the worst stat

ignorance is bliss for these guys

Obcourse that is your response, dismiss stats when they do not fit your argument? You watch the games last week, you think the Kadri line played well defensively or offensively?

 

[Eb]

P-values are often coupled to a significance or alpha (α) level, which is also set ahead of time, usually at 0.05 (5%).[5] Thus, if a p-value was found to be less than 0.05, then the result would be considered statistically significant and the null hypothesis would be rejected.

Stop trying to say that 30% is not significant, because it IS

Lol, let me guess, you just had a Stats course this semester?

Boy, this has gotten off topic.

 

[Mikeyg]

more relevant =/= irrelevant.

He's right, if your team is better 5 on 5 you'll probably also succeed at 5 on 4.

This is completely untrue, vancouver la tampa and the ducks are all bad at pp, it doesnt correlate always.

for the last time, there is no such thing as more or less relevant, its either statistically relevant or its not

 

[Mikeyg]

Lol, let me guess, you just had a Stats course this semester?

Boy, this has gotten off topic.

Hey bud, was wondering when you'd show up, Ive taken 3 years of stats actually

 

[ALEXJD93]

Name another first line center that is only 6th in salary on a team? You don't seem to understand the Leafs are built on their wings.

Not the point, better options are available

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Not the point, better options are available

Where? Who?

I still want you to explain how Kadri is better defensively on the Kessel/JVR line when The Kadri line was only even against Chicago in a 7-3 win, -2 against St. Louis, -1 against LA, -2 against Boston.

 

[namttebih]

LOL there is NO SUCH THING as more relevant or less relevant in statistics hahahahahah its either statistically significant or its not, stop trying to disprove things

You also started this post off with slang. hahahahahaha is also not proper grammar.

Ok now I'll really stop.

 

[ALEXJD93]

Obcourse that is your response, dismiss stats when they do not fit your argument? You watch the games last week, you think the Kadri line played well defensively or offensively?

Ovechkin is a Minus 11 this year? Is he bad? They played better offensively and moved the puck better out of their own zone, I'm probably going to quit this argument, cause I see you and your pal are friends and are of similar mindset, this is fine but if you see more teams turning to adv stats (as they are http://www.sbnation.com/nhl/2013/10/21/4857618/nhl-stats-advanced-analytics-teams) don't forget everything i've said

 

[ALEXJD93]

Where? Who?

I still want you to explain how Kadri is better defensively on the Kessel/JVR line when The Kadri line was only even against Chicago in a 7-3 win, -2 against St. Louis, -1 against LA, -2 against Boston.

THE EYE TEST FOR THAT ONE, Do some research, I don't claim that every stat is useful, and +/- is absoulutely useless, talk to @BSH_EricT on twitter or do some real research here, c'mon, sloppy stuff

LAST YEAR KADRI: +15 BOZAK -1 EXPLAINATION, was kadri better defensively this year? AND NO, BOZAK LINE DOESN'T EVEN MATCH UP AGAINST THE OTHER TEAMS NO1 LINE EVERY GAME, NOR SHOULD THEY, leave McClement or Bolland when he is back for that

 

[Diatomic]

Where? Who?

I still want you to explain how Kadri is better defensively on the Kessel/JVR line when The Kadri line was only even against Chicago in a 7-3 win, -2 against St. Louis, -1 against LA, -2 against Boston.

I think its very funny how your trying to show us how great a defensive player in Bozak is when your referencing the +/- of Kadri's line in recent games. Remember Mark Fraser with his +18 last year? Now he's -8 and garbage. To top it off, Bozak is a career minus player with -37

If your going to use +/- as a reference people here arent going to take your posts seriously

 

[Sergei Berezin]

Give me some more of that Hollandaise!

 

[Lobstertainment]

This is completely untrue, vancouver la tampa and the ducks are all bad at pp, it doesnt correlate always.

for the last time, there is no such thing as more or less relevant, its either statistically relevant or its not

1st of all I said PROBABLY

2nd of all Anaheim is literally a top 10 PP team in the league.

3rd of all I'd argue against LA and Tampa being "BAD" PP teams.

and lastly how about some other examples statsman?

Chicago, Pittsburgh, St.Louis to name a few who are very much strong 5 on 5 and are killing it on the PP.

You know Chicago, defending Stanley Cup champions who use advanced stats.

 

[Eb]

I think its very funny how your trying to show us how great a defensive player in Bozak is when your referencing the +/- of Kadri's line in recent games. Remember Mark Fraser with his +18 last year? Now he's -8 and garbage. To top it off, Bozak is a career minus player with -37

If your going to use +/- as a reference people here arent going to take your posts seriously

He was emphasizing how no matter who plays in between JvR and Kessel, they will continue to produce. Playing with Kadri hasn't drastically changed Kessel's pace as most have suggested in the past.

However, what does matter, is who is placed in between Kessel and JvR will determine how many pucks go into their net when they're on the ice.

Looking at Bozak's plus minus from 2-3 years ago when the team was terrible is dumb.

 

[Crispy Crust]

Bozak's defensive acumen is overrated. He isn't a good defender 5 on 5. Kadri is the superior player because he aids in driving possession forward. As long as you spend more time in the offensive zone each shift, you don't have to worry about pucks being directed towards your net. I mean just play your best C with your top wingers and let everything else play out. Everyone talks about how the Leafs should spread out the offense by keeping Kadri on the 2nd line, but if Bozak is as good as people say he is, I'm sure he won't have a problem looking like a dependable and relatively skilled NHLer away from Phil Kessel.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Ovechkin is a Minus 11 this year? Is he bad? They played better offensively and moved the puck better out of their own zone, I'm probably going to quit this argument, cause I see you and your pal are friends and are of similar mindset, this is fine but if you see more teams turning to adv stats (as they are http://www.sbnation.com/nhl/2013/10/21/4857618/nhl-stats-advanced-analytics-teams) don't forget everything i've said

Well this has nothing to do with what you were discussing and what you claimed. Kadri is better defensively than Bozak is on the Kessel/JVR line.

Last week 5 on 5 with Kadri as center, that line scored 2 even strength goals, and they were on for 7 goals against. Please explain to me, how is this line better defensively with Kadri as you claim it to be?