Salary Cap: Pens Off Season Thread: Pre Free Agency Shenanigans!

[Pens1566]

So, at least it seems we're moving on from Dumo.

Other than that, move Granlund and weaponize cap space seems like a good follow up.

 

[Andy99]

I wonder what players on cap strapped teams he’s gonna go after?

I mean that’s the thing…there aren’t that many…the only one I can think off the top of my head is Ross Colton but there will be other teams with the same idea…are we going to offer sheet him? “Taking advantage” doesn’t like trading a good asset to Tampa to acquire him…maybe they’re hoping Tampa really wants to resign Colton and Killorn and they can swipe Point from them for nothing, like Vegas did to get rid of Pactches? Lol lol

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

What's "highly expensive"? What's "younger talent"?

This team's got a slew of 36 year old guys, pretty much anybody would be considered younger talent for this roster.

It depends what you mean by contending. I don't think they're a serious cup favorite any more, but I don't think a deep playoff run is impossible and maybe with some miraculous health luck and Dubas hitting homers with most of his moves...mayyyybe a cup is possible.

If they shoot themselves in the foot by not using all available assets it might well be though.

Making the playoffs shouldn't be hard, and I don't believe it is. This team had just about the worst regular season they could, all things considered, and they still only missed by a point because they shit the bed against the two worst teams in hockey.

A Cup is not realistically possible, imo. Not even fantasy land stuff. Unless this team gets to work performing serious surgery to the roster and makes a handful of homerun moves in the next 9-12 months, imo. At best, I think this team may see the 2nd round once more before Sid hangs 'em up. /shrug

I'm with you guys who hate this bullshit, tightrope walk of not committing either way. I'm not gonna pretend I don't hope this team's bottoming out by the TDL and they deal Jake for a massive haul as opposed to re-signing him. It won't happen, not a chance in Hell, but this "don't commit fully one way or another" thing is so f***ing tedious after this many years of circling the drain, and now with the roster in the state it's in, yeesh...

 

[xlm34]

I’d take Conor Garland if Vancouver really does want to attach an asset to move him.

 

[Malkinstheman]

I mean that’s the thing…there aren’t that many…the only one I can think off the top of my head is Ross Colton but there will be other teams with the same idea…are we going to offer sheet him? “Taking advantage” doesn’t like trading a good asset to Tampa to acquire him…maybe they’re hoping Tampa really wants to resign Colton and Killorn and they can swipe Point from them for nothing, like Vegas did to get rid of Pactches? Lol lol

LA, Boston and Vegas are other teams that might need to shed cap. Iafallo, Arvidson, Hall, Grzelyck, Ullmark all seem like realistic targets

 

[Peat]

That’s because their words of planning to build a contending team while also building towards the future is not a possible task. It’s one or the other or you end up with neither.

Right.

So pick one.

And they did. Hextall was publicly meant to compete while also building the prospect pipeline for the future, which is of course quite difficult.

Dubas is publicly meant to compete while building an organisation that can build for the future. Not a pipeline. An organisation. Building a superior long term front office isn't incompatible with competing.

So now I expect them to back their words up, or I'm going to enjoy being pissy about it.

I feel like Hellebuyck would cost a lot more than that, though. If the price is the same, you obviously trade for Hellebuyck. But I don't see why that would be the case.

And yes, I think Hall would fit. He kept mentioning how he wanted to take advantage of other team's cap situation and Hall is a prime guy to be available for no assets. Dubas also said the Penguins needed talent, and Hall is obviously very talented.

But Dubas won't. That's what he's publicly said. He wouldn't do that.

Is it likely? I don't know, but we know asset price slides around based on whether a team has their back to the wall, age, contract value, and the idea that a team with no option but to trade the better goalie who is going to ask for 9.5m for his 30+ years might only do as well as the team that has other options and whose less accomplished goalie is a 24 year old RFA isn't wholly unreasonable.

And, again, Hall isn't a young long term solution, so is he going to do him as part of 14OA? That's currently ambiguous.

 

[Andy99]

LA, Boston and Vegas are other teams that might need to shed cap. Iafallo, Arvidson, Hall, Grzelyck, Ullmark all seem like realistic targets

Yes, but those teams aren’t likely to give assets up for them…in other words, it’s still going to cost future assets to acquire them…maybe the only one would be a bad contract, like Garland

 

[Peat]

Yes, but those teams aren’t likely to give assets up for them…in other words, it’s still going to cost future assets to acquire them…maybe the only one would be a bad contract, like Garland

And he never said he wouldn't use futures to acquire them. Only that the 1st and Pickering are off the table unless it's a high end young long term solution.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Hellebuyck is the stupidest goddamn idea we've collectively come up with in the four years I've been around. You'd have to trade literally everything not nailed down because of how piss poor this team's asset situation/prospect situation is, and there's like a 95%+ chance he doesn't re-sign long term because he's stated, repeatedly, the reason he's leaving Winnipeg is to chase a Cup before his time's up. This team is pretty much exactly where Winnipeg's at in terms of contending, maybe even a bit worse.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Well whatever. At least we can be happy knowing we're drafting the next like... Colby Armstrong. And it'll be fun to run commentary on all the other teams picking the nice hunks off of the corpses of Calgary and other teams while we all get excited about possibly snagging some mediocre midget out of Vancouver because his contract sucks.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Well whatever. At least we can be happy knowing we're drafting the next like... Colby Armstrong or whatever. And it'll be fun to run commentary on all the other teams picking the nice hunks off of the corpses of Calgary and other teams while we all get excited about possibly snagging some mediocre midget out of Vancouver because his contract sucks.

Hey maybe we draft the next Esposito and deal him for the next Hossa.

f***, we're gonna finally end up with Garland aren't we...

 

[Peat]

Well whatever. At least we can be happy knowing we're drafting the next like... Colby Armstrong or whatever. And it'll be fun to run commentary on all the other teams picking the nice hunks off of the corpses of Calgary and other teams while we all get excited about possibly snagging some mediocre midget out of Vancouver because his contract sucks.

Depending on how young young is, Noah Hanifin arguably fits as a guy he might pay big for.

 

[SomeDude]

Right.

So pick one.

And they did. Hextall was publicly meant to compete while also building the prospect pipeline for the future, which is of course quite difficult.

Dubas is publicly meant to compete while building an organisation that can build for the future. Not a pipeline. An organisation. Building a superior long term front office isn't incompatible with competing.

So now I expect them to back their words up, or I'm going to enjoy being pissy about it.

Well, they’re all towing the company line of being a good team while still caring about the future.

How would you even go about trying to do that? I would say not trading 1sts or top prospects while also not trading off your current good players for futures.

It’s a recipe for being stuck in purgatory, but they’ll still be doing what they said they were going to, no?

 

[Gurglesons]

Depending on how young young is, Noah Hanifin arguably fits as a guy he might pay big for.

Gross.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Hey maybe we draft the next Esposito and deal him for the next Hossa.

f***, we're gonna finally end up with Garland aren't we...

Garland would be like Granlund from a few years ago... everyone here is all hot and bothered to see him in a Penguins uniform... until he actually got here and started playing. Then everyone would be like "oh... shit." You're literally just going out and getting a carbon copy of the exact same wing we've (mostly) all come to roll our eyes and yawn at 82 games a season.

Depending on how young young is, Noah Hanifin arguably fits as a guy he might pay big for.

That would at least qualify as finding a pulse. So I'm in favor. Not the biggest fan of the player but it would show some willingness to address issues.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Yeah, Hanifin seems to fit the bill. Younger guy, good potential, and while Calgary's not really cash strapped, they're gonna lose a lot of recognizable names in a mass exodus over the next calendar year imo. Wouldn't be surprised to see Kadri and Huberdeau dealt as well once this initial group of like four guys who want out are gone.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I don't like laughing at any team's misfortune unless they are on my shitlist but I can't help but get a lil giggle out of Calgary firing Sutter because he's not only a terrible coach but can't manage talent but the whole damned team is abandoning ship, anyway.

 

[Peat]

Well, they’re all towing the company line of being a good team while still caring about the future.

How would you even go about trying to do that? I would say not trading 1sts or top prospects while also not trading off your current good players for futures.

It’s a recipe for being stuck in purgatory, but they’ll still be doing what they said they were going to, no?

a) To the best of my knowledge, that is no longer the company line. I am not aware of a quote given when Dubas arrived in which he said rebuilding the prospect pool was a major priority. Winning was, but not the prospect pool. Maybe I missed something but publicly, I do not believe we are in that position. If we were, I might be mildly kinder about it.

b) I would qualify what you call a recipe for being stuck in purgatory and call it a recipe for doing neither, which means they're doing absolutely nothing of what they said they would. See: Hextall, Ronald

Gross.

I knew that suggestion would make you happy.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Again, my selfish wish is for this team to throw whatever they've got at landing a premiere winger for Geno's line. Nah, it doesn't fix the bottom-6, add anything to a lukewarm (at best) blueline, or fix the colossal issue in net--but it'd be more fun to watch two scoring lines working than all that other shit. And this team's done competing, so fun is all that matters anymore.

But fun is never, ever on the minds of FO execs or coaches, so...

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Again, my selfish wish is for this team to throw whatever they've got at landing a premiere winger for Geno's line. Nah, it doesn't fix the bottom-6, add anything to a lukewarm (at best) blueline, or fix the colossal issue in net--but it'd be more fun to watch two scoring lines working than all that other shit. And this team's done competing, so fun is all that matters anymore.

But fun is never, ever on the minds of FO execs or coaches, so...

Careful wanting to improve the second line. You might end up being a "Malkin Martyr" or whatever the brave white knights call it that shield us daily from the fans of the fourth greatest player in franchise history and opinions thereof.

 

[SomeDude]

a) To the best of my knowledge, that is no longer the company line. I am not aware of a quote given when Dubas arrived in which he said rebuilding the prospect pool was a major priority. Winning was, but not the prospect pool. Maybe I missed something but publicly, I do not believe we are in that position. If we were, I might be mildly kinder about it.

b) I would qualify what you call a recipe for being stuck in purgatory and call it a recipe for doing neither, which means they're doing absolutely nothing of what they said they would. See: Hextall, Ronald

I could have sworn a very similar goal was put out after Dubas was announced, but who knows.

Like you said, if they’re just all in on contending there’s no reason the pick shouldn’t be in play.

The only way possible to actually ice a contender while still future building would be to draft flawlessly and win every trade you make. Seems doable.

 

[Zap Rowsdower]

Me too!

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Ah well. Bring on the draft already.

At least it's looking like the UFAs may be allowed to walk. Hopefully. Maybe.

 

[Gurglesons]

a) To the best of my knowledge, that is no longer the company line. I am not aware of a quote given when Dubas arrived in which he said rebuilding the prospect pool was a major priority. Winning was, but not the prospect pool. Maybe I missed something but publicly, I do not believe we are in that position. If we were, I might be mildly kinder about it.

b) I would qualify what you call a recipe for being stuck in purgatory and call it a recipe for doing neither, which means they're doing absolutely nothing of what they said they would. See: Hextall, Ronald



I knew that suggestion would make you happy.

He said it today.

 

[K Fleur]

This a great quote.

“Our biggest need is you know…good players”.