Ovechkin milestone thread - 850 and Beyond!

[hak]

Congrats ovie. I am so happy I got to witness his career

 

[LosPollosHermanos]

cringe celebration

 

[SensFan4lyfe]

I feel like if you have the career all time numbers than you check all the boxes.

You don't get to that level by not being among the best. And longevity should absolutely be a factor. Just because of all the what if's a major one is also "Well what if their scoring fell off later on in their career and all those per game numbers massively dip?"

I just dont think he is the best i think hes up there

I think hes top 3 for sure

but id still take mario or gretzky over him

 

[SkinsFan09]

Ovi’s goals last night should not have counted as they were scored with goaltenders in the net.

Agree and we should remove all of Wayne's empty netters since he is No. 1 all time.

 

[BallardEra]

I don't think he's going after 1000.

I'd be totally shocked if he played beyond his current deal which ends after his age 40 season.

 

[Golden_Jet]

I mean I have lost I don't think Ovie is the greatest goal scorer of all time

I think he's up there

And I don't think I can lose by having an opinion

If we go by goals per game he's 7th all time

there is lots of ways I can skiew an argument in my favor.

I out him in my top 5 of

Mike Bossy
Wayne Gretzky
Mario Lemieux
Ovie
Rocket Richard

There is more to things than longevity

He is in elite conversation I dont feel the need to label him as the best

Bobby Hull, played in a low scoring era, wood sticks, no curves for part of career, 72 game seasons, first player with multiple 50 goal seasons.

 

[SkinsFan09]

I just dont think he is the best i think hes up there

I think hes top 3 for sure

but id still take mario or gretzky over him

As players 100%. Nobody would be dumb enough to argue otherwise. As goal scorers, not a chance. MAYBE Lemieux but he also played his entire prime in an absurdly high scoring era. Now I don't think it would have changed much since we saw what he did in 2000-01 when he came back at 35, but that was also alongside the best player in the world at that time Jagr.

 

[norrisnick]

I mean I have lost I don't think Ovie is the greatest goal scorer of all time

I think he's up there

And I don't think I can lose by having an opinion

If we go by goals per game he's 7th all time

there is lots of ways I can skiew an argument in my favor.

I out him in my top 5 of

Mike Bossy
Wayne Gretzky
Mario Lemieux
Ovie
Rocket Richard

There is more to things than longevity

He is in elite conversation I dont feel the need to label him as the best

Certainly. Key among them is how you play relative to your peers. Ie leading the league in goal scoring more often than anyone else. His 9x stands out among your top 5 which doesn't even include #2 in that stat (Bobby Hull).

 

[nowhereman]

I think it's time to call Ovy the best goal-scorer of all time, honestly. I think it's getting harder and harder to argue against it, especially considering how he is doing it across different eras.

I think he's been the best for a while, when you adjust for era. As good as Gretzky was, he played at a time when scoring was the highest in NHL history. OV, on the other hand, played a good chunk of his prime throughout the DPE 2.0. If you era-adjust Howe's goals, he's close – but in 450+ more games.

At this point, OV is the undisputed best by a decent margin.

 

[SensFan4lyfe]

Certainly. Key among them is how you play relative to your peers. Ie leading the league in goal scoring more often than anyone else. His 9x stands out among your top 5 which doesn't even include #2 in that stat (Bobby Hull).

Because i wouldnt put Hull in my top 5, hes top 10 for me

but his son was better

I need to a top ten list

 

[SkinsFan09]

 

[norrisnick]

Because i wouldnt put Hull in my top 5, hes top 10 for me

but his son was better

I need to a top ten list

No. Brett will say the same.

 

[SensFan4lyfe]

I think he's been the best for a while, when you adjust for era. As good as Gretzky was, he played at a time when scoring was the highest in NHL history. OV, on the other hand, played a good chunk of his prime throughout the DPE 2.0. If you era-adjust Howe's goals, he's close – but in 450+ more games.

At this point, OV is the undisputed best by a decent margin.

Not really

I gate when people pull the adjusted by era shit to make someone look better

What he did is amazing

But he didnt dominate his era like gretzky did

 

[Pengwins]

But he didnt dominate his era like gretzky did

exactly. Gretzky was the best player in the NHL for how many seasons? OV was the best for what 1 maybe 2 seasons?

 

[um]

I don't think he's going after 1000.

I'd be totally shocked if he played beyond his current deal which ends after his age 40 season.

Who knows.

1000 will be very very tempting if it's possible.

exactly. Gretzky was the best player in the NHL for how many seasons? OV was the best for what 1 maybe 2 seasons?

Three seasons.

But I don't even know why you're bringing it up. No shit Gretzky is better than Ovie.

 

[nowhereman]

Not really

I gate when people pull the adjusted by era shit to make someone look better

What he did is amazing

But he didnt dominate his era like gretzky did

No, people don't pull out the "adjust by era shit" to make someone look better. It's because scoring is drastically different between eras and it is only logical to compensate for those differences. Unless you're one of those people who thinks Bernie Nicholls is better than Crosby or McDavid because he scored more points than either while playing in the Fantasyland 1980s?

I also think you're confusing overall game with goalscoring. Of course Gretzky dominated at a level that neither OV nor anyone else has ever matched but not when it comes to goalscoring. Not only will OV likely beat Gretzky in raw totals but, when you consider the scoring environment, OV's 65 goal season is probably the best peak season (goalscoring-wise) between the two.

 

[Sinistril]

Not really

I gate when people pull the adjusted by era shit to make someone look better

What he did is amazing

But he didnt dominate his era like gretzky did

He dominated goal scoring for a far longer time than Gretzky. If he scores 40 this year, that's another longevity record he will hold. Same with 50.

 

[Bertuzzzi44]

The Great 8 has some voodoo magic on his stick, puck seems to get eyes leaving his stick and always ends up in the back of the net. Iconic Wrister and One Timer; the velocity and accuracy is incredible.

 

[AD1066]

Not really

I gate when people pull the adjusted by era shit to make someone look better

What he did is amazing

But he didnt dominate his era like gretzky did

Is it better to attempt to adjust for differences in era or pretend that a sport hasn't changed in 40 years?

Look at the goalies a guy like Bossy was shooting against:

 

[Scandale du Jour]

Who knows.

1000 will be very very tempting if it's possible.



Three seasons.

But I don't even know why you're bringing it up. No shit Gretzky is better than Ovie.

1000 would mean averaging over 50 goals for the next 3 seasons. It is not happening and if it does, Ovechkin will have to be like -100 in order to get enough chances.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Updating a comment from a couple of weeks ago, if we go by H-R's formula, Ovechkin is only about 21 goals shy of being the record-holder.

That's not to say the H-R number should be used to this level of precision, but it's a good way to get a sense of how players compare across eras. Effectively, this is the season that he should pass Gretzky if scoring rates weren't a factor.

 

[TheBeard]

It mentions shortened seasons (12-13 lockout, 19-20/20-21 Covid seasons) but something often forgotten is that Ovechkin missed the entirety of the 04-05 season.

There's no telling what he would have done that year, but given that he scored 50+ the following season it's probably fair to say his floor was 30-35.

If it wasn't for Covid and the lockout he'd break Wayne's record this season.

 

[M2Beezy]

f*** Ovechkin

Bahahaha

 

[BallardEra]

Bahahaha

That same guy accused Ovechkin of juicing.

 

[BallardEra]

Is it better to attempt to adjust for differences in era or pretend that a sport hasn't changed in 40 years?

Look at the goalies a guy like Bossy was shooting against:
View attachment 621537

How many of these guys score 50 in today's game?:

Wayne Babych
Rick Kehoe
Blaine Stoughton
Pierre Larouche
Jacques Richard
Al Secord
Mike Bullard
John Ogrodnick
Bobby Carpenter
Jimmy Carson
Hakan Loob
Bernie Nicholls
Joe Mullen
Gary Leeman
Brian Bellows