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GDT: Pens 2024 Trade Deadline Thread: Jake Shake Talk here

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Turin said:
feels like if Bunting had a Swedish name like Hoglander people would be more stoked about this, he’s a better player
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Yeah I also feel like Dubas didn’t really sink any value here by trading for Bunting. I don’t think Bunting’s inclusion really seemed to impact the value much, which is the major thing I was concerned with.

I really like Bunting and was all about getting him last offseason, so I’m certainly not mad about having him now.
 
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I freely admit to this being a coping mechanism, but I will say this much: when the Pens got Kessel, people here were ecstatic about how JR managed to pull off the trade without giving up Pouliot.
In the end, Dubas got the better prospect in Kapanen.

I'm not saying I expect any of the prospects the Pens got to be better than Morrow or Blake, but it is possible they're better than people here seem to think.
At least when it came to Corey Pronman of the Athletic - the guy who actually watches prospects, unlike the others, he gave the Pens a B- for the deal, vs the Hurricanes getting a B+, so he seems to think the return isn't that bad.

On the flip side, I'm a little worried that I was a bit prophetic when I worried that any trade of Guentzel would end up with a return similar to what the Pens gave up for Hossa back in the day.
Guentzel & Ty Smith for Bunting, three prospects, a 2nd (that can become a 1st) and a 5th, isn't that far off from Armstrong, Christensen, Esposito and a 1st...
 
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Dipsy Doodle said:
We have limited time with this core, that has a stated objective to win. Guentzel's contributions are irreplaceable for this team, with the time it has left with this core.
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We haven’t done shit with Guentzel since a single round win in 2018.

Jake has won 5 series across 2 years in his 8 seasons at the NHL level.

Not his fault but lmao at him being the crux that keeps us a contender or not.
 
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Turin said:
So if it’s Elias Petersson the team doesn’t need it? lol

Fwiw skating was not a strength for Guentzel as a prospect either if I remember right
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If you can compensate for weak skating with spectacular attributes elsewhere, fantastic. That is not the case here.

Guentzel was am exceptionally rare scratch ticket that paid off. We needed a surer thing for heat we gave up.
 
Bunting should be replacing Smith going forward.

I am on needles and pins here waiting for that stain to leave this team.

And hot damn folks there's another thread for that coke bird to be placed in.
 
Sidgeni Malkby said:
Bunting is 28 years old, signed for 2 more years at $4.5M. It seems Dubas really likes him, as he's one of his wins in Toronto. His assumption is he fit with Matthews/Marner, so he'll fit with Crosby the same way.

He was too expensive for what he brought to Carolina (3rd line winger for 4.5M), so I would think he had negative value for them.

As for the prospects:
Koivunen - 2nd round pick (#51)
Ponomarev - 2nd round pick (#53)
Lucius - 4th round pick (#124)

So basically we gave up Jake + a 1st rounder (Ty Smith) for:
Bunting
3 x 2nd rounder
1 x 4th rounder
and a conditional upgrade to 1st + conditional 5th rounder

I'm really surprised he didn't get a no-strings-attached 1st rounder draft pick out of this.

My biggest concern is what Sully will do to these guys :(.
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But they aren't third and fourth round picks.

There is a reason NHL and MLB picks fail much more often than NFL picks.

17 and 18 year old kids are much tougher to project than 21 and 22 year Olds.

These three have developed and their chance of failure is much less than a random third or fourth round pick.

Under the where they were picked logic we got an every day player and two thirds and a fourth, as well as a conditional first and fifth for a third round pick.
 
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CheckingLineCenter said:
We haven’t done shit with Guentzel since a single round win in 2018.

Jake has won 5 series across 2 years in his 8 seasons at the NHL level.

Not his fault but lmao at him being the crux that keeps us a contender or not.
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Exactly, not his fault. Not Crosby's fault either.

These are gamers playing on a team that hasn't filled out the complementary pieces. We're now much further from icing a good team than we were a couple days ago.
 
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Welp, I hope Kuznetsov is actually washed because if they just solved their 2C for next year at $3.9M cap hit, it makes it a whole lot easier for them to fit Jake into their cap.
 
Empoleon8771 said:
I don’t think it’s a stretch to suggest that they could have gotten Bunting, the pick and Morrow instead of Bunting, the pick and the prospects they got. But at the same time, go ask Ottawa how targeting one top prospect went for them in the Stone trade. If that guy doesn’t hit, you get nothing.

So I understand why Dubas targeted what he targeted, but it’s still an underwhelming return. I think they need to hit on Koivunen as a top-6 guy long-term for me to call this a win for them.
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Maybe, Canes are looking at this from an angle the Jake played with a generation Hall of Famer named Sidney Crosby. Probably used that as a way to bring down the price for Geuntzel.... pure speculation..
 
Jaded-Fan said:
But they aren't third and fourth round picks.

There is a reason NHL and MLB picks fail much more often than NFL picks.

17 and 18 year old kids are much tougher to project than 21 and 22 year Olds.

These three have developed and their chance of failure is much less than a random third or fourth round pick.

Under the where they were picked logic we got an every day player and two thirds and a fourth, as well as a conditional first and fifth for a third round pick.
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Yes, I agree they are a level above a 3rd round pick. There is a lot of nuance to this deal, as with all deals.
 
pistolpete11 said:
Welp, I hope Kuznetsov is actually washed because if they just solved their 2C for next year at $3.9M cap hit, it makes it a whole lot easier for them to fit Jake into their cap.
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Not sure about that, still more guys to sign
 
Freeptop said:
I freely admit to this being a coping mechanism, but I will say this much: when the Pens got Kessel, people here were ecstatic about how JR managed to pull off the trade without giving up Pouliot.
In the end, Dubas got the better prospect in Kapanen.

I'm not saying I expect any of the prospects the Pens got to be better than Morrow or Blake, but it is possible they're better than people here seem to think.
At least when it came to Corey Pronman of the Athletic - the guy who actually watches prospects, unlike the others, he gave the Pens a B- for the deal, vs the Hurricanes getting a B+, so he seems to think the return isn't that bad.

On the flip side, I'm a little worried that I was a bit prophetic when I worried that any trade of Guentzel would end up with a return similar to what the Pens gave up for Hossa back in the day.
Guentzel & Ty Smith for Bunting, three prospects, a 2nd (that can become a 1st) and a 5th, isn't that far off from Armstrong, Christensen, Esposito and a 1st...
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The thing is, other than maybe local hacks who quite literally don’t know, I haven’t seen anyone say we got “bad” prospects. Just simply that we didn’t get any of the Canes’ top-4. There are some sources that’ll say any of the top-5, but saying we got their 5th, 7th, and 8th-best prospects doesn’t seem like a huge overreach.

What that lacks is context. For example, if, in 2012, someone traded for the Penguins 2nd best centre, you could go “wow, you only got their 2nd best centre!?!?” If that’s how it was listed it doesn’t say much. Saying it’s Malkin and he’s second to Crosby gives far more weight.

How good are their top-4? How much better than the ones we got? No clue. But no one has said they’re bad players. In fact, all of them are apparently killing their respective leagues and they’re all still quite young.
 
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Dipsy Doodle said:
Exactly, not his fault. Not Crosby's fault either.

These are gamers playing on a team that hasn't filled out the complementary pieces. We're now much further from icing a good team than we were a couple days ago.
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We’d be in the same spot if Guentzel walked in the summer except without 4 pieces that have a real shot to play and one legitimate NHLer.

3 GMs have tinkered with the complimentary pieces in different ways for 5+ years now and it didn’t work. (Obv that’s why coach should’ve been shitcanned but story for another day). They’re old and it’s over. It was simply just time to move on from an expiring piece going on 30 that happened to be the one guy that could actually return some value (vs Rakell, Rust, Smith etc).
 
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Failing to trade any of Smith, Eller, Carter or Ned at this point would be asinine. Fully commit to the suckage and make that top-10 pick. Give Sullivan zero options but to play the youth (even/especially when it leads to Ls).

Bunting-Crosby-Rust
Malkin-Ponomarev-Rakell
O’Connor-Poulin-Puustinen
Gruden-Acciari-Puljujarvi
 
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