Ovechkin milestone thread - 850 and Beyond!

[BallardEra]

Stamkos has a chance as he's, what, 33?

Sid being 36 it depends how long he plays. He needs 150 goals. 35 a year?

I think Sid will play until age 42-43.

 

[Fantomas]

What about goals scored rankings? Raw totals between eras is next to useless as a comparison.

1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 4, 7, 9
vs
1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 5, 7

One had injuries to end his career and the other had injuries to interrupt his prime. One faced off with Gretzky the other with Ovechkin. If Stamkos is a flash, so is Bossy.

Yup, Stamkos and Bossy are pretty comparable. There's a small, very niche, group of Bossy fans on this forum who just can't face the fact that he's not some kind of generational goal scorer.

 

[norrisnick]

Yup, Stamkos and Bossy are pretty comparable. There's a small, very niche, group of Bossy fans on this forum who just can't face the fact that he's not some kind of generational goal scorer.

They have it in their head that 50 is some magical number for goals completely disregarding that the 70s through early 90s were a complete shitshow for defense and goaltending.

They can't understand that in Bossy's 10 season career there were 68 50+ goal scorers but during Stamkos' 15 season career there have been only 21, and 7 of those belong to Ovechkin.

 

[BallardEra]

Johnny Bucyk has the most career goals from age 33-40 at 274 goals.

So far after his age 33-37 seasons, Ovechkin has 215 goals. He has 3 more seasons left on his current contract. (age 38-40 seasons)

He would need 60 goals over those 3 seasons to top Bucyk's record.

Gordie Howe had 263 goals from age 33-40.

 

[Johno]

Johnny Bucyk has the most career goals from age 33-40 at 274 goals.

So far after his age 33-37 seasons, Ovechkin has 215 goals. He has 3 more seasons left on his current contract. (age 38-40 seasons)

He would need 60 goals over those 3 seasons to top Bucyk's record.

Gordie Howe had 263 goals from age 33-40.

Why the odd cut-off age? Why not 30 or 35?

 

[Bear of Bad News]

Why the odd cut-off age? Why not 30 or 35?

35 is also odd.

 

[hangman005]

35 is also odd.

I'm 32 and I'm basically a dinosaur.

 

[hangman005]

I'm 32 and I'm basically a dinosaur.

Wait I'm 33.... see the minds already starting to go.

 

[Bear of Bad News]

Wait I'm 33.... see the minds already starting to go.

The good news is that now you can start tracking your NHL goals in case someone wants to compare you to Johnny Bucyk.

 

[Toby91ca]

I think Sid will play until age 42-43.

I doubt it

 

[norrisnick]

I doubt it

What's Sid gonna do after his playing career? He might want to delay that for as long as he can Howe/Jagr style.

 

[BallardEra]

Why the odd cut-off age? Why not 30 or 35?

I was watching an older video with Friedman and Marek from December 2018. Friedman was saying he felt Ovechkin wouldn't be able to catch Gretzky and cited Bucyk's age 33-40 seasons as Ovie had just started his age 33 season.

 

[Johno]

I was watching an older video with Friedman and Marek from December 2018. Friedman was saying he felt Ovechkin wouldn't be able to catch Gretzky and cited Bucyk's age 33-40 seasons as Ovie had just started his age 33 season.

Explains the thinking then.

 

[Bear of Bad News]

Explains the thinking then.

My guess is it's of the form "Ovechkin would have to so much more than the current age 33+ record to break Gretzky's mark".

 

[BallardEra]

My guess is it's of the form "Ovechkin would have to so much more than the current age 33+ record to break Gretzky's mark".

Ovie discussion starts around the 5:35 mark:

 

[BallardEra]

Was looking at Selanne’s stats for his age 38-40 seasons.

Age 38 - 27 goals in 65 games (16 PP)
Age 39 - 27 goals in 54 games (14 PP)
Age 40 - 31 goals in 73 games (16 PP)

That’s a total of 85 goals with a goals per game pace of 0.44. (54% of his goals on the PP)

If Ovechkin matches the 85 goals of Selanne over the last 3 years of his contract then he finishes with an even 907 goals.

 

[BallardEra]

Most NHL Goals After Age 30 | StatMuse

Gordie Howe has gotten the most career goals by a player older than 30, with 383 scored.

www.statmuse.com

Gretzky only had 176 goals after the age of 30.

Ovechkin is currently at 297 goals after that age.

Gordie Howe leads the way with 383 goals.

 

[Video Nasty]

Yup, Stamkos and Bossy are pretty comparable. There's a small, very niche, group of Bossy fans on this forum who just can't face the fact that he's not some kind of generational goal scorer.

They have it in their head that 50 is some magical number for goals completely disregarding that the 70s through early 90s were a complete shitshow for defense and goaltending.

They can't understand that in Bossy's 10 season career there were 68 50+ goal scorers but during Stamkos' 15 season career there have been only 21, and 7 of those belong to Ovechkin.

And I can’t understand why either of you get so upset about the idea of Bossy being among the greatest goal scorers ever.

Forget the raw totals, forget the abundance of 50 goal seasons, forget the so-called shitshow that a player has no control over playing when they do.

During the time frame of Bossy’s career, he scored the most goals among any player. Now of course, Gretzky didn’t play in those first two seasons, yet only trailed by 30 goals while playing 120 fewer games.

Bossy scored 24.3%, 51.6%, and 55.3% more than the next closest competitors.

If we want to get really weird about it, during the 22 straight seasons that the average GPG was 3.20 or higher (1972-1973 through 1993-1994), Bossy scored the 4th most goals among all players. He didn’t play the first 5 seasons and final 7 seasons of that stretch and played 300-500 fewer games than the three players ahead of him.

How is one of the 5-10 greatest goal scorers in a 100+ year old league not a generational one? Both of you getting likes for these comments is really sad.

Ovechkin is chasing down the all-time record. Really sick of the weird desire to pull down Bossy in the meantime.

 

[YoRy]

Most NHL Goals After Age 30 | StatMuse

Gordie Howe has gotten the most career goals by a player older than 30, with 383 scored.

www.statmuse.com

Gretzky only had 176 goals after the age of 30.

Ovechkin is currently at 297 goals after that age.

Gordie Howe leads the way with 383 goals.

This is a weird statistic. In 2015, Ovechkin turned 30 years old.
After that it was 50, 33, 49, 51, 48, 24, 50, 42 = 347. Why doesn't the 15/16 season count?

 

[BallardEra]

This is a weird statistic. In 2015, Ovechkin turned 30 years old.
After that it was 50, 33, 49, 51, 48, 24, 50, 42 = 347. Why doesn't the 15/16 season count?

Looks like they're counting after that season so from age 31 season and beyond.

 

[norrisnick]

And I can’t understand why either of you get so upset about the idea of Bossy being among the greatest goal scorers ever.

Forget the raw totals, forget the abundance of 50 goal seasons, forget the so-called shitshow that a player has no control over playing when they do.

During the time frame of Bossy’s career, he scored the most goals among any player. Now of course, Gretzky didn’t play in those first two seasons, yet only trailed by 30 goals while playing 120 fewer games.

Bossy scored 24.3%, 51.6%, and 55.3% more than the next closest competitors.

If we want to get really weird about it, during the 22 straight seasons that the average GPG was 3.20 or higher (1972-1973 through 1993-1994), Bossy scored the 4th most goals among all players. He didn’t play the first 5 seasons and final 7 seasons of that stretch and played 300-500 fewer games than the three players ahead of him.

How is one of the 5-10 greatest goal scorers in a 100+ year old league not a generational one? Both of you getting likes for these comments is really sad.

Ovechkin is chasing down the all-time record. Really sick of the weird desire to pull down Bossy in the meantime.

The issue is less Bossy and exponentially more that Stamkos shouldn't be considered a flash in the pan.

The fact that generational is a largely worthless term around here is a tertiary factor at best.

 

[wetcoast]

Ovie discussion starts around the 5:35 mark:

Is MJ here really David Amber?

 

[Hippasus]

And I can’t understand why either of you get so upset about the idea of Bossy being among the greatest goal scorers ever.

Forget the raw totals, forget the abundance of 50 goal seasons, forget the so-called shitshow that a player has no control over playing when they do.

During the time frame of Bossy’s career, he scored the most goals among any player. Now of course, Gretzky didn’t play in those first two seasons, yet only trailed by 30 goals while playing 120 fewer games.

Bossy scored 24.3%, 51.6%, and 55.3% more than the next closest competitors.

If we want to get really weird about it, during the 22 straight seasons that the average GPG was 3.20 or higher (1972-1973 through 1993-1994), Bossy scored the 4th most goals among all players. He didn’t play the first 5 seasons and final 7 seasons of that stretch and played 300-500 fewer games than the three players ahead of him.

How is one of the 5-10 greatest goal scorers in a 100+ year old league not a generational one? Both of you getting likes for these comments is really sad.

Ovechkin is chasing down the all-time record. Really sick of the weird desire to pull down Bossy in the meantime.

I once did a comparison against peers analysis between Bossy and Gretzky (as well as the whole history of the NHL up to the point that I did the analysis--mid 2010s or so), and Bossy narrowly came out ahead of Gretzky. This was based on top three goal scorers over entire careers against a defined notion of average first-liner for that season. Bossy is indeed a great all-time goal scorer and belongs on the top-10 or so of goal scorers.

 

[Hippasus]

The issue is less Bossy and exponentially more that Stamkos shouldn't be considered a flash in the pan.

The fact that generational is a largely worthless term around here is a tertiary factor at best.

Yeah, that word is seriously overused and ill-defined.

 

[Toby91ca]

I once did a comparison against peers analysis between Bossy and Gretzky (as well as the whole history of the NHL up to the point that I did the analysis--mid 2010s or so), and Bossy narrowly came out ahead of Gretzky. This was based on top three goal scorers over entire careers against a defined notion of average first-liner for that season. Bossy is indeed a great all-time goal scorer and belongs on the top-10 or so of goal scorers.

Not disputing the analysis, but seems odd. Bossy played in the league for 10 years, Gretzky was in the league for 8 of those years and our scored Bossy by about 100 goals over that time period. Agree with conclusion that Bossy is one of the best though