Salary Cap: Penguins Salary Cap Thread: We suck again summer edition

[ChaosAgent]

Obviously I've said over and over that I watch sports for entertainment and not some weird armchair coach competition to see why can convince themselves they liked being bored to death more. But having said that it really isn't at all about "ooh Malkin do shiny things!" at all. Not these days. I just don't think sticking some AHLer like Nylander on his wing along with whatever trash-ass game Bryan Rust plays these days is any kind of solution. You want to clean that line up and make it harder to play against but at the expense of scoring then I'm all about it. But some combination of Rust/Garland/Zucker/Raks/Nylander is definitely gonna leave you guys unhappy in pretty much every regard. That a giant bucket of "blah."

I don't have any terrific solutions, either. To be clear. I just know that ain't it.

Half the league would have signed Rust last year.

You're trying to depict this as some sort of AHLer situation. You are way underselling the quality of our top 6 wings. Aside from whatever crappy thing Granlund is.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

I'd pay nothing to acquire Garland. If we can get him for that I'd be good.

That 4'5.5" player? That's barely the height of two 5-month-old babies stacked. No thank you.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Half the league would have signed Rust last year.

You're trying to depict this as some sort of AHLer situation. You are way underselling the quality of our top 6 wings. Aside from whatever crappy thing Granlund is.

I mean I dunno. Maybe?

But you guys are awful quick to jump all over "lol full of playoff fail" when talking about Malkin and Sid. Most of the guys I listed have been on the team a bit... are they not part of the problem? Haven't we seen enough of their "greatness" at this point?

Every top six wing they have is basically a middle-tier third wheel type. Even Jake was playing that way most of last year. The top six was largely carried by the two usual guys and Jason Zucker. When he wasn't cold.

Again I'm fine with the idea of balancing out the lines. Sullivan's usage is whacked out for sure. But I just don't think the solutions are currently on the team. And I think a guy like Garland is a fairly nifty player but essentially just tripling down on even more of what they already have. Get bigger and meaner. Get some pure shooters. Get guys that are simply all motor or are absolute pains to play against. SOMETHING just so long as it isn't a facsimile of the same guy.

 

[ChaosAgent]

I mean I dunno. Maybe?

But you guys are awful quick to jump all over "lol full of playoff fail" when talking about Malkin and Sid. Most of the guys I listed have been on the team a bit... are they not part of the problem? Haven't we seen enough of their "greatness" at this point?

Every top six wing they have is basically a middle-tier third wheel type. Even Jake was playing that way most of last year. The top six was largely carried by the two usual guys and Jason Zucker. When he wasn't cold.

Again I'm fine with the idea of balancing out the lines. Sullivan's usage is whacked out for sure. But I just don't think the solutions are currently on the team. And I think a guy like Garland is a fairly nifty player but essentially just tripling down on even more of what they already have. Get bigger and meaner. Get some pure shooters. Get guys that are simply all motor or are absolute pains to play against. SOMETHING just so long as it isn't a facsimile of the same guy.

At even strength the top 6 was good last year. The issue was the 4 of them that played on the man advantage.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Rust and Petry aren't the issues on this team. They need a D partner for Letang, a new starting goalie and a completely revamped bottom-6.

In a perfect world, you tell Carter and Granlund to piss off and use the remaining $25 million or so to fill out the holes with this base:

Guentzel-Crosby-Rakell
XXXXX-Malkin-Rust
XXXXX-XXXXXX-XXXXX
O'Connor-Poehling-XXXXXX
XXXXXX-Nylander

XXXXXX-Letang
Pettersson-Petry
Smith-Rutta
Ruhwedel

XXXXXX-DeSmith

You probably can't do that with Carter, so just staple him to L4 or in the press box as the center healthy scratch and use the remaining $22 million or so to fill out the rest of the roster.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

Rust and Petry aren't the issues on this team. They need a D partner for Letang, a new starting goalie and a completely revamped bottom-6.

In a perfect world, you tell Carter and Granlund to piss off and use the remaining $25 million or so to fill out the holes with this base:

Guentzel-Crosby-Rakell
XXXXX-Malkin-Rust
XXXXX-XXXXXX-XXXXX
O'Connor-Poehling-XXXXXX
XXXXXX-Nylander

XXXXXX-Letang
Pettersson-Petry
Smith-Rutta
Ruhwedel

XXXXXX-DeSmith

You probably can't do that with Carter, so just staple him to L4 or in the press box as the center healthy scratch and use the remaining $22 million or so to fill out the rest of the roster.

Yep, so the starting 4th line would be O'C-P-C.

Try to get Granlund out of here. Retain 50% if you must. Or maybe even consider using a buyout.

My primary target for a FA forward would be Barbashev. My maths says his fair value is at $5M per year (5+, heck I'd give him 7 years)... But he's FA and those are usually overpaid... But the Pens have that cap space.

 

[SEALBound]

Rust and Petry aren't the issues on this team. They need a D partner for Letang, a new starting goalie and a completely revamped bottom-6.

In a perfect world, you tell Carter and Granlund to piss off and use the remaining $25 million or so to fill out the holes with this base:

Guentzel-Crosby-Rakell
XXXXX-Malkin-Rust
XXXXX-XXXXXX-XXXXX
O'Connor-Poehling-XXXXXX
XXXXXX-Nylander

XXXXXX-Letang
Pettersson-Petry
Smith-Rutta
Ruhwedel

XXXXXX-DeSmith

You probably can't do that with Carter, so just staple him to L4 or in the press box as the center healthy scratch and use the remaining $22 million or so to fill out the rest of the roster.

I have no qualms with Petry. He was exactly who everyone said he would be. Another season of that would be fine by me.

We know who Rust is and this last season was substandard. It is a problem if Rust plays like this again (for the rest of his contract). But bottom line, he needs to play better. Of all the issues we have, it's one but it's low on the priority list.

You outlined the three others - 1LD, 1G, and a bottom 6. I think if you prioritize that, it's 1G, two bottom 6 wings, and then a 1D. While Pettersson isn't ideal, I'd be okay starting with:

Petts-Letang
POJ-Petry
Smith-Rutta

Starting goalie is the #1 priority. Then two bottom 6 wings. I say two wings because I assume Carter and Poehling will be the centers. I would like to see us get a C/W 4th liner that can do both - similar to Poehling to be able to fill in for injuries.

The big wildcard here in Granlund. I have no idea what the play there is. Can he be the Zucker replacement, can he be an effective bottom 6 wing, can he be an effective bottom 6 center....does ANYONE want him for ANYTHING of value....just a lot of questions there.

In my lineup draft, I sent him to Calgary for Markstrom. Not sure if they go for that but if gets them out of a 4yr deal. If I'm paying 5-6mil on a meh player, I'd rather it be a goal whose name is not Jarry.

Yep, so the starting 4th line would be O'C-P-C.

Try to get Granlund out of here. Retain 50% if you must. Or maybe even consider using a buyout.

My primary target for a FA forward would be Barbashev. My maths says his fair value is at $5M per year (5+, heck I'd give him 7 years)... But he's FA and those are usually overpaid... But the Pens have that cap space.

I think he's going to be popular so we'd best be ready to make our pitch was dollar signs. He's the type of player we really need. I'd love to be able to clone him and run:

Jake-Sid-Rak
Barbs-Geno-Rust
XXXX-Barbs-Barbs
DOC-Poehling-XXXX

 

[ChaosAgent]

I hope management is at least having conversations with Rust about waiving. He needs to be motivated to bounce back. If he actually did waive it opens up some possibilities as well.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Michael Russo and Eric Dutaschek have launched the offseason trade board on The Athletic.

Petry and Granlund are included on the list, while Guentzel is on the "also monitoring" list.

Some interesting potential targets for the Pens, as well, depending on what the new front office wants to do.

NHL offseason trade board: What we're hearing about the Jets' stars, the Leafs' Core Four and other targets

Connor Hellebuyck, Mark Scheifele, William Nylander and Erik Karlsson are among the buzziest names who could be moved this summer.

theathletic.com

 

[Pancakes]

Imagine if we traded Petry for younger less physical Petry

I like Severson's puck moving skills better than Petry's. Petry is more reliable in his own end I'd say though.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Trading Petry would be a mistake but I guess it's probably the most easily accomplishable move the new GM can do to make his own implant on the team.

In terms of NTCs, here is what the Penguins currently have:

-Crosby: Full NMC
-Malkin: Full NMC
-Letang: Full NMC
-Carter: Full NMC
-Rust: Full NMC
-Rakell: 8 team no-trade list
-Petry: 15 team no-trade list
-Pettersson: 8 team no-trade list
-Guentzel: 12 team no-trade list

I think none of these guys outside of Carter are problems and trading them for the sake of trading them is a bad idea. However, if you're going to trade one of them I think Petry or Pettersson are the guys you go with. You can't move anyone in the NMC category without their consent and trading Rakell or Guentzel would be a mind boggling move IMO.

 

[Gurglesons]

I like Severson's puck moving skills better than Petry's. Petry is more reliable in his own end I'd say though.

Why would you say that? Petry has much better production throughout his career.

 

[Pancakes]

Why would you say that? Petry has much better production throughout his career.

Just from watching them both the past year. Petry may have been better at one point at moving the puck but I dont think he is currently.

I fully admit this is me talking eye test though not analytics. Analytically they're similar (if not favorable towards Petry).

Severson is quite younger.

Either way, irrelevant because I don't think Petry is goin anywhere, and I think Severson will want to sign on a team where he can be a top PP guy.

 

[Jacob]

I don’t see any changes coming to D, not with higher priorities like G, top 6 LW and bottom 6 forwards needing addressed. It’s Pets, Joseph, Smith down the left and Letang, Petry Ruutta down the right with Friedman as #7. At most I think we sign a cheap lefty as insurance in case Smith can’t cut it.

I’m liking Domi as a top 6 option if Zucker or Barbashev can’t get done. Bit of a d-bag but maybe we need that.

 

[The GM]

Ugh...can we PLEASE stop talking about the expansion draft? It is done, it is over, and it was two years ago. It is of absolute ZERO consequence now. It is what it is.

Here's a change of pace:
Bratt for 14ov + Broz
Granlund+NJD 3rd for Markstrom+4th
Sign Athanasiou and Pius Suter
Resign most RFAs

Guentzel-Crosby-Rakell
Bratt-Malkin-Rust
DOC-Suter-Athanasiou
Puustinen-Poehling-Nylander
Carter

Pettersson-Letang
POJ-Petry
Smith-Rutta
Rudwedel

Markstrom
Desmith

$1mil in space. Challenge - make a better team for next year.

I actually like talking about the expansion draft so I don’t have to think about he naslund and ………despres trades

 

[3ladesof5teel]

I like Petry here, I think last year was maybe the worst Petry we see and it wasn't even bad. He was on the shelf off and on which didn't help.

If he gets in a full season and another year I think many here change their opinion on him.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Just from watching them both the past year. Petry may have been better at one point at moving the puck but I dont think he is currently.

I fully admit this is me talking eye test though not analytics. Analytically they're similar (if not favorable towards Petry).

Severson is quite younger.

Either way, irrelevant because I don't think Petry is goin anywhere, and I think Severson will want to sign on a team where he can be a top PP guy.

This is one subject you and I will never agree on. Severson is crap when he's played in anything over a bottom pairing role. He makes too many mental mistakes and doesn't have the offensive ability to offset those gaffes (like Letang can).

It's no coincidence that Severson looked like a mess in New Jersey when he was given top pairing minutes, but suddenly started to look competent this past season when behind Hamilton and Marino.

Severson taking over Petry's role would be a disaster waiting to happen.

 

[3ladesof5teel]

I don’t see any changes coming to D, not with higher priorities like G, top 6 LW and bottom 6 forwards needing addressed. It’s Pets, Joseph, Smith down the left and Letang, Petry Ruutta down the right with Friedman as #7. At most I think we sign a cheap lefty as insurance in case Smith can’t cut it.

I’m liking Domi as a top 6 option if Zucker or Barbashev can’t get done. Bit of a d-bag but maybe we need that.

I think we need to find a top 4 option on the backend or a partner to play with Letang.

I think we are setting ourselves up for further disappointment if Zucker doesn't get done and we replace that with Barb or Domi.

Its not that I dont like either guy but you likely aren't getting that production from them. If they come in addition to something else that fine but we really need a strong top 6 guy coming in and those 2 you listed aren't that

 

[Pens x]

I like Petry here, I think last year was maybe the worst Petry we see and it wasn't even bad. He was on the shelf off and on which didn't help.

If he gets in a full season and another year I think many here change their opinion on him.

I’m sure all of his issues will vanish at age 36. I hated the idea of acquiring ANOTHER guy past their prime on this team.

 

[3ladesof5teel]

I’m sure all of his issues will vanish at age 36. I hated the idea of acquiring ANOTHER guy past their prime on this team.

There are plenty of D men throughout NHL history that have performed very well at age 35/36

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

There are plenty of D men throughout NHL history that have performed very well at age 35/36

There are, but I'm not a fan of employing 1 of those that just had an injury-riddled year. Also a fun fact: the guy in front of that 36-year-old had a stroke less than a year ago.

There's nothing we can do about it bc Letang and Petry aren't going anywhere this offseason or Reg season. But I thought I'd point it out for shits and giggles

 

[3ladesof5teel]

There are, but I'm not a fan of employing 1 of those that just had an injury-riddled year. Also a fun fact: the guy in front of that 36-year-old had a stroke less than a year ago.

There's nothing we can do about it bc Letang and Petry aren't going anywhere this offseason or Reg season. But I thought I'd point it out for shits and giggles

Many weren't fans of employing Geno Malkin b/c he had an injury riddled season prior as well, good thing those guys arent making the calls.

Yes I understand Malkin is another level than Petry but Petry is still a fine defenseman and the NHL is a long tough sport, there's going to be injuries. Of all the teams fans in the NHL we should know that the most.

Its not like Petry is a regular infirmary report, tough season. I am not going to hold last season against him yet. We need him to perform

 

[Jacob]

Many weren't fans of employing Geno Malkin b/c he had an injury riddled season prior as well, good thing those guys arent making the calls.

Yes I understand Malkin is another level than Petry but Petry is still a fine defenseman and the NHL is a long tough sport, there's going to be injuries. Of all the teams fans in the NHL we should know that the most.

Its not like Petry is a regular infirmary report, tough season

Don't think anything is bad enough to linger or impact his off-season conditioning, either. Don't think he needed surgery or anything.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Many weren't fans of employing Geno Malkin b/c he had an injury riddled season prior as well, good thing those guys arent making the calls.

Yes I understand Malkin is another level than Petry but Petry is still a fine defenseman and the NHL is a long tough sport, there's going to be injuries. Of all the teams fans in the NHL we should know that the most.

Its not like Petry is a regular infirmary report, tough season. I am not going to hold last season against him yet. We need him to perform

You answered your own question.
Malkin & Letang do not equal Petry. So it's not even a legit comparison.

What I found odd about the Petry acquisition is that they had just re-signed Letang and we all knew his history. So let's add a 35 yr old with a ton of miles as our #2 Dman? It was a weird approach.

This isn't a bag on Petry per se as I thought he played in line with expectations. But moreso about the overall sense of "getting older" in general somehow would equate to better results. I'll reserve full judgment about JP until I see him next year. But if he's unavailable for big chunks of the season, this will rightfully be questioned.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

Really interested in Barbashev.

I don't think the Knights can sign him.
5 to 5.5 million for 6 or 7 years.
Ends at age 34.

At the end of the contract maybe we flip him for a 4th lol to another team and at that point we are just bad.

I really would love to sign zucker to a short contract a bit cheaper but I am unsure we can with Granlund and Carter deals.
Is Granlund going to the top 6? I sure hope so because that's all he is.
We could trade them too.

Really hoping someone in WBS steps up and can play would really help us out.