I don’t understand what “other reasons” your putting down. He wasn’t a bad playmaker during those days. Defensively? Why use that against him when his offense is more prolific?
No one is kidding themselves, being the greatest goal scorer of the generation/likely ever isn't something to dismiss, it's to be embraced but he's objectively been much more than that as a player and he won those awards by being more than just that as well. You can't argue otherwise because the hardware and results speak for themselves.
Such a straw man that is entirely devoid of the topic at hand. I mean, if this was your initial take why even post it in this thread, it makes no sense to the conversation at hand since you've already stated you weren't attempting to infer anything. (Sure)
Again your creating these alternative standards that don’t exist, all to make a point that you don’t have.
Cool, that’s not the topic or the discussion. I don’t understand why you have to change the standards in order to once again create a point that is basically useless.
So? Who said McDavid, Crosby, or Draisatl were elite two-way players? I didn't. They don't have to be. Neither does Ovechkin. It's a just a knock on his game when anyone suggests that he's somehow a complete player. He isn't. Neither is McDavid. Yes, I'd take them on my team. You're confusing whether I think he's great versus whether I agree that he's an all-around player. He's a one-trick pony whose one trick just happens to be spectacular.
Overreact much? I just said goal scoring is the most important thing. I've never thought of him as anything besides a terrific goal scorer. I don't see how anyone else can. Doesn't mean I think he sucks. If people stopped making it sound like he's a complete player, I wouldn't have even posted on this forum (besides respond to that one post about Mario Lemieux not being a top 10 all-time forward).
No one is saying he’s a complete player, that’s why your whol argument makes little sense. Saying he was the best PLAYER isn’t indicating anything with being the complete package. That’s where your getting it wrong. He was the best player in his peak, not just goal scorer. Is that calling him the best playmaker? The best defensively? No. It’s simple, his goal scoring has always been his strongest game, doesn’t mean he was never a good playmaker, doesn’t mean his physicality and speed never contributed anything. He won 3 Lindsays and 3 Harts for being the best and most valuable player. His main goal scoring years came after, in which yes you have a point.
Forsberg was a much better playoff performer. Could affect the game more even without scoring goals. Totally different type of players, though.
Well that’s just an awful take
Ovechkin was the best player on a team that won the cup, hence his smythe.
He still never hit 60 goals.....he also never lead the league in goals.
He hasn't finished top 10 in assists since 2011. Three total finishes from 2009 -2011. None since then. So maybe I should qualify my statement. He's been a one-trick pony since 2011.
