Out of Town Thread - New Year's Edition!

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Non Player Canadiens

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Jan 25, 2012
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got this from another thread but: the first commandment is literally Thou Shalt Not Kill, Jesus was 100% a sandals-wearing hippie pacifist, so I guess they must have an issue with military appreciation night jerseys too right? :laugh:

I don’t think anyone needs my support, same way I don’t need anyone else’s. Imma bang whoever I want regardless of who wears what coloured jersey.
hey, i'm glad you don't need support. good for you! you're one of the lucky ones.

other people do need support though.

anyway if wearing a special jersey during warmups for one game a year is too much, you're simply too fragile for this world :laugh:
 

holy

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May 22, 2017
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got this from another thread but: the first commandment is literally Thou Shalt Not Kill, Jesus was 100% a sandals-wearing hippie pacifist, so I guess they must have an issue with military appreciation night jerseys too right? :laugh:


hey, i'm glad you don't need support. good for you! you're one of the lucky ones.

other people do need support though.

anyway if wearing a special jersey during warmups for one game a year is too much, you're simply too fragile for this world :laugh:
Nah if you need fake validation from random athletes then you’re deffo too fragile for this world. All this rainbow nonsense is just stoking the flames of homophobia. We hit a pretty sweet spot like a decade ago where it honestly felt like nobody sincerely gave a shit, but now it’s all about parading around your sexuality like anyone cares lmao.
 

Non Player Canadiens

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Nah if you need fake validation from random athletes then you’re deffo too fragile for this world. All this rainbow nonsense is just stoking the flames of homophobia. We hit a pretty sweet spot like a decade ago where it honestly felt like nobody sincerely gave a shit, but now it’s all about parading around your sexuality like anyone cares lmao.
yeah ... in case you didn't notice, the world got way way shittier in the last 10 years. and it got way way shittier for vulnerable groups in particular. if you don't belong to or care about any of those groups I guess you can just wash your hands with your IDGAF attitude, lovely. but they do need support.

also how did you jump to "parading around your sexuality"? they're just warmup jerseys man :laugh: you're projecting something weird there
 

WeThreeKings

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I’m glad hockey players aren’t just sheepishly putting on pride jerseys. That whole movement has become insane, and at the end of the day no one needs to focus on who’s banging who. I wish that stuff would just go back to being private.

It's about inclusion in sports, loving someone has a whole lot more than just sex but also the pride community isn't just about sexual orientation, it also includes gender identity.

I don't want it to go back to being private. I want it to get out in the open and for people to evolve and grow, let people love who they love, let them be who they are, and for everyone to be included and free of discrimination everywhere. Including sport
 

Tyson

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Calgary went out this off season and retooled quickly. Hasn't worked out very well. Huberdeau the 8 million dollar 50 point players has been a huge disappointment.
 

Gaylord Q Tinkledink

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Calgary went out this off season and retooled quickly. Hasn't worked out very well. Huberdeau the 8 million dollar 50 point players has been a huge disappointment.
A lot of that is probably Sutter and Markstrom regressing.

NHL players now don't like playing in cities where it's cold. Having to be responsible for their play. Getting yelled at.

If they fire Sutter the team will likely be better next year
 
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jaffy27

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yeah ... in case you didn't notice, the world got way way shittier in the last 10 years. and it got way way shittier for vulnerable groups in particular. if you don't belong to or care about any of those groups I guess you can just wash your hands with your IDGAF attitude, lovely. but they do need support.

also how did you jump to "parading around your sexuality"? they're just warmup jerseys man :laugh: you're projecting something weird there
Which groups are you referring to??
 

417

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It's about inclusion in sports, loving someone has a whole lot more than just sex but also the pride community isn't just about sexual orientation, it also includes gender identity.

I don't want it to go back to being private. I want it to get out in the open and for people to evolve and grow, let people love who they love, let them be who they are, and for everyone to be included and free of discrimination everywhere. Including sport
This is a very delicate conversation and requires a lot of nuance but I do agree, let people love who they love and let them be who they are...but inclusion can't be selective.

I don't agree with player's who have decided to not wear the jersey, because no matter if you genuinely don't care about people's lifestyle, taking such a stance invites the kind of backlash they've received and it's not worth it if that's truly how you feel... but I also think excluding them (be it Provorov or Reimer or the Staals, etc) out of this "let people be who they want to be", is kind of like talking out of both sides of your mouth.

If we're truly preaching to let people be who they want to be, this includes them.

I would understand if the players who have opted out of wearing the jersey, had explicitly stated they're against that community, but that's not what was said and jumping to that conclusion is the opposite of being accepting and inclusive.

Personally, I feel like all of these jersey nights, no matter what they're for, are performative and frankly don't mean much beyond a league desperate to change the narrative around it's image. The NHL and the game of hockey, no matter what new ideas they come up with to encourage and convince people that it's an inclusive game/community, comes off fake to me. As a black hockey fan, I don't care how many BHM initiatives they have, I don't care if players take warmups in dashiki's, etc, change will have to happen at a much more meaningful level for me to buy that the NHL is for everyone.

Does anyone really believe that any closeted NHL player or athlete period, will feel more comfortable being who he/she is because the NHL holds pride nights? Of course not, that decision, on whether or not to come out publicly (and by publicly, I mean, outside of their jobs as NHL players) is an individual one and can't be influenced by performative measures like Pride jersey nights. Hell, i'm sure there are a lot of gay NHL players who have zero interest in making that part of their life part of public consumption/scrutiny. How can we really tie people's lifestyle choices and the makeup of their identities, to novelty performative gestures by corporations?

I mean seriously, imagine a team holding a player bobblehead night one night and then holding a BHM or First Nations or Pride night, the other?

At the end of the day, no matter where you stand on this topic...I really don't think wearing a jersey, or not, is a hill one needs to die on and It's naive to think that anyone who does wear a jersey, means they're supportive of that community. The NHL can do a lot to show support to a particular community, jersey nights, IMO, ain't it.
 

WeThreeKings

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This is a very delicate conversation and requires a lot of nuance but I do agree, let people love who they love and let them be who they are...but inclusion can't be selective.

I don't agree with player's who have decided to not wear the jersey, because no matter if you genuinely don't care about people's lifestyle, taking such a stance invites the kind of backlash they've received and it's not worth it if that's truly how you feel... but I also think excluding them (be it Provorov or Reimer or the Staals, etc) out of this "let people be who they want to be", is kind of like talking out of both sides of your mouth.

If we're truly preaching to let people be who they want to be, this includes them.

I would understand if the players who have opted out of wearing the jersey, had explicitly stated they're against that community, but that's not what was said and jumping to that conclusion is the opposite of being accepting and inclusive.

Personally, I feel like all of these jersey nights, no matter what they're for, are performative and frankly don't mean much beyond a league desperate to change the narrative around it's image. The NHL and the game of hockey, no matter what new ideas they come up with to encourage and convince people that it's an inclusive game/community, comes off fake to me. As a black hockey fan, I don't care how many BHM initiatives they have, I don't care if players take warmups in dashiki's, etc, change will have to happen at a much more meaningful level for me to buy that the NHL is for everyone.

Does anyone really believe that any closeted NHL player or athlete period, will feel more comfortable being who he/she is because the NHL holds pride nights? Of course not, that decision, on whether or not to come out publicly (and by publicly, I mean, outside of their jobs as NHL players) is an individual one and can't be influenced by performative measures like Pride jersey nights. Hell, i'm sure there are a lot of gay NHL players who have zero interest in making that part of their life part of public consumption/scrutiny. How can we really tie people's lifestyle choices and the makeup of their identities, to novelty performative gestures by corporations?

I mean seriously, imagine a team holding a player bobblehead night one night and then holding a BHM or First Nations or Pride night, the other?

At the end of the day, no matter where you stand on this topic...I really don't think wearing a jersey, or not, is a hill one needs to die on and It's naive to think that anyone who does wear a jersey, means they're supportive of that community. The NHL can do a lot to show support to a particular community, jersey nights, IMO, ain't it.

The issue, for me, is that, yes the Pride Night jersey stuff is mostly corporate virtue signaling. It's like when businesses change their logos to rainbow for pride month and then go back to cutting big bonus cheques for bigoted CEOs. I know it is performative and the reason why business partake in any of this is because it is good for their brand, not that many of them -actually- care.

However, the whole point is to show inclusion and that hockey is a place that is welcoming for these communities. Which, I'm sure, you know it hasn't been and still isn't all that inclusive or safe for black hockey players. We are still dealing with banana throws and the N word being tossed around at kids.

The thing that's grown hockey for the black community definitely isn't the black history month jerseys or recognition of that. It has been the visible success of Iginla, Subban, etc. who are stars and giving them someone they can identify with and want to be like. That type of representation matters and does more than, like you said, a jersey or whatever performative thing the NHL and other leagues put on.

The reason why this is problematic for the (I'll just use Pride here because I know the acronym has changed) Pride community is that their representation isn't so easily identifiable on a player. PK Subban is black. His representation is physical in who he is. Being gay, gender neutral, etc. is not visible. We need representation of gay hockey players but when a large portion of the league refuses to wear a jersey. A f***ing pride jersey. They are signaling loudly that, no, you aren't welcome here. We don't accept you. I can't be bothered to wear a jersey to show acceptance of you being in the arena as a fan, or on the ice as a player or teammate. The jersey doesn't mean that you agree with it, even, just that you support their right to be part of the hockey community. But these homophobes hiding behind select lines of scripture (and not abiding by literally anything else) are just homophobes and they are drawing the line. I'd rather be publicly outed as someone who will never accept who you love than perform a small trivial gesture of wearing a rainbow jersey.

Gay hockey players are going to be less likely to come out and then we lose more representation and the further away from inclusion we get.
 

Andy

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I don't know, something doesn't sit right for me when people try to justify non-recognition of a community on the grounds of religious/cultural doctrine.

The whole argument essentially claims that "I cannot respect community x because my community's cultural rules excludes these people as constituting an acceptable community." Then there is the whole: "please respect my community's right to not accept and recognize another community."

This line of reasoning not only demands that I and others respect intolerance, but that I also refrain from looking down on those who wish to practice intolerance.

In this context, replace the LGTBQ community with black people and I wonder if we have this discussion about respecting one's right to intolerance on the grounds of religiosity.

For me, you cannot claim intolerance (refusal to respect another community) while at the same time asking that others respect your intolerance. If you wish to be intolerant, you have to be prepared to live with the social consequences of doing so.
 
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417

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The issue, for me, is that, yes the Pride Night jersey stuff is mostly corporate virtue signaling. It's like when businesses change their logos to rainbow for pride month and then go back to cutting big bonus cheques for bigoted CEOs. I know it is performative and the reason why business partake in any of this is because it is good for their brand, not that many of them -actually- care.
Glad you see through the thin veil...it comes off even cheaper because well, it's the NHL. The sport in itself just isn't very inclusive, i've got 13yr old nephew who plays hockey and is considering quitting because of all the crap he gets as a mixed race kid.

The narrative around the game of hockey period, nevermind the NHL, needs to change with real actions...not these novelty jersey nights which are entirely self-serving for a league desperate to change it's image.

I find it's doing more damage than anything.
However, the whole point is to show inclusion and that hockey is a place that is welcoming for these communities. Which, I'm sure, you know it hasn't been and still isn't all that inclusive or safe for black hockey players. We are still dealing with banana throws and the N word being tossed around at kids.

The thing that's grown hockey for the black community definitely isn't the black history month jerseys or recognition of that. It has been the visible success of Iginla, Subban, etc. who are stars and giving them someone they can identify with and want to be like. That type of representation matters and does more than, like you said, a jersey or whatever performative thing the NHL and other leagues put on.
Representation is huge, you hit the nail on the head and I understand that the same applies here with the pride community, however, representation has to come in a different way, not this way IMO.

As for the inclusion part, also agreed, however are people currently being inclusive when they're calling players who have opted out of pride nights as bigots or homophobes? Again, correct me if i'm wrong, but choosing to wear a garment, or not, does not imply support or opposition.

I think of myself in this situation, again as a black hockey fan...if I played hockey, I wouldn't wear a BHM jersey not because i'm not proud of who I am but because I don't think who I am is a novelty act. It's not something I think should be marketed.


The reason why this is problematic for the (I'll just use Pride here because I know the acronym has changed) Pride community is that their representation isn't so easily identifiable on a player. PK Subban is black. His representation is physical in who he is. Being gay, gender neutral, etc. is not visible. We need representation of gay hockey players but when a large portion of the league refuses to wear a jersey. A f***ing pride jersey. They are signaling loudly that, no, you aren't welcome here. We don't accept you. I can't be bothered to wear a jersey to show acceptance of you being in the arena as a fan, or on the ice as a player or teammate. The jersey doesn't mean that you agree with it, even, just that you support their right to be part of the hockey community. But these homophobes hiding behind select lines of scripture (and not abiding by literally anything else) are just homophobes and they are drawing the line. I'd rather be publicly outed as someone who will never accept who you love than perform a small trivial gesture of wearing a rainbow jersey.
I agree with you at root - it's silly for a player, no matter how you feel on the topic, to not wear the jersey because then you're just inviting the backlash and letting others set your narrative and ultimately, it works against inclusion for all.

However it goes both ways...assuming an individual is a homophobe or a bigot because he/she chooses not to wear a garment is a leap too many make which I won't.

Although, I also think hiding behind the bible/religion is bullshit too and a cop out I mean my wife didn't make dinner for me last night, pretty sure I can find a reference in the bible that allows me to stone her if I wanted (don't worry, I won't). If you're going to stand on something, own it or else throw the jersey on and go bout' your business like you always have.


Gay hockey players are going to be less likely to come out and then we lose more representation and the further away from inclusion we get.
Hmm...not sure about that. Maybe, but I honest feel like those who are, aren't interested in coming out as hockey players. Maybe that's a decision that's personal and they want to make it away from the public eye. They also shouldn't have to feel the pressure of coming out.

Again, not saying I disagree with you, everything you said is right but we have to actually listen/hear all sides. Like I said earlier, I disagree with the explicit action of being vocal about not wearing a jersey, I also disagree with the narrative that that automatically means you're against that particular community.
 

417

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I don't know, something doesn't sit right for me when people try to justify non-recognition of a community on the grounds of religious/cultural doctrine.

The whole argument essentially claims that "I cannot respect community x because my community's cultural rules excludes these people as constituting an acceptable community." Then there is the whole: "please respect my community's right to not accept and recognize another community."

This is line of reasoning not only demands that I and others respect intolerance, but that I also refrain from looking down on those who wish to practice intolerance.

In this context, replace the LGTBQ community with black people and I wonder if we have this discussion about respecting one's right to intolerance on the grounds of religiosity.
I wrote this above - but as a black hockey fan, I couldn't careless if a player decided to opt-out of wearing BHM jersey, additionally, if I was a player...I also wouldn't wear one. Would anyone accuse me of being anti-black? Well I suppose one could, but i'm extremely proud of being so and that's why I wouldn't wear it. My history and my pride, isn't a novelty that should be re-packaged as a consumable.

If the NHL wants to promote inclusiveness as it relates to black people - how about recognizing the Canadian Colored Hockey League that actually predates the NHL, how about including some of its founders in the Hockey Hall of Fame? THis is the difference between meaningful action and performative to me.
For me, you cannot claim intolerance (refusal to respect another community) while at the same time asking that others respect your intolerance. If you wish to be intolerant, you have to be prepared to live with the social consequences of doing so.
Agreed but is wearing/not wearing a jersey, really an act of support/opposition to a particular community?

Just an honest question to encourage debate, nothing else of course.
 
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Mrb1p

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This is a very delicate conversation and requires a lot of nuance but I do agree, let people love who they love and let them be who they are...but inclusion can't be selective.

I don't agree with player's who have decided to not wear the jersey, because no matter if you genuinely don't care about people's lifestyle, taking such a stance invites the kind of backlash they've received and it's not worth it if that's truly how you feel... but I also think excluding them (be it Provorov or Reimer or the Staals, etc) out of this "let people be who they want to be", is kind of like talking out of both sides of your mouth.

If we're truly preaching to let people be who they want to be, this includes them.

I would understand if the players who have opted out of wearing the jersey, had explicitly stated they're against that community, but that's not what was said and jumping to that conclusion is the opposite of being accepting and inclusive.

Personally, I feel like all of these jersey nights, no matter what they're for, are performative and frankly don't mean much beyond a league desperate to change the narrative around it's image. The NHL and the game of hockey, no matter what new ideas they come up with to encourage and convince people that it's an inclusive game/community, comes off fake to me. As a black hockey fan, I don't care how many BHM initiatives they have, I don't care if players take warmups in dashiki's, etc, change will have to happen at a much more meaningful level for me to buy that the NHL is for everyone.

Does anyone really believe that any closeted NHL player or athlete period, will feel more comfortable being who he/she is because the NHL holds pride nights? Of course not, that decision, on whether or not to come out publicly (and by publicly, I mean, outside of their jobs as NHL players) is an individual one and can't be influenced by performative measures like Pride jersey nights. Hell, i'm sure there are a lot of gay NHL players who have zero interest in making that part of their life part of public consumption/scrutiny. How can we really tie people's lifestyle choices and the makeup of their identities, to novelty performative gestures by corporations?

I mean seriously, imagine a team holding a player bobblehead night one night and then holding a BHM or First Nations or Pride night, the other?

At the end of the day, no matter where you stand on this topic...I really don't think wearing a jersey, or not, is a hill one needs to die on and It's naive to think that anyone who does wear a jersey, means they're supportive of that community. The NHL can do a lot to show support to a particular community, jersey nights, IMO, ain't it.
The NHL still sucks and the players are still homophobe. If the players were forced by the NHL, as a contractual stand, to wear the pride jerseys, Im pretty sure any LGBTQ+ member would feel a lot better about their presence around the NHL.

You use the example of BHM, but how would you feel about the players intention if he said he doesnt want to wear a jersey because his community guidelines or whatever you wanna call them don't allign with said community? That's literally the next step in racism, segregationism. "I can't eradicate you, the best I can do is keep you out of my life."

How do you think teams and the NHL would respond to that, publicly? Of course they'd take legal actions. The player would be sanctioned. You'd feel resentment towards that player, and I would too.

Why is it different for LGTBTQ+?

One of these moments where doing your best "avocat du diable" impression isn't it, man. If you're not with us you're with them type of shit, turning a blind eye does not work in social justice.
 
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417

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The NHL still sucks and the players are still homophobe. If the players were forced by the NHL, as a contractual stand, to wear the pride jerseys, Im pretty sure any LGBTQ+ member would feel a lot better about their presence around the NHL.
I think this would have the opposite desired result...it would spread homophobia and fear of coming out a lot more.

No one, doesn't matter who or what you're fighting for or against, likes to be forced to do something.

I honestly at heart believe that any closeted NHL player isn't going to feel more comfortable coming out because the NHL has Pride jersey nights... societal dynamics are a lot more complex then that, never mind when we're talking about a testosterone-driven sport and locker room.
You use the example of BHM, but how would you feel about the players intention if he said he doesnt want to wear a jersey because his community guidelines or whatever you wanna call them don't allign with said community? That's literally the next step in racism, segregationism. "I can't eradicate you, the best I can do is keep you out of my life."
I answered this...I wouldn't care. I also wouldn't wear any BHM inspired jersey for the month of February, you going to say i'm against BHM?

I don't even recognize BHM as a thing for me because I try to celebrate my history and trace my roots almost every day of my life. It's not a thing I do during the shortest/coldest month of the year and I also would never convince myself that a bunch of white hockey players actually give a damn about BHM either just because their wearing black/red/green/yellow jerseys.
How do you think teams and the NHL would respond to that, publicly? Of course they'd take legal actions. The player would be sanctioned. You'd feel resentment towards that player, and I would too.
I have no idea how the NHL would respond to that and I wouldn't feel resentment towards that player either. I have resentment towards historical policies that have kept people of my community down...I couldn't careless if a hockey player decided not to wear a BHM jersey for warmup.
Why is it different for LGTBTQ+?
Who said it was?
One of these moments where doing your best "avocat du diable" impression isn't it, man. If you're not with us you're with them type of shit, turning a blind eye does not work in social justice.
This has nothing to do with being a devil's advocate...I actually placed myself in the scope of a black hockey fan and how I would feel if a player(s) decided to opt out of wearing BHM jersey and tried to look at it through that perspective.

I'm also looking at it through the perspective of "inclusiveness" that everyone seems to be repeating. Inclusiveness can't be selective, love is love and means understanding everyone's point of view (which of course, excludes hate speech).
 

Rapala

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Eric Staal was so bad for the Habs, one of the worst players I’ve ever seen. I really hated him as a player. And now I can hate him as a human too!
He was terrible. If we were going to get him it should have been the season immediately following our ECF. But there was no way Birdbrain and Clipper were going to get rid of Davey.
 
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Mrb1p

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I think this would have the opposite desired result...it would spread homophobia and fear of coming out a lot more.

No one, doesn't matter who or what you're fighting for or against, likes to be forced to do something.

I honestly at heart believe that any closeted NHL player isn't going to feel more comfortable coming out because the NHL has Pride jersey nights... societal dynamics are a lot more complex then that, never mind when we're talking about a testosterone-driven sport and locker room.

I answered this...I wouldn't care. I also wouldn't wear any BHM inspired jersey for the month of February, you going to say i'm against BHM?

I don't even recognize BHM as a thing for me because I try to celebrate my history and trace my roots almost every day of my life. It's not a thing I do during the shortest/coldest month of the year and I also would never convince myself that a bunch of white hockey players actually give a damn about BHM either just because their wearing black/red/green/yellow jerseys.

I have no idea how the NHL would respond to that and I wouldn't feel resentment towards that player either. I have resentment towards historical policies that have kept people of my community down...I couldn't careless if a hockey player decided not to wear a BHM jersey for warmup.

Who said it was?

This has nothing to do with being a devil's advocate...I actually placed myself in the scope of a black hockey fan and how I would feel if a player(s) decided to opt out of wearing BHM jersey and tried to look at it through that perspective.

I'm also looking at it through the perspective of "inclusiveness" that everyone seems to be repeating. Inclusiveness can't be selective, love is love and means understanding everyone's point of view (which of course, excludes hate speech).
Eh, we wont agree then, a radical approach is the only way to change systemic, interpersonal and structural biases. Figuratively squashing the enemy (or not? Heheh.) Is the way.

Being soft and allowing bigots to be bigots just allows more bigots to be bigots. As evidenced by the recent spike in bigots in the NHL.
 
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JianYang

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This is a very delicate conversation and requires a lot of nuance but I do agree, let people love who they love and let them be who they are...but inclusion can't be selective.

I don't agree with player's who have decided to not wear the jersey, because no matter if you genuinely don't care about people's lifestyle, taking such a stance invites the kind of backlash they've received and it's not worth it if that's truly how you feel... but I also think excluding them (be it Provorov or Reimer or the Staals, etc) out of this "let people be who they want to be", is kind of like talking out of both sides of your mouth.

If we're truly preaching to let people be who they want to be, this includes them.

I would understand if the players who have opted out of wearing the jersey, had explicitly stated they're against that community, but that's not what was said and jumping to that conclusion is the opposite of being accepting and inclusive.

Personally, I feel like all of these jersey nights, no matter what they're for, are performative and frankly don't mean much beyond a league desperate to change the narrative around it's image. The NHL and the game of hockey, no matter what new ideas they come up with to encourage and convince people that it's an inclusive game/community, comes off fake to me. As a black hockey fan, I don't care how many BHM initiatives they have, I don't care if players take warmups in dashiki's, etc, change will have to happen at a much more meaningful level for me to buy that the NHL is for everyone.

Does anyone really believe that any closeted NHL player or athlete period, will feel more comfortable being who he/she is because the NHL holds pride nights? Of course not, that decision, on whether or not to come out publicly (and by publicly, I mean, outside of their jobs as NHL players) is an individual one and can't be influenced by performative measures like Pride jersey nights. Hell, i'm sure there are a lot of gay NHL players who have zero interest in making that part of their life part of public consumption/scrutiny. How can we really tie people's lifestyle choices and the makeup of their identities, to novelty performative gestures by corporations?

I mean seriously, imagine a team holding a player bobblehead night one night and then holding a BHM or First Nations or Pride night, the other?

At the end of the day, no matter where you stand on this topic...I really don't think wearing a jersey, or not, is a hill one needs to die on and It's naive to think that anyone who does wear a jersey, means they're supportive of that community. The NHL can do a lot to show support to a particular community, jersey nights, IMO, ain't it.

I think this post hits all the right spots.

People can love who they want, but the gesture of wearing a coloured jersey for a few minutes feels plastic and hollow.
 

Mrb1p

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I think this post hits all the right spots.

People can love who they want, but the gesture of wearing a coloured jersey for a few minutes feels plastic and hollow.
Its just one step in an anti-bigoted lifestyle.

Corporations gives us crumbs and sadly we have to take them. Anti-racism and anti-bigotry follows an exponential curve, every small detail each way adds up quickly.
 

PhysicX

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Eh, we wont agree then, a radical approach is the only way to change systemic, interpersonal and structural biases. Figuratively squashing the enemy (or not? Heheh.) Is the way.

Being soft and allowing bigots to be bigots just allows more bigots to be bigots. As evidenced by the recent spike in bigots in the NHL.
And what radical approach would that be? This all reads good, but in practice, I don't see it having the effect you wish it does.
 
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BBQ Chicken Alert!
Feb 20, 2003
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Eh, we wont agree then, a radical approach is the only way to change systemic, interpersonal and structural biases. Figuratively squashing the enemy (or not? Heheh.) Is the way.
I guess that's the root issue...needing to agree. We don't need to agree and not agreeing doesn't necessarily imply conflict.

Well, at least not for me :thumbu:
Being soft and allowing bigots to be bigots just allows more bigots to be bigots. As evidenced by the recent spike in bigots in the NHL.
How does one go about not allowing bigots to be bigots?

Either way, I personally can't call someone a bigot who I don't know, so always careful tossing around words like that but to each his own.
 
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